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February 16 2007

Defining The 'Buffy The Vampire Slayer' Effect. SyFy Portal equates the reaction of non-viewers to Battlestar Galactica to those of people who judge(d) "Buffy" on the movie or the name alone.

"I use the Joss Whedon series "Buffy" as an example because it describes how I allowed nothing more than a name to rob me of months and almost years of television viewing pleasure, simply because I had the wrong mindset."

He pretty much told the story of how I started watching Buffy. I watched the pilot when it aired originally. Thought it wasn't for me, and picked up again when FX began to air it.
What a familiar story. I avoided BtVS during its entire run because of course I was too smart to watch something named "Buffy." It was a roommate who converted me years later. And like an idiot - a genuine, honest-to-goodness fool of a Took - I let the same thing happen with Firefly, only to kick myself hard and with both feet after viewing the DVDs. (helped make up for it by seeing Serenity many times in the theater)

Nowadays when I try to coax people into watching BSG, I start with two things: "It's not what you think it is," and "Did you by any chance like The West Wing?"
I was the same with Buffy. I avoided it, because I thought it would be a kids show. Then I was on holiday and had run out of things to read, and I borrowed a couple of Buffy novels from my brother, which were actually episodes from the first series. I got home, bought the box set, and the rest of my love affair with Whedon's work is now deeply ingrained.
Vaguely remembered the Buffy film (and didn't think too highly of it) but the promos caught my attention (must've had some humour in them cos I remember thinking "That looks funnier than the movie") and I watched Buffy from first broadcast on the BBC. Interestingly (well, sorta ;) I watched it with 5 other people but was the only one to tune in the following week (though it wasn't really a big sci-fi/fantasy fan group in fairness).

Usually i'll give a show a chance based on the premise and/or promos and lastly on the title (though it might be the title that catches my eye initially and leads to me finding out the premise).

I'd have thought personally that anyone wondering if BSG 2003 would be like the old one would be pretty quickly disabused of the notion after seeing trailers for it. And if not then, just watching for 20 minutes (or up to when 6 breaks the baby's neck in the mini-series) would be a real convincer that this ain't yer Daddy's 'Battlestar Galactica'.

(also, much as it might have taken him off Joss' Christmas card list, Buffy the movie hardly ended Donald Sutherland's career. Whatever you think of him, the guy's an outstanding actor with a long and varied list of credits, he can take the odd duffer on his CV and survive. Plus, i'd never thought of Denmark as being a neighbour to England, clearly the Danes think different ;)
I didn't watch Buffy because of its name. My sister sat me down and practically forced me to watch it. Funny that this article came up because a few weeks ago, I told my sister (the same one who forced me to watch Buffy) to watch Battlestar Galactica, and she said that she wouldn't ever watch anything named "Battlestar Galactica". Her loss.
I think I played it smart when I got a tape of the show (I lived in a town that didn't have the WB when "Buffy" first started), then saw the movie. That way, I knew right away they got it right the second time.
I'm always interested in reading how others came to Buffy. My experience was similiar yet slightly different. I was actually intrigued when I heard the title of the movie. Watched it when it was on HBO, but I couldn't even finish, it was so bad.

When I heard it was being revived for television, I laughed. Although I read many positive reviews during Season 1, I couldn't bring myself to watch it in fear of mocking from others.

Fast forward 5 years. I caught "Tough Love" one day and had to tune in next week to see what happened since they sort of left the episode in an interesting place. Once I got to "The Gift", that was it. It sealed the deal, I was hooked. Mocking be d*mned, I didn't care who knew. Here's a show that really touched me like no other and I regretted not being there from the beginning. I found out about FX and was lucky to be almost caught up when Season 6 started on UPN. There's still no show, or even movies for that matter, that affects me like Buffy.

