I like that idea. Though it kind of would feel like, "Out of Gas," wouldn't it? Unless the whole movie was in the past after the opening scene, and they didn't intercut with the present...

pat32082 | September 20, 17:25 CET

Yeah, pat, that's what I'd go for. I think it's a great, great concept, as one of the problems I saw with Serenity was that if you're a non-fan of Firefly, I saw many audiences not invested for the first hour of the story.

This one kind tips it on it's head, and says: looks at this at the beginning, and then how did it happen, and the build up to the return to that moment.

Anyway, I love that concept. Like, a lot. If it ever happens.

gossi | September 20, 17:29 CET

I think it will. In some form or another. I'm still really curious to see what these next comics will be about, because obviously they aren't to promote a film, so Joss must have a story that needs telling.

pat32082 | September 20, 17:42 CET

I am a complete spoilerphobe when it comes to the 'verse. I barely even read the comments here (the only thing I managed to accidentally absorb was "like 'Out of Gas'").

One question for gossi and those who followed the link: was Jewel paraphrasing something Joss told her, or what was her source?

Thanks!

RBB | September 20, 18:07 CET

She said from Joss, RBB, reportedly. (I wasn't there so can't verify anythang).

gossi | September 20, 18:12 CET

no undies? yowza.

i just thought of another mal/simon story.

yamsham | September 20, 18:20 CET

Sure, gossi. She may not remember exactly--I was just curious about how directly she attributed it to JW. Thanks again. (Though now my semi-rational hopes will rise, but I yam what I yam.)

RBB | September 20, 18:21 CET

Not to be cynical, but I really don't think Serenity 2 ever happens. Joss has got a ton on his plate right now. Most we could hope for is a comic book, and the Serenity trade was kind of lame.

BoltRider | September 20, 18:25 CET

It's a nice concept but we would be very lucky to see it happen.

Simon | September 20, 18:26 CET

There sure are lots of wet blankets when it comes to more "Serenity." I mean, I'm not hoping against hope or anything, but as far as I'm concerned, as long as Joss doesn't announce one day that he never wants to touch it ever again, the possibility's always there, even if it's years away.

I don't even care if it's a movie. Unlike some, while it would be great if it was live action with the actors, to me, getting the story is all that matters.

pat32082 | September 20, 18:33 CET

It could be interesting concept wise, but maybe it's just me, but the flashback thing it's not something innovative, and it's been even overused by J.J. Abrams, in several occasions, either on Alias or even in the lastest Mission Impossible movie.

And as mentioned by pat32082, "Out of Gas" is the best example of this kind of storytelling device at it's best, and the time intercuts reminded me of Chris Nolan's "Memento".

Numfar PTB | September 20, 18:34 CET

Joss has got a ton on his plate right now.

I think, ultimately, if Universal decided to go for a sequel Joss would clear some space for it. I think this because a) Joss has said before he would. And b) he's likely contracted to anyway, as will the actors be. (For a certain amount of time).

I see loads of posts online from fans saying he's too busy to do anything, and I think that kinda looses the point, as Joss is always busy - he wrote Serenity whilst show running various TV shows and doing comics and all that joy. There's an interview with him sometime in 2003 where you can swear he's nearly having a breakdown - and I would be in that situation. But then I almost have a breakdown each time I miss the bus.

The problem, as it were, is if anybody wants to finance one. Which I've no real idea about. And it seems pretty much a loop speculating, as none of us really know.

What I will say is this: if movies aren't going to happen, which we'll kinda know next year about I suspect, I'd really love to see the possibility of books, or comics, or something. The fans would eat it up. It'd sell, if it's understood why it's going out in that fashion and it was considered canon. There would be much joy in the land. And I would call it this land. Now die. Rahhhhhhhhhh!

gossi | September 20, 19:01 CET

Hmm. I just realized what the real title of Serenity 2 would be, though I'd be surprised if some wag hadn't posted this somewhere before: "Seven of Nine."

RBB | September 20, 19:02 CET

Sean not wearing any undies....

...

Sorry was kind of , um distracted there, (see mal/simon video thread below, or not if you want to remain innocent).

