Whedonesque : Comments on 15229 : (SPOILER) Tonight on BBC Two - James Marsters guest stars in Torchwood.

It's finally the 16th! Woohoo! Can't remember the last time I've been so jazzed to see a TV show.

Just hope it lives to the Hype to attract more viewers - No Spoilers here, but the Torchwood website has plenty of eye candy.

Oh btw, it's also on BBC HD Channel and repeated at 23.30 on BBC3

[ edited by Zol. on 2008-01-16 21:12 ]

Zol. | January 16, 21:40 CET

YES, YES, YES!

Harmalicious | January 16, 21:48 CET

Yeah, I've seen tons of adverts for this, all including James Marsters. In fact on BBCi they were running a loop of maybe 2 minutes of the show. It included the scene with that kiss and also what happens next - which btw is bloody great ;).

cypher | January 16, 21:50 CET

Oh yes.

the FAT indian | January 16, 22:04 CET

Ooo, and we'll be able to see this in the States in a couple of weeks! Can't wait. They've been hyping it quite a bit on BBC America, too. The first season was fairly, well... ok. But I enjoyed it for what it was. I'm hoping this season is better, and starting out the first episode with James--hot damn. :)

Dizzy | January 16, 22:11 CET

I'm not bouncing around like a cat on hot bricks waiting for 9PM

Nor is there a note on the remote control saying "AT 9PM THE SCREEN IS MINE!"

Indeed not :)

It's pick of the week just about everywhere and every one of the many reviews of the episode I've read has been really positive with the press saying great things about James' performance.

Really looking forward to this.

debw | January 16, 22:12 CET

So wait a minute, is James Marsters on 'Torchwood' or something ? I just wish there could've been some advanced warning, that's all.

;-)

(never thought i'd say this but after - finally - getting around to watching the end of series 1, especially 'Random Shoes', i'm also looking forward to it. Wonders never cease ;)

Saje | January 16, 22:16 CET

I can't wait for the 26th on BBCAmerica...

NaughtyBoozeHound | January 16, 22:23 CET

There's no way I've threatened any of my family with violence if there is sarcasm or even talking in the hour after nine o'clock. And it's merely a rumour that the recorder has been programmed for over a week.

Poodles!

Gill | January 16, 23:03 CET

Well now, this should be an exciting evening!

Valentyn | January 16, 23:37 CET

I don't have BBCA in my cable lineup, so have to wait until the 27th for it to go OnDemand (which I'll watch because the few commercials they put in are for BBCAmerica shows).

Love's Bitch | January 16, 23:43 CET

Hooray! It needs to be the 26th NOW! :P

CloudyVisions | January 17, 00:47 CET

The 2 page spread in this week's TV Guide about made my heart stop! If anyone hasn't seen it, JM is not only mentioned 3 places elsewhere in the guide, but on page 32, wow. Big 2 page picture of JM with the headline "Spike TV". They have a nice interview with him. It's a keeper. My entire week is planned around the 26th. Can't wait!!!

luvspike | January 17, 00:56 CET

And deservedly so - it was damned good fun. Some great gags, self-depreciating humour, more inuendo than you can shake a wizzard's staff at, a setup for a possible story arc - and a return visit - plus Captain John is an even more of an amoral git than Spike ever was. A vast improvement on S1 - hopefully they can keep it up.

Wemb | January 17, 01:59 CET

He's right too, she does have lovely eyes ;).

Spent a lot of it trying to figure out what the hell was wrong with JM's face and then I realised - "Captain" John has a natural skin tone rather than being deathly pale. Duh ;).

Not a bad start I thought, some clunkers but some nice lines too. More like that I could live with, especially when Martha comes along (and I love that they seem, from the previews, to have kept her theme from 'Doctor Who' - the musical cues on there are rarely less than excellent IMO, more varied than 'Torchwood's seem to be, despite Murray Gold being involved in both).