I'm reading many good reviews on BSG, I plan to Netflix it.
Growing up in a house where tv was usually PBS and occaisionally the the SciFi Channels, I don't remember when I first heard my classmates mentioning Buffy. I do remember that a friend tried incredibly hard to get me to watch a tape of OMWF, and (here comes the refrain), I choked on the idea because who could imagine anything good with a name like "Buffy the Vampire Slayer"? (And I hadn't even heard of the movie.)

It was only after being taken to see Serenity and subsequently obsessing over Firefly that I was willing to give Buffy a chance. And when I talked to my friend about OMWF again -- well, "sheepish" doesn't begin to describe it.
Whenever this comes up, I am always reminded of this scene from "End of Days":

GUARDIAN: You pulled it out of the rock. I was one of those who put it in there.
BUFFY: What is it?
GUARDIAN: A weapon. A scythe. Forged in secrecy for one like you
who— I’m sorry. What’s your name?
BUFFY: Buffy.
GUARDIAN: No, really.
Buffy merely shrugs and the Guardian continues.

What's amazing is that people DO let the name of the series influence their decision to watch. I have forced a few people to watch, yes forced and guess what? They love it too.
For some whacky reason I LOVE the name of this show. Buffy the vampire slayer. I say it with all the pride in the world.
When asked if the drawlings on my office wall are Buffy the vampire slayer, I say, why yes they are. I'm a proud Buffy fan. I also mention three people to these dilusional nay sayers. Joss Whedon, Sarah Michelle Gellar and David Boreanaz.
Finally after trying to convince these people of the error in their thinking I just throw out a bet.
I bet you can't get through the first and second season without being as hooked as I am. I take that one step further and offer a hundred dollars IF they can get through the first two seasons without morphing into a Buffy fan. I haven't lost my money yet. :)
I'm kinda the same but opposite.

I saw Buffy the movie at the cinema on release and love love LOVED it. And I still do, totally unapologetically. It has the best death scene ever filmed and I totally fell in love with Kristy Swanson. When the series started I took one look at it and thought "That's not my Buffy."

It wasn't until seasons 4 and 5 when I started watching the odd episode if it was on whilst channel flicking, even then only half-heartedly. Season 6 was the first one that I went out of my way to watch, and I soon started loving it and now have all the seasons on DVD.

But I still prefer Kristy :)
Actually it's not all that surprising, there is a book called "Words that Work" that is all about word usage mostly from a marketing perspective, commercial and political. However, it also describes a general judgementalness we have for certain words, questions, and phrases. So it's not surprising when people will not read or watch something based on title alone. I know plenty of people who never saw Firefly or Serenity because they thought the title sounded strange (putting it kindly) but after a time and an almost 'Clockwork Orange' type viewing, they actually liked it. It kind of like Mikey from the Life cereal ads. Which brings us back to the bigger issue, as an experiment which is what the marketing people should do, is put episodes online in 15 min segments without the show's name just the people who are in it and see what happens. People might be more inclined to watch a show based on the actors in it than the title, but if they hear the title first that might trump whose in it.
The title made me want to see the original movie. I thought it was funny. But for some reason I didn't get around to seeing it at the theatre. When I did finally see it, I was pretty disappointed (I thought Paul Reubens was the only one who got it) and that made me have the same reaction as Sunnycide (They made a show out of that? They'll make a show out of anything.). But after three years of hearing the positive buzz from people I thought were smart with great senses of humor, I gave it a shot. My first ep was the summer airing of Earshot. Been a Whedonite ever since.
I seem to be the only one who doesn't like BSG and it's not because of the name.

I've tried to watch it many times - I don't think I've made it through a whole episode yet.

It just doesn't hold my attention at this place and time in my life, that's all.

And I must be the exception that proves the rule,'cause give a show a quirky title and I'll give it a go just to see what it's about.
I guess I'm an anomaly because I don't much care what a show's called or who's in it to watch -- but I do listen very closely to reviews. The only reason I didn't see BtVS from the start was because we simply didn't have the WB where I was and I didn't get cable.