And, in terms of not seeing Serenity, I agree with Pat(numbers), yes Joss has a fair amount on his plate, but surely he will complete those projects at some point and hopefully he will become a bigger name because those movies will rake in 100's of millions(I can dream). He might be able to return to Serenity and convince the Studio to greenlight it ,or the other way around, they beg him to come do Serenity 2(again I can dream). I for one will remain hopeful.

And in terms of the script, what I was thinking, it could be events way way after the 1st movie, and the sequence of "backstory" scenes will start way before the 1st movie, and go up to right before the shocking scenes, covering the events in the 1st movie as well(hell it would save money to just to use the same clips). I loved "out of gas", and the non-linearity of it was intriguing, but I think for it to be accessable to a mainstream audiance it will have to follow in the linear order. Memento was awesome, however, that wasn't mainstream I think, and it required alot of concentration. I had a headache after that movie!

Anyways back to the importmant matter of Sean and no undies....

EDIT: saw RBB's post, lol that is hilarious. Although I was thinking more along the lines of "Serenity 2: No Undies for Simon Tam". ok ok I will stop now...

[ edited by kurya on 2006-09-20 17:07 ]

kurya | September 20, 19:04 CET

No undies on a motherfucking space ship.

Yep, it's still funny to me.

gossi | September 20, 19:14 CET

Serenity/Brokeback mountain 2: Commando Cowboys in space.

ok... I should go now.

kurya | September 20, 19:26 CET

Obviously not one that involves a friendly instance of laundromat confusion over the tighty whiteys...

jclemens | September 20, 19:27 CET

"Commando Simon" should be the next action figure. Well, that and "Syphilis Xander". Definitely a gap in the market.

It's great that people can keep the sequel flame burning for years (and years, and years) if necessary but personally I can't expend that kind of hope over such a long period (I have to save some for Scotland getting past the group stage in a World Cup ;).

Not to say i'm giving up completely, just that it's waaaay at the back of my mind and if it happens, great. Better than great. If not, well we got one cracking film and there'll be more comics, books etc. i'm sure so the 'verse won't just die off. And Joss will hopefully keep getting opportunities to produce new work and new characters to amaze us with in whichever medium (and then new ways to kill them and/or make their lives a misery ;).

Saje | September 20, 19:35 CET

"Mission Impossible III" was the first thing I thought of, too. Although I'm not sure how the writer extrapolated that Book and Wash could be in the movie. The idea floated by Jewel sounds like a full-fledged sequel (not prequel) -- just with a shocking yet vague bit of the climax shown first for dramatic purposes.

rbt | September 20, 19:56 CET

As long as the beginning doesn´t leave everyone dead (which could happen, cause hey it´s Joss), I like the concept. But then I don´t want to get my hopes up. At the moment the chance of a new movie are really slim.

But no undies... well Sean for sure knows how to give the fans fantasies.

Kessie | September 20, 20:03 CET

And material for fanfic writers.

kurya | September 20, 20:06 CET

Joss Whedon knows how to multi-task better than anyone I know. He is the master. So I don't worry too much about him being able to juggle WW, a few comic books, and Serenity 2.

And to add fuel to the rumor mill, it was announced at the AzBrowncoats shindig last night by someone whose son works as a prop maker in Hollywood that most of the prop makers from the movie have been called back to work. Now, does it mean it's for S2 or for another movie along the same genre? I don't know. Until Joss says so it's just a rumor. But I can hope.

madmolly | September 20, 20:07 CET

I would guess another movie in the same genre, since Joss hasn't even written the script yet for S2!

kurya | September 20, 20:15 CET

Probably not, but then who knew he had "Goners" lying around?

Nebula1400 | September 20, 20:19 CET

I want an animated series.

Cheaper to produce, easier to schedule the actors (most of whom have done voicework) around their other commitments, it gets us back to long slow story arcs, and the SFX budget drops.

As long as writers of the right caliber are used and they avoid the "cartoony" style, I could see this working. Several flans have already made designs for characters...

C. A. Bridges | September 20, 20:31 CET

I find it hard to consider livejournal as any sort of valid news source.

war_machine | September 20, 20:33 CET

Nebula: Joss did! Hopefully.

Chris; if they couldn't get an animated series together for Buffy - which is literally about as good a match as you are going to get - I don't see it happening for Firefly (no kid audience etc).

war_machine; I have come across the person who posted that LJ entry. Plus, I know personally a load of people who were there. They speakuth the truthuh.