Saje | January 17, 02:02 CET

That wasn't bad actually. It was a huge step up from last season. James was very good in it, though I kept seeing season 2 Spike on screen rather than Capt John but I blame the writer for that. Nice Firefly nod btw.

Simon | January 17, 02:03 CET

Nice Firefly nod btw.

Ack - missed that. What nod?

Wemb | January 17, 02:06 CET

I may be shallow. No, I am shallow. But I really enjoyed it. Yes, Chibnall was writing for Spike, but James did a lovely job and the whole episode had pace and humour, things that were sadly intermittent last season.

I'll be in my bunk...

Gill | January 17, 02:08 CET

Well, that episode was really awesome !

Shade of Pale | January 17, 02:08 CET

Ack - missed that. What nod?

The lipgloss. Me and the wife both thought that was a nod to Saffron.

Simon | January 17, 02:10 CET

Ack - missed that. What nod?

And what about Vera ? Mere coincidence ?

Saje | January 17, 02:11 CET

Personally I thought it was very good. A vast improvement on season one. The new emphasis on humor bing the most striking difference between the two.

The press were right, James really did help enrich the proceeding a huge amount and, and Capt John rapidly became a fully fleshed out character in his hands.

The second kiss was sooooo sweet, and It made me laugh out loud when Inato's face showed he was seriously thinking about Harts offer of a group orgy... :0

sueworld2003 | January 17, 02:12 CET

I really enjoyed that

*lights ciggie and inhales deeply*

Captain John is another iconic character

Great entertaining stuff!

debw | January 17, 02:16 CET

Also poodle. Hilarious. I want more comedy like that.

Simon | January 17, 02:17 CET

Oh yeah, bestiality is never not funny ;).

Saje | January 17, 02:19 CET

Didn't there used to be a Torchwood Declassified afterwards during season one? In the same vein as Doctor Who Confidential. Are they not doing one this year as I couldn't see it on the schedule.

Simon | January 17, 02:23 CET

Didn't think it was that great, it's like this team of actors just don't gel properly, or it's underrehearsed, or whatever. It never really lifts off. But great that it's back and to be able to look forward to it every week.

Torchwood Declassified will be screened only after the pre-watershed cut of the show.

[ edited by Caroline on 2008-01-16 23:29 ]

Caroline | January 17, 02:24 CET

Yeah Simon, just a short 10 minute thing (which I never watched) not quite as elaborate as 'Doctor Who Confidential'.

I think they're going to show it after the BBC2 repeat (dunno whether it'll be on BBC2 or BBC3 though).

ETA: As Caroline said ;).

(apparently there's an interview with JM on it)

[ edited by Saje on 2008-01-16 23:33 ]

Saje | January 17, 02:30 CET

That was such an amazing ride. James did a terrific job.

I'm in a pleasure haze right now. :0)

JuliaL | January 17, 02:31 CET

"Help me Obi-Wan, you're my only hope..." had me chuckling, yes I am a child. And even my wife, a Buffy/Angel fan indirectly via my DVDs said "they're not writing for James Marsters they're writing for Spike" bloody good fun and a nice set up for a (hopefully) recurring role. Edited to add, in depth interview with Russel T on BBC 4 at 23.00 UK.

Jack Diamond | January 17, 02:34 CET

Torchwood Declassified will be screened only after the pre-watershed cut of the show.

Boo to that. Not what I pay my license fee for.

Simon | January 17, 02:35 CET

Yeah that RTD programme could be interesting, when he's not in awe of his subject Mark Lawson gives good interview.

Bit of a pisser then that my Freeview reception's crap and I can't get BBC4 at all (given up checking the schedule because of all the cool stuff I keep missing - most of which, for some strange reason, doesn't tend to show up on bittorrent ;). Ho hum.

Saje | January 17, 02:39 CET

You could try iPlayer.

Simon | January 17, 02:40 CET

I loved Captain John's line after he'd been introduced to the Torchwood team -

"You need a blonde."

silvius | January 17, 02:41 CET

Just discovered that Mrs Diamond has programmed the recorder for a bloody repeat of "Wire in the Blood" grr I feel sabotage coming on..., early start & I don't fancy missing that interview.