However I do understand how a promo can completely turn you off to something even though it's wonderful. My clearest example would be "Chicken Run." I still remember sitting in a theater, seeing the trailer and thinking it was one of the stupidest things I'd ever seen. I literally wondered who would ever go see that. Later when it was released though there were a lot of positive reviews so I did see it and I loved it (and later watched the Wallace and Grommit series). So I could see people giving Buffy a shot and for whatever reason seeing an episode that didn't click at all.

The Buffy name effect is pretty well known though. I wonder what the reasons are for people not tuning in to "Angel"?
'Angel' wouldn't be included in the Buffy Effect, under the definition of the name I provided ...

The Buffy Effect is when a show or movie is either given too much attention or not enough attention based on a previous project with the same name.

It's not very common, as you don't always see remakes (except in the late 1990s). You could love the Buffy movie, and because of that, were excited about the Buffy series, but was disappointed. Or you could've hated the Buffy movie, and then decided not to tune in to the series because you think it's going to be like the movie.

Angel didn't have a previous project with the same name that could affect that, so it technically wouldn't apply.

The whole point of the discussion is that Battlestar Galactica is getting the same treatment. People think of the 1978 series, and it stops them from watching the new series. But like the Buffy series over the movie, the new BSG is vast superior to the old BSG.

Oh, and the Donald Sutherland end of career statement was just a joke. =P
I think it's funny that a lot of people posting here seem to have disregarded Buffy as garbage TV (I know I did) until forced to watch it by a friend or something. I didn't watch it until 2005 when I was studying abroad in Italy and my roommate forced me to watch Season 1. It's funny, though, because now I would consider myself an even bigger fan than he is. I wonder if our initial rejection of Buffy has caused a lot of us to "overcompensate" and become a bit fanatical about the whole show. I know that's the case with me at least :)
I was young enough to be able to watch Buffy from the start without any preconceptions, and found the first season a fun, gripping watch. As the show progressed, I kind of grew up with it and began to mature with the show. As time went on I became more aware of its depth and brilliance.

With Battlestar, the very name conjured up images of some type of silly sub-Star Wars romp, even though I hadn't ever seen any of the original series. However I kept hearing so many good things about it on the Internet, particularly here at Whedonesque, so it didn't take me long to check it out, and I have since bought the miniseries and first two seasons which I am really enjoying.

I can also remember being reluctant to watch Alias because I thought it was just going to be silly fluff with gratuitous shots of Jennifer Garner in skimpy costumes. The latter might be a tiny part of the show, but it is also so much more than that, many great performances and stories that I might have missed had I not happened to catch it on TV once and enjoyed it so much.

So I can understand why people may be reluctant to watch things like Buffy or Battlestar simply because of the name or preconceptions they may have about it. I can imagine something as brilliant as Veronica Mars putting people off simply by the numerous comparisons to Buffy that have been made (which makes you think of Charmed) or the unusual premise. But again you would really be missing out on something special.

I have decided that any time a friend of mine with good taste recommends something I am initially dismissive of, I should just give it a chance because there is so much good work out there that could be easily overlooked.
Michael Hinman definitely has my number: I disliked the Buffy movie and didn't watch BtVS on TV for that reason (oh, and Iowa didn't get the WB for the longest time, and never got UPN). It really wasn't until FX started to carry the show during my dinner hour; everytime I would channel surf by and see Anthony Stewart Head explaining something earnestly I would stop thinking "Oh, it's Lord Peter Wimsey!". The humorous dialoge would keep me watching even after my mistake was obvious.
Similarly I had felt that the original Battlestar Galactica was a big military snooze fest and it wasn't until I heard about the strong female characters my friend's loved that I tuned in to BSG.
I also enjoy these "How I Started Watching" stories. I actually started watching Buffy from the pilot premiere, having seen a print ad in a comic. I had seen the movie (and thought it was silly fluffy fun, perfectly suited for my thirteenth birthday slumber party or whenever I watched it) but the ad was all dark and interesting-looking. I was mostly curious to see how they'd make the concept into a TV show.