[ edited by gossi on 2006-09-20 18:35 ]

gossi | September 20, 20:34 CET

Don't want it for kids. Want it as a prime-time drama series. Let SciFi start showing some science fiction for once and head off their slide into WWF affiliation. Or put it online where all the fans are anyway. Sell it through iTunes, package it as a DVD set, whatever works. Networks are panicky about viewers migrating away from broadcast television, use this as an experiment for new delivery systems.

The argument, of course, is that there's no market and people won't watch an hour-long dramatic cartoon. Of course, they knew no one wanted to watch a prime time animated sitcom based on some shorts from Tracy Ullman's show, either...

C. A. Bridges | September 20, 20:48 CET

I'm a cynic and also a realist.



See fate of the previous Serenity animated venture. And also the fate of Buffy: Animated as well.

Simon | September 20, 20:53 CET

I think if there was a sequal, it would prove to be an even bigger marketing headache than the first one. "Serenity 2: The sequal to the film you didn't see, based on the tv series you never watched".

Jona | September 20, 21:07 CET

More like... "Serenity 2: The sequal to the film you didn't see in the theater, based on the tv series you never watched until a friend loaned you the DVDs".

jclemens | September 20, 21:36 CET

Hehehe, exactly jclemens.

kurya | September 20, 21:47 CET

The things standing in the way of getting Serenity Animated off the ground are huge. Just to depress everybody:

- You'd need to wrestle (and pay for) the rights from 20th Century Fox. Probably. Or from Universal.

- You have no child market. This is a huge problem. Things like Star Wars animated went for the kids market as it's where the animated money is mostly made.

- You probably want to employ the current actors for the character voices, whose agents will want to negoiate decent rates (which is both their right and responsiblity).

- The Firefly brand and fan base is nowhere near as strong as, say, Star Wars or Star Trek.

- Actually convincing the fans that the Serenity Animated isn't some kind of Jar-Jaresque cartoon may prove difficult. There's a lot of stigma.

- You'd need a decent show runner and a couple of good writers. They cost.

- I'd still be fairly expensive in terms of other animated shows, if you wanted it to look decent.

At the end of the day, Buffy Animated had a worldwide well known franchise, a target base of kids (+teens+audiences), big studio backing who believed in the franchise, no licensing worries, Joss and experienced team of writers on board, along with most of the cast. And it still got ditched for cost reasons as nobody would pick it up to air it.

There's two options I think may possibly work: DVD premiere, or Sci-Fi miniseries. Or Universal doing another movie.

Books would definitely work, if you have decent writers and a way (and time) to oversee it properly. I'm sure most people will agree, though, that'd be a bit of a last resort. I'd love to hear some of the actors getting together to read a Joss penned novel audiobook. Like, a lot. It'd be quite the format change, though: goodbye visual, hello radio.

[ edited by gossi on 2006-09-20 21:30 ]

gossi | September 20, 23:28 CET

You mean go way of hitchhikers guide to the galaxy? But in reverse? *gasp* But how will they sneak in Simon with no undies???

kurya | September 20, 23:54 CET

But how will they sneak in Simon with no undies???

Simon, how do you feel going undieless today? It'll be for artistic reasons.

gossi | September 21, 00:00 CET

With regards to an "Serenity, The Animated Series", there are animated shows out there for an adult audience. I am in the middle of watching Spawn, the HBO animated series. It is definitely not geared towards children.

I don't know how many Spawn fans there are out there, but I'd like to think that more people would watch a Serenity animated series, than watched Spawn. And Spawn aired for 3 seasons, with a 4th in the works (although it looks like it is delayed due to differences).

menachem | September 21, 00:08 CET

I love that Serenity 2 idea. Sure, it's not a new concept. In fact, BSG does it all the time. But in Joss' hands it'll no doubt be quite amazing. Want. More. Serenity. NOW. I still have hope. Contracts haven't expired yet.

electricspacegirl | September 21, 00:15 CET

What if they aren't actually dead? What if it starts out with a shocking moment that seems to leave everyone dead, and then they backtrack, tell us how they got to that point, and in the end revealing they're not really dead at all (for whatever reason). That would be cool.

electricspacegirl | September 21, 01:07 CET

I want a DVD cover to match my original. Serenity 2: Llama Boogaloo.