Jack Diamond | January 17, 02:43 CET

Many things can "happen" to pre-programmed VCR events, AV buttons can be pressed accidentally, channels changed. Hardly your fault if there's a slip 'twixt cup and lip Jack Diamond ;).

You could try iPlayer.

Cheers Simon. Had a look (even though i'm not really using it until they open it up) but the only BBC4 show they seem to have on for tonight is "Sounds of the Sixties". Do they add stuff as the week progresses or is that it ?

Maybe it'll appear online somewhere else.

Saje | January 17, 02:56 CET

I was pleasantly surprised. The episode was enjoyable, and I think James did an excellent job. I think most of the humour actually worked for once. The opening sequence really struck the right balance between funny and dramatic, although for some reason the "Jack abandoned us" plotline really reminds me of both Angel firing his team in Angel season 2, and Buffy returning to Sunnydale in Buffy season 3.

I still don't think they've developed the characters well enough, even though the actors do a decent job with them, or settled on intelligent, comprehensible plots, but they're definitely starting to move in the right direction. I just wish they'd used the opportunity of bringing in an old adversary/lover of Jack's to actually reveal more about the character, rather than teasing us with that prospect and not really delivering.

It's weird, but for some reason I always like Jack in Doctor Who much more than I do in Torchwood. Maybe it's because I'm not convinced by his tortured, dark side, and much prefer his fun side.

Razor | January 17, 02:58 CET

I have to agree with those who've said this was much better than last season. There were some very funny moments ('that's a poodle!') and the plot had greater depth even if the turninng points were a bit clunky still. It's odd to be watching something on the BBC and feel like you're being set up for an Advert break. James' performance was definitely the best part of this though.

ArielWillow | January 17, 03:09 CET

Saje: "Cheers Simon. Had a look (even though i'm not really using it until they open it up) but the only BBC4 show they seem to have on for tonight is "Sounds of the Sixties". Do they add stuff as the week progresses or is that it ?"

The Mark Lawson programme is there. I'm watching/listening to it now.

Plus iPlayer was officially launched on Christmas Day and now allows streaming but not downloading on a Mac.

moley75 | January 17, 04:30 CET

We survived. Which was nice.

Craig Oxbrow | January 17, 04:40 CET

Definitely better than last season, and did the credits say it was written by Chibnall? If so, impressive -- most of his other episodes have been frighteningly poorly written. I confess to really enjoying this.

chickenbird | January 17, 06:27 CET

I actually enjoyed it quite a bit, feels like they've stepped up their game. Particularly impressed by the fact that that was a Chibnall script. Looking forward to more :) The cast could use a bit more chemistry as Caroline noted above, but I feel like they've come a long way and I quite liked it. Enjoyed all of the (four?) refs to Whedonesque shows as well.

zeitgeist | January 17, 07:18 CET

It was awesome! This is what Torchwood should have been last year. Hope they can keep it up without Captain John. It's sort of like trying to imagine Farscape without Chianna once she was introduced. Heck, for that matter I thought Doctor Who suffered some once Captain Jack didn't follow to series 2.

Vinity | January 17, 08:39 CET

I don't know if it's the lack of new TV talking (although over here we're doing okay with this, Shameless and Buzzcocks I guess, but still), but that was AWESOME. Then again, I was one of those rare people that enjoyed it a lot last year (the second half much much more of course), so I was expecting goodness. James was great, and Jack seems to have lightened up a LOT. Mentioning his past helps too, since last year his broodiness almost seemed without cause, what with there being so few references and all. Bringing in all this stuff about his time agent days brings in a nice layer of reason for the brood. And the jokes were great! But once again, it may have been the four pepsis/ lack of sleep/ lack of TV that did it for me...