So I watched... and was hooked by the end of the teaser. I got my dad to start watching by the end of the first season and my mom and sister early in the second. So everyone in my immediate family is a Buffy and Angel fan, actually. My dad is still trying to get my mom to watch Firefly though (odd she hasn't yet... she did see Serenity.)

As for names, well, my favorite show before BtVS came on the air was a little anime series called Sailor Moon. And that one you had to get past the name AND a lot of the visuals AND the bad dubbing to find the great story.
I was 9 when I first saw Buffy, back when it first started.I cant quite remember what made me watch it, it was on with two other new programs:robot wars and rex the runt, it was the first time i watched an entire evening of television that wasn't a cartoon or friends.
I guess I'm in the minority. I wanted to check out Buffy for years on the recommendation of my brother, because it sounded like a cool supernatural soap opera. I never did because I didn't get that channel on my TV. When the show switched networks, I was finally able to watch, but kept forgetting about it until the summer after season six.

I also never underestimated the new BSG, although I wish someone had told me how epic and heartwrenching it was so I could have gotten on the bandwagon earlier.
I don't remember hearing about Buffy airing on T.V. I just remember channel surfing and seeing an episode from season 1. It was the one where Xander joins the swim team. I remember watching it and thinking this is ridiculous.

And I kept watching.
You know what would be a good, clear name for a show that wouldn't turn people off and might make people want to watch it?


(Also, "Sports Night" is another show that suffered from an off-putting name, despite being a wonderful show.)
Yes, perhaps the audience would respond even better if they renamed it Good looking people in cars driving in a race for money

And to be quite honest, if it weren't for Fillion, Acker, and Minear's involvement I doubt the premise of this show would interest me at all.

[ edited by kerfuffle on 2007-02-16 21:09 ]
That's true, actually, Kerfuffle. I'm sure the pitch was (and the general first impression will be) "Lost with cars." And that doesn't sound that exciting.

But my point was, for the general public who isn't looking for the the next "Buffy," "Drive' is a pretty straightforward, lets-you-know-whatcher-gettin' kind of name.
I didn't star watching Buffy until '04 when FOX started showing reruns after the NASCAR races. After the first two weeks I would get mad when the race ran over, because they would cut in to Buffy. The solution for this was of course renting all the seasons from the library six times and losing many hours of sleep watch them.
No, I will not explain the reason I adore "BtVS". If you must ask, you're in the wrong room.
And then there was this bit from "The Wish"

Xander: Weird thing: girl kept talking about Buffy. 'Gotta get Buffy here.' Isn't that what they called the Slayer?

Willow: Hmm. Buffy. Ooo. Scary.

Xander: Someone has to talk to her people. That name is striking fear in nobody's hearts.

The Buffster's name has provided endless hours of amusement, both directly, and somewhat more obliquely. From "Tabula Rasa":

BUFFY: ... Oh, that's sweet, but I think I can name myself... I'll name me... Joan.
DAWN: Ugh!
BUFFY: What? Did you just 'ugh' my name?
DAWN: No! I just ... I mean, it's so blah. Joan?
BUFFY: I like it. I feel like a Joan.