WhoIsOmega? | September 21, 01:15 CET

yes, joss has a lot on his plate. busy, busy man. after "wonder woman" and "goners" he has to start working on getting the film version of "wicked" together.

oh wait...that's in my dreamland. but i'll just keep on suggesting it until it happens :)

yamsham | September 21, 01:24 CET

ElectricSpaceGirl, that has to be one of the most considerate comments i've ever seen. Thanks for the inviso-thought but I reckon it'd be hard to spoil us for an idea that will likely never see the light of day and may or may not even be the plot anyway, especially under a post with an explicit spoiler tag ;-).

I agree though that the shocking moment could well be the entire crew dying and/or destruction of the ship (it's the most logical big shock) which may or may not end up being true. Can't see too many ways Joss could actually show them dying but still have some honest way of not having them die though. Time travel maybe ? Alternate universes ? Both seem sort of "big sci-fi" ideas for Serenifly to me.

Saje | September 21, 01:25 CET

Actually, the first thing I asked myself was, did Jewel let this slip because there's not so much pressure to keep things secret anymore, as in, the likelihood of a movie-theatre movie is fading? The second thing I asked myself was, why do I know as much about Sean's and Nathan's underwear preferences as about my own?

(need to scrub out brain after the past few days @ Whedonesque) ;-)

But I really, really like gossi's possible forms for more Serenifly: DVD, Sci-Fi miniseries, audiobook, radio (well, actually, dude, there's this new thing called MP3s, but, yeah, I get the point, radio drama -- I'm feelin' ya!), movies of course. I'm just thinking the first 4 are more likely than another BDM. And, sure, canon comics, but I do like it when those actors are telling the story.

And, finally, Pun/Snark of the Day Award goes to RBB for Seven of Nine! Followed by gossi for "No undies on a motherf***ing plane"! Well done, all, well done. ;-)

billz | September 21, 01:34 CET

I've never read the comics, but the first season of the HBO Spawn animated series was excellent. Parts of Season 2 were good as well, though the series gradually declined in quality with a pretty weak movie acting as Season 3. Many plotlines unresolved. The new Spawn Animated project is apparently separate from the HBO series, though it may fit with it since they're not re-doing Spawn's origin story.

HBO isn't as much of an experimental up-and-comer as they used to be, so I don't feel they'd take a risk on a Firefly animated series. Their Spawn series wasn't an anomaly though, MTV was doing a lot of indie cartoons at the time as well. That era of adult animation being readily available on TV is long gone though and I doubt we'll see a resurgence unless they create a specialty digital channel for it (that is willing to not just air a ton of imported Japanese anime).

Simon said:
"See fate of the previous Serenity animated venture. And also the fate of Buffy: Animated as well."

The Serenity animated at least ended up as the three-issue comic book mini-series and gave us as close as we'll ever get to more of Firefly Season 1 (that may've even been more or less what was planned as the first season's finale, dunno. That's what I assumed when I read it, but unless Joss has confirmed, it could've easily been our February sweeps arc instead). I wonder if the Buffy Animated will ever end up in comic form, or if they'll keep those scripts under wraps just in case.

Kris | September 21, 02:49 CET

Actually, Saje, I was protecting people who are reading the thread instead of the article, not wanting to be spoiled for what is said in the article about Serenity 2. My comment gave it away, so I was just being careful.

[ edited by ElectricSpaceGirl on 2006-09-21 00:57 ]

electricspacegirl | September 21, 02:56 CET

I do like the concept. Both The Usual Suspects and Eternal Sunshine(2 of my favorite movies) both use it to an extent.

And if anyone can pull it of while making it fresh is Joss. Though I don't see why Wash and Book would be in it if it were to take place after the first movie. Unless the event was set in motion during or before the first movie.

flightofserenity | September 21, 04:59 CET

Sez billz: "And, finally, Pun/Snark of the Day Award goes to RBB for Seven of Nine!"

Thanks, billz. I guess it is snarky. I originally thought of putting a sad face or [sob] or something, but decided to let the glibby speak for itself. There's some irony in the snarkiness, as I kinda piteously want more 'verse more than I want any other entertainment. [queue George Duning music]

Edit: All this while skimming all the comments and still remaining spoiler free. How does he do it?

[ edited by RBB on 2006-09-21 09:04 ]

RBB | September 21, 11:02 CET