Silv | January 17, 09:11 CET

I don't watch Torchwood but I just watched this episode and really loved it. Not just for the James' bits either. It was fast-paced, funny and I have to disagree with Caroline, I thought the cast gelled very well. From the very first cab ride I thought there was terrific comedic timing between the actors and cameraderie between the characters.

And I really wasn't seeing Spike. And trust me, a big part of me would have liked to. Captain John was charismatic and funny and sexy like Spike, but he was a completely different character to me.

Xane | January 17, 10:49 CET

I am shocked and dismayed. I actually enjoyed watching an episode of Torchwood. I didn't cringe in pain at a Chibnall script. It really and truly is the end of the world.

Seriously, the bits of humor helped the show immensely and was exactly what I was hoping for this series. And while Captain John was more than a bit heavy on the Spike, tossing in a likable character did wonders. Not to mention James' energy seemed to bring the regular cast up a notch or three.

I'm actually looking forward to new episodes of Torchwood now. I think I better go lie down, as something is clearly wrong with me.

Lady Brick | January 17, 11:53 CET

I'm actually looking forward to new episodes of Torchwood now.

Me too. It's stopped making Hex look good.

Simon | January 17, 13:00 CET

Steady on, only Christina Cole made 'Hex' look good ;).

The Mark Lawson programme is there. I'm watching/listening to it now.

Plus iPlayer was officially launched on Christmas Day and now allows streaming but not downloading on a Mac.

Yep, cheers moley75, it seems that they don't put it up until after the programme has broadcast (which makes sense) because when I checked at about 10:30 last night neither 'Pop on Trial' or 'Mark Lawson Talks to ...' were on there.

And it's good to see them moving towards non-DRM complete cross-platform support. As I say, when they get there i'll be happy to use the service (already paid for it after all ;).

Saje | January 17, 13:11 CET

especially when Martha comes along (and I love that they seem, from the previews, to have kept her theme from 'Doctor Who'

...Saje, don't you think it sounds like "Feed the Birds, tuppence a bag"? And don't you think that's a bad thing?

Yeah, glad to see they seem to have ditched the "Face of Po-" from last series and lightened up a bit. Hope it continues. Might make an effort this time.

But I'd like to see
a) fewer recent desperately-trying-too-hard theatre school grads. b) less horrid Hitch-Hikers-Guide-from-1978 synth noodling, especially during meaningful scenes on rooftops.
c) a blonde.

I am a curmudgeon and must be stopped.

ZodKneelsFirst | January 17, 17:26 CET

...Saje, don't you think it sounds like "Feed the Birds, tuppence a bag"? And don't you think that's a bad thing?

Well, I do now obviously, ta very bloody much ;-).

(I actually do prefer "Rose's Theme" but Martha's, in context, is also good, albeit now irretrievably linked in my mind to Mary Poppins and the ill-advised encouragement of urban vermin ;)

Saje | January 17, 17:36 CET

Hahaha! *ahem* Carry on :)

zeitgeist | January 17, 17:37 CET

Sorry Saje :)
Someone did the same to me a while back with a Divine Comedy song.
Just passing on the pain.

ZodKneelsFirst | January 17, 18:07 CET

c) a blonde.

I would suggest Carey Mulligan (Sally Sparrow) but I'm still holding out for her to be the Doctor's assistant from now until the ending of the world.

ZodKneelsFirst | January 17, 18:10 CET

Someone did the same to me a while back with a Divine Comedy song. Just passing on the pain.

Heh, America please note - this is how we "pay it forward" in the UK. There isn't an upbeat, optimistic practice we can't somehow pervert. Fact ;).

And yep, Sally Sparrow for President ! But failing that i'll settle for at least one series as companion. Willing to give Donna a fair crack of the whip but from what i've seen of her so far, i'd much rather Ms Sparrow was in the TARDIS.