I love you all like family, but I cannot bring myself to tell my "How-I-Started-Watching-Buffy" story again on here; I've just done it too many times. Suffice to say I was lucky enough to watch it from the beginning, and if names had been particularly off-putting to me, I probably would never have gotten to enjoy most of my favourite things - including BSG and my partner. Buffy reinforced the knowledge that one must never hold a bad movie against a potentially life-altering TV show or a wonderful writer.
Honest-to-gods, Madhatter, if I knew what the heck you meant by your "Ahem" there would probably be a way I could use that skill to make money.
First episode of Buffy I ever saw was the one with the teacher who could turn her head all the way around (Teacher's Pet). Channel surfing. I kept watching even though my family thought I was mad. Missed a lot of episodes because of the bad timing of the show for me (and because I had a crappy VCR). By the third season it was an obsession, everybody knew not to bother me during an episode.
Sadly even now most people I know think Buffy is a stupid show, because how could a show called Buffy the Vampire Slayer be good?
QG- Perhaps a secular Amen? ;) I started watching Buffy from the beginning with no knowledge of the movie. I was in high school and was interested as soon as I saw the female-centric promo. It just wasn't very often that I saw my own gender figure so prominently in a saving-the-world type scenario. Show me a girl who kicks ass and I'm there.
BSG on the other hand, was influenced by the fifteen minutes I had seen of the original- that pretty much made the new version a no. Until late one night I was channel surfing and landed on an episode. Obviously the channel surfing promptly ended.
Beyond being influenced by its past incarnation- I do think many potential viewers might be turned off by the name itself. I have received many strange looks when talking about BTVS and BSG. I mean come on- say them out loud, they're a step outside of ordinary, which I think makes many people doubtful (perhaps scared). I love the names- but I think it doesn't do the shows any favors in the long run.
I dunno, sci-fi/fantasy shows tend to have slightly wacky titles. If you like sci-fi you pretty quickly tend to discount titles as an effective means of judging stories (how about "Mona Lisa Overdrive" or one of my favourite sci-fi stories of all time "Unstable Orbits in the Space of Lies". And if you're not intrigued by "I Have no Mouth and I Must Scream" then you're probably just unintriguable ;). Agreed though, BtvS and BSG are a step outside the ordinary, precisely that in fact.

QuoterGal, ah, go on. Go on, go on, go on. Go on, go on, go on. Go on though. You know you want to ;).

(and fair play SyFyMike, a joke's a joke. Joss may well be sitting thinking "If only it'd ended that bugger's career" ;)
Well, I wasn't put off by the name. I was put off by the lousy television reception I got before I decided cable was worth paying for. I had actually seen about 5 minutes of the movie, when a room-mate rented it and I came in in the middle. I thought it was a clever idea. I'd always been intrigued by the vampire mythos and thought making the "van Helsing" character a Valley girl was funny. What I didn't get was how it could be more than a one-joke conceit though, so when I heard it had been made into a television series I was surprised. But then I started hearing about how INTELLIGENT a show it was.

Now, what I love about the title is that, like so much of the content, it's a twist. You think you know from the title what you're getting - you think you know what the name "Buffy" signifies - but you don't. Right from the start Buffy isn't the SoCal girl you're expecting her to be.

And hey, Saje, reaching back there for the Harlan Ellison reference. Oddly, I was just thinking about that story yesterday. For probably the first time in 20 years. Synchonicity strikes again.
*loud histrionic sigh*

*smooches Saje on the top of his punkin' haid in a Bugs Bunny-like way*

*sits down in rocking chair, reaches for her cigarettes, takes a sip of absinthe, and begins*

Gather 'round, children, and I will tell you a tale. A long, long story, which fortunately for all concerned, has no math of any kind whatsoever in it.

Once upon a time, many many years ago, when QuoterGal was much younger and had many less wrinkles and only one chin, Buffy the Vampire Slayer was scheduled for mid-season on the WB.

QuoterGal had only a few years prior purchased a television machine, which she used primarily for watching MST3K, The Simpsons, South Park, and movies on TCM. She spent most of her free time with her nose in a book. The scheduling of what appeared to be a teen show made not the slightest blip on her radar.

Many years prior to that, QuoterGal had gone to school for acting, and been a baaaddd non-union and unrepresented actor with almost no credits of the kind you would care to share with anyone, and was cast mostly in Equity-waiver plays that could make your eyes bleed and your ass squirm just thinking about them years later, and consequently had many friends of the acting persuasion. She wasn't proud of it, but there it was.

One day one of those actor-friend-turned-minister types (you know the kind) called up and said, "My friend is in that Buffy show that's starting. We'll have to check it out."

QuoterGal sighed histrionically, as she is wont to do, and nothing can cure her of it, and went on to that new thing called the information superhighway to read about it. There was one website she could find, owned by WB, called and she read about the show - her friend's bio wasn't even up yet - and she could tell only that it was going to be about a vampire slayer named Buffy and that there would be actors in it, acting out what some writers had written.

She sighed again, histrionically, annoying everyone within a 2-mile radius.

She and her partner tuned in for the pilot and saw that the friend had a decent-sized role, which was good for her, and they watched the whole thing and were surprised at its intelligence and feisty attitude.

QuoterGal distinctly remembers saying to her partner: "I like this show. It's intelligent and has a feisty attitude."

They tuned in next week, and the next, and so on and so forth - at one point QuoterGal remembers fearing that it was going to degenerate into a teen romance show, which would not have kept her enthralled - but she need not have feared. The show delivered and surprised and by the episode "Angel" she was a fervent-but-closeted admirer and tuned faithfully in every week. She didn't know why, but she was embarassed about liking this "kid's show."

Then one day, she let slip to another friend that she may, at one time or another, have watched part of an episode or something, and the friend allowed as how he watched it too and thought it was nifty-neato. So she started dropping little hints or snares to see if anyone else she knew was watching it, and lo! and likewise behold! most of them were.

QuoterGal found that reassuring - though it was sad that she needed that groupthink to feel more comfortable watching what was, in retrospect, one of the standout shows of this or any other decade. But QuoterGal was a bit of an intellectual snob, among other things, and thought most popular entertainment was revolting and pandering and the "circus" part of "bread and circuses" so it took her a while to realize that she could use her taste and discrimination in these media as well as her beloved books and find something as worthwhile as Sense and Sensibility or Little Dorrit on this tube of the boob.

Unfortunately, now QuoterGal is not only hooked on the works of Joss Whedon, but having cried most heartily at the end of every Joss Whedon series, finds herself scouting the TV schedule to see what else of merit may be on, and while the term "must-see TV" still gives her a great big case of the creepin' by-god willies, she now finds waaay toooo much of interest on the once-scorned television machine and DVDs and on-line and now often has to be forcibly and surgically removed from her laptop, or otherwise she would stay online watching episodes of Veronica Mars and Battlestar Galactica and The Office and Extras and Firefly and Freaks and Geeks until she died from malnutrition. And every year now for holidays and birthdays and National "Celebrate Your Car Insurance Day" her friends get Whedon-DVDs for presents, and they like 'em or else.

There, now.

Is anyone still there?

*takes another sip of absinthe and turns in her chair to her computer to search out Season 3, Episode 7 of The Office.
A tad bit off topic ... but did you know that SyFy Portal is one of the top 7,000 Web sites in Greece?

That's what Alexa claims in some new types of measurements they hand out. Apparently, we're far more loved in Greece than we are in the United States, where we're ranked in the top 33,000 sites here.

I just thought it was funny. =P
I'm still here Quotergal. If I could ask, who was your friend?
Oh, no problem, cheryl, it's Kristine Sutherland - though she truly is a friend of friends and only an acquaintance to me. She is a smart and radiant lady, a devoted mother, married to actor John "Cousin Ira" Pankow and additionally, quite a lovely photographer.

And she and I are of a certain age...
I also shrugged off the show when it aired, due to the name. Stupid me! I started watching during the summer of 05. At the time I was unemployed and in a habit of staying up way too late. Well, one night, I had DVR'd "Rescue Me", and when I finally decided to get to bed, the TV was still on FX. When I saw SMG on the screen, I felt the need to change the channel(Was never a fan of hers until Buffy). Only, I loved what I was seeing. The episode was "Dopplegangland" and I was HOOKED from that point on.