Saje | January 17, 18:30 CET

Hear hear on Sally Sparrow in the TARDIS.

zeitgeist | January 17, 18:40 CET

Just throwing my 2p in - I loved the whole thing. (I'm sorry, but I loved the first season too, please don't shoot me :)) James was brilliant. I think he does best in these larger-than-life roles and I'm hope-hope-hoping from watching the previews at the end that Captain John will be back.

TheSpark | January 17, 18:58 CET

Saje, how about Sally Sparrow in the Tardis, Donna crushed underneath it or falling from it in the sort of tragic catastrophe that happened to Adric?

We do need a blonde. Or a blond. Pity James doesn't like the bleach...

Gill | January 17, 20:21 CET

how about Sally Sparrow in the Tardis, Donna crushed underneath it or falling from it in the sort of tragic catastrophe that happened to Adric?

Now you're talking.

ZodKneelsFirst | January 17, 20:52 CET

Yep, I could get behind that Gill. TARDIS lands, The Doctor steps outside and notices a pair of legs with stripey stockings on sticking out from underneath. Just as he's wondering who he landed on around the corner comes ... Sally Sparrow !

If that's not how [new] series 4 starts i'll eat my ... dinner.

Saje | January 17, 23:01 CET

Not bad, not bad at all.
haven't read the whole thread yet, but was I the only one having "Dead Man's Party" flashbacks during the teaser?
James was great in it, though I really want to see what's Marth role will be in this season.
And from what I can get from the preview, Captain John will be back soon, right?

Numfar PTB | January 17, 23:57 CET

Just watched the episode.

I'm liking the beginning of this season much better than last! Much more lighthearted.

Also, poodle! Seriously, those lines are going to keep me laughing for days.

Aurra | January 18, 10:12 CET

Buffy fan fiction on BBC2!

Why they didn't just cut John's arm off? Presumably because he'll be back, which is great, because he was such an asset to the show.

The episode was close to perfection. There could of been more of a plot, but the characterization was a lot better than S1 and it was hilarious.

"Excuse me, have you seen a blow fish driving a sportscar?", "Help me, Obi Wan Kenobi, you're my only hope", and murder rehabs being some of by favourites.

I also thought of the beginning of Buffy S3 and Angel S3. And Vera could well not be a coincidence.

weelittlepuppetman | January 18, 21:17 CET

Why they didn't just cut John's arm off?

I wondered about that or cutting part of his torso :) Someone actually said something about cutting his arm off in the ep and was told that would detonate the device. Seems unlikely to me, but whatever :)

zeitgeist | January 18, 21:32 CET

LOL I also caught Vera as a ref (and am I the only one who pondered how Jayne would like to handle John? Just saying! *has Torchwood on the brain*). When he kissed Gwen and then she fell I instantly recalled Saffron (or whatever her name might be) then John pointed at the lip-gloss and I lost it. I love how James drank in the humor of his role. And the emotion that James Marsters goes nowhere without – one should want to kick John where it hurts but he made me feel bad for the Jack-loving cutie. I did see Spike for some moments but I mostly forgot (like usual with James’ acting) and only saw Captain John.

I loved this. Unlike those “other” shows that had JM gueststar in, this one REALLY used him. Smart people. And they couldn't cut him up, he's cute! ;)

“You were the wife!!” LMAO I bet he was a good wife *head desk* that was thought should be continued elsewhere… Ta.

Mirage | January 19, 00:09 CET

As Gunn said to Lindsey about his singing, "That was kind of tight."

Just an 'all round great opening episode with a first scene that could have been torn from any Buffy or Angel episode (I'm thinking the gangster fish character). The linked page calls Marsters character "a total swine," which may or may not ultimately make him less than totally interesting since there's nothing good about him to play off of, then again, he may not need to have any redeeming features. Relationships got clarified, Jack got called on the carpet for leaving, and last minute derring-do. What more could you want? "Bloody Torchwood." Heh.

Tonya J | January 19, 20:52 CET

Enjoyed the episode. Enjoyed JM's performance even more. He is layering his performance even more than ever. Great job.

newcj | January 20, 01:24 CET

January 16 2008