I think the summer of 05 will always be my favorite summer ever, I mean, that summer I experienced Firefly, Angel and Buffy all at once and all for the first time. Could you imagine anything better? I almost overdosed from all of the awesome.
I actually remember watching a few episodes of Buffy's first season when it originally aired and simply not liking it. I thought it was a rather poorly produced piece of television. In the years afterwards, I caught an episode here and there (I remember watching "Halloween", "Hush" and an episode from the 5th season.)

I actually would never have become an obsessive fan if it hadn't been for the spur of the moment decision to buy the first season on DVD.

I watched the entire first year in about 2 weeks, and I have to admit it didn't do very much for me. However, I really liked Giles, and I wanted Xander and Willow to get together.

So I picked up year two.

I don't know exactly when.. but I fell in love with the series there, and I can distinctly remember flying through that entire season in about 3 or 4 days. I had tears in my eyes at the end, when Buffy thrust that sword into Angel's chest.

Over the years since then.. I've tried very hard to introduce people to the show. I've managed to talk my father into watching it, but everyone else thinks that both the title and the concept is silly. On top of that, the weak stretch of episodes at the beginning is a bit of a turn-off, no matter how much I assure them that it gets better.

Oddly enough, Firefly and Angel are far easier sells. Everyone I know has watched and enjoyed Firefly by now, and quite a few have seen all of Angel. Out of all of the Angel fans I've created, very few want to crossover to Buffy, no matter how much they enjoyed the show.
Heh, that's what i'm talking about QuoterGal, see, bet you feel better now (course, that could be the absinthe ;).

Not sure why but I have the distinct urge to say "G'night John Boy" and turn out the lights. Strange, given that it's 9:25 am here ;).
Quotergal...Thanks. I LOVE Joyce's character in the series. It is seriously cool that you actually kinda know her.
Rabid....You know I think season 1 gets an overall bad rap. I hold it up there with season 2 and 3 for my personal favorites. It's where I fell in love with Buffy, Angel and the scoobs. IMO, it's the foundation that sets the tone that is yet to come. In my experience of getting people to watch, season 1 isn't difficult to get through, the participants just haven't yet become obsessed die hard Buffy fanatics. That comes with season 2, I tell them that up front. I've had comments like "I like it but not like you do." My reply is..."You will" and they do.
I showed the unaired "pilot" to a friend and she shuddered. Then I gave her Season 1 to take home and it was so much better that she loved it. But I too love Season One on its own merits.
QG, I feel like a little kid at storytime: "Tell it again! Tell it again!"
And although Joss has won me over to TV, I still prefer reading, which is why I'm looking forward to Joss's first book, whenever it may come.
I seem to be in the minority but I was one of those lucky enough to see Buffy right from episode one on it's first broadcast here in the UK.

It was only by chance it happened though. It was a Saturday night and for a number of reasons the plans we had for the night had fallen through so the then girlfriend and I decided to stay in and have a movie night. Of course typically enough there was nothing on the movie channels we wanted to see so after a little channel surfing we ended up on Sky One and saw that Buffy the Vampire Slayer was about to begin. I had no idea that there even was a television series so, not noticing the fact that it was only on for an hour, we assumed that it was the movie and decided to give it a look.

Needless to say that Welcome to the Hellmouth definitely made an impression on us both. Our relationship didn't survive all these years but we are both still massive Buffy fans. I actually never missed a first run episode of either Buffy or Angel, seeing the entire runs of both shows in order from start to finish. Let's just say that this was one occasion where I didn't regret not going out and getting drunk on a Saturday night.

Regarding BSG, I wasn't fortunate enough to catch that from the start and it was actually my current girlfriend who convinced me to give it a go. I eventually started watching from the start of season two and it didn't take me long to get caught up on the mini series and first season.

As for the main topic of the thread, I don't think I've ever been a victim of the BtVS effect. Names of series don't really have much of an effect on my opinions, even if they happen to me named after a previous version of the same concept. In fact, if not for thinking it was the movie there is a fair chance that we wouldn't have stopped on Sky One to catch Welcome to the Hellmouth in the first place. It's a fact that many people do let preconceptions get in the way though. I know far too many people who won't watch Buffy because of what they think it is. Their loss.
Saje;well there's nothing between Denmark and Britain except a lot of North Sea so, well the Vikings thought of it as the neighborhood.

My best friend in college and my best friend during the 80s didn't exactly fit the definition from the article but they did tend to judge things sight unseen on irrelevant factoids; HP Lovecraft's fiction and the TV-movie _Izzy and Moe_ as respective examples.

Persoannmly I wanted to see the movie even tho I expected little (I never have) and also wanted to see the series but as i was married I knew I wouldn't be able to but fortunately, while channel-surfing in her playroom my 6-year-old found it and asked me to "spend time" watching it. She gave it up late S-4 so I didn't get back into until a year later when the marriage broke up.
Rabid, that's roughly how I sell them too. First with Firefly, than with Angel, but then while their still on that I emphasize getting to see more of Angel in Season 2 of Buffy. From there, they get hooked fairly fast, become curious about the origins of Buffy and co, and there you go.

Oh, and a little while back, a convert referred to me as evanjossical, which--how clever (and fitting) is that?

Waves to Quoter-Gal, who seems to always be on the thread on the rare occasions when I post (I'm a lurker at heart).

edited because spelling is important when you're an English teacher--or even when you're not.

[ edited by narnia on 2007-02-17 22:53 ]

[ edited by narnia on 2007-02-18 03:48 ]
*waves back at the narnia-dear*

narn, you sound exactly like a pusher explaining how they promote gateway drugs.
Thanks! Back in my waiting tables days of long ago, I was very good at matching which bottle of wine to push to which table--so, I think I would have made a very good drug dealer. Band candy, anyone?

But really, it's just that I'm used to hooking my students and get them learning before they realize it.

And, yes, I also was too elitist to deal with Buffy's title. I even mocked a date--an English/film studies professor--who professed his admiration of it and didn't convert until three years later when my boyfriend made me watch OMWF--something about how if I really loved him, I'd do it.

And, QuoterGal, I think we've closed another thread.
"And, QuoterGal, I think we've closed another thread.
narnia | February 18, 03:59 CET"

...not neccessarily. ;-)

I understand this, and I don't. As I've said before, (and like QG, I feel like I've said this way to much) I loved the name Buffy the Vampire Slayer as soon as I heard it but was afraid it would turn out to be less than the ironic undermining of stereotypes that I heard in it. I watched the first two epi's and when Giles said "The earth is doomed." I specifically remember thinking, "They got it." and being really happy. It only occurred to me later that other people would think the show was silly because of the name.

Although names mean very little to me I do use them as a warning that it may be a horror movie (I have to stay away from them) or something based on embarrassment or stupidity humor, (something else I cannot watch.) Even so, if a friend who knows my tastes tells me it is good and that I should give it a try, I will. As a result I have seen some very good movies and TV shows. It has only failed me once and that was because a boyfriend simply lied in order to be able to see Catherine Deneuve on screen. (It confirmed a lot about him and our relationship, so I guess it was worth it. ;-) )

Unfortunately I have gotten used to the fact that other people are not like that. I have been told by people who are supposed to be friends of mine things like, "That movie is too popular, it has obviously been geared to the lowest common denominator." right after I told them that I had liked it and that I thought they would too. So I get it, my liking something that they think is beneath them either lessens any respect they had for me, or reveals they never had any respect for me.

In some ways I guess it makes me that much more appreciative when I find someone open to trying things, especially something named Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Of course the woman I just introduced it to, and who is loving it, might not have been willing to watch if she had not seen Serenity and Firefly first. People. They are a mystery.

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