Will give a bajillion dollars for a transcript.

aus-mitch | May 23, 18:05 CET

Transcript.

Pay up. :P

Enisy | May 23, 18:07 CET

Thanks Enisy!!! I can't listen to them at work, but I can read 'em. :) Very interesting, especially the Spider stuff. And in regard of weird hate of the character I'd say two words: Riley Finn. When someone is established and pushed as being good for somebody, it somehow causes the opposite reaction in many people...

Nata | May 23, 19:00 CET

No prob, Nata. :)

Like I said on Brian's blog, I theeenk most of the protests might be related to Spider's villainous vibe, and to 'shipping (like, people are resistant to 'ships involving characters established from the TV show and comic characters, or to new Spike 'ships in general). Riley is an apt example, as is Tara, who got a lot of flak when she first appeared.

My initial reservations about the comic continuations have disappeared now, so I mainly just find Spider interesting.

Enisy | May 23, 19:08 CET

Enisy - yes, from what we saw it was hard to see Spider bending over for Spike. She was somehow manipulating him to get that shaft, she wanted him to kill Angel (even though she knew of their bond), she was making moon eyes at Angel when he showed up... I must say the first time it even occured to me she might have genuine feelings for Spike was when she was talking about it herself in their flashback. And that whole naked demon-girl crowd set-up was just weird, didn't work to her advantage either, in my eyes. And all that prisoner talk...

But like you, I'm now more open to her and interested in her, as Spike is now going out and about and not tied to her anymore. :) And can't wait to see what's behind Spike:ATF #3 cover. :)

Nata | May 23, 19:16 CET

Adding my thanks for the transcript, Enisy!

Very cool that Brian answered your batch of questions.

thundercat | May 23, 19:17 CET

Glad to help, thundercat. :) Yeah, that gave me a happy, especially since his answers were so cool. (And if I remember correctly, there are a few more questions by me later on, which, yay.)

[ edited by Enisy on 2008-05-23 16:26 ]

Enisy | May 23, 19:25 CET

I know there's legal issues and stuff, but I just don't understand why there hasn't been any references between the two Buffyverse comics. Like, you'd think Buffy would realize--hey, Los Angeles has gone to hell! Maybe Angel needs some help. Maybe she could send a recuped Dana to help out, or some kind of squad...? It's just a weird situation, considering that both stories take place--canonically--in the same universe (literal, not figurative, (or is that the other way around?) 'cause techically Angel's in a hell universe). Didn't some interview from IDW's side state that there would be some explanation as to why Buffy can't help, other than that Andrew (AS5) statement that "Angel's the bad guy now," as some readers here have suggested as an explanation, I believe?

Buffy the Slayer Layer | May 23, 20:44 CET

Surely Brian can't find it *that* mysterious where all the Spider-hate came from so instantaneously. She... she dared to touch Buffy's cheekbones! BURN HER! ;) Seriously, though, that's the reason -- it must be, because it didn't seem the hate started to fade *until* it started to look like she was manipulating him somehow. Then she became "safe". Her inchoate villainy has made her more liked, not less -- it was all romantic rivalry, all the time on that one. Amusingly, the more likely it became that she might pose a threat to Spike somehow, the less alarming her proximity became :)


Disappointed that Kate was, as Issue #7 made it feel, just a walk-on, but it made sense from the way she was used. And I am reassured that speculation that she went all suicide bomber there were misplaced since Brian said there were other stories to tell with her, just not in "After the Fall".

KingofCretins | May 23, 20:49 CET

I was able to listen to this recording with no problems.Thanks for doing up those transcripts though for people who can't here the podcasts,Enisy.



I think there hasn't been any references to ATF in season 8 yet specifically for story reasons.If they did that,it would probably give away the ending of ATF and the final fate of Team Angel.

As you brought up,Brian did mention in a previous podcast that we would learn why Buffy and her gang can't help Angel and his friends or the city in the story as ATF continues.He asked us to be patient but the answers are coming.I think it will be related to the status of L.A.Is it's actully in hell?Has hell has been brought to L.A. or is it something else?And my suspicion is some of those questions are to be answered in issue 10 based off the solicitation for that issue.Plus we know Gunn is using slayers as practice dummies for his vamp gang which might tie into some of those answers of how the events of ATF relate to the larger verse.

Buffyfantic | May 23, 21:29 CET

KoC, how do you explain lots of happy over Spike/Illyria cover then? ;) It's not just the 'shipping issues, it's also Spider herself. And the warming up to her after she became darker could also be explained by her starting doing something more interesting than just hanging around Spike. Having her own story to tell, her own mystery, so to say.
Just like Riley got more interesting when he started having issues of his own.

Nata | May 23, 22:23 CET

I thought one of the explanations for "no-crossovers" was that the two comics are occurring on 2 different timelines. Isn't Season 8 Buffy technically going on at the same time as Angel Season 5? Then ATF would be a year later than S8. I'm not the only one who heard this, right?

korkster | May 23, 22:35 CET

I believe that the none mention to the HelLA status should be couse they are in some different dimension, like Buffy was in "Anne", where the time moves in diferently from here. Then they could stay ther for several years and all the earth will not notice the "briefly" L.A. ausence.

Brasilian Chaos Man | May 23, 23:04 CET

...how do you explain lots of happy over Spike/Illyria cover then?

You're not seeing any happy coming from this guy over that. For the record, I don't really have an opinion on Spider. Never really had a problem with her, but I can see why people would dislike her, with her moving in on Spike and all.

[ edited by Supersymmetrical on 2008-05-23 20:14 ]

Supersymmetrical | May 23, 23:10 CET

Season 8 started about a year and a half after Chosen which makes it about five or six months after the end of season 5 of Angel .ATF takes place a couple months after the end of season 5 of Angel with First Night dealing with the the time right after NFA.Spike:ATF takes place in the time between First Night and the main ATF story.

But since L.A. is in the hell setting,time might be moving different from the rest of the verse so we really don't know how the timeline of ATF and season 8 directly relate to each other yet.

ETA

Sorry about that.Fixed my timeline mistake.Season 8 started a year and a half after Chosen making it about five or six months after NFA.

[ edited by Buffyfantic on 2008-05-23 21:06 ]

Buffyfantic | May 23, 23:16 CET

Okay. So I was wrong. I think I'm going for a record today.

korkster | May 23, 23:28 CET

I've seen next to no "happy" over the Spike/Fredlyria cover. By no means am I on every forum that talks about the ongoing Buffyverse, but I'm all over this site, BuffyForums, Dark Horse, and SlayAlive, and I'd say the majority has been a range between confusion, annoyance, and open hostility. And, yeah, I'd put it back to the same reason.

Point about the timeline -- there is absolutely no textual cue for aligning "After the Fall" and Season 8 of Buffy. Yes, "The Long Way Home" begins between 5 and 7 months after "Not Fade Away". But, with Hell A in a different dimension, we can not account for the rate at which time is passing relative to the "normal" Buffyverse. Consider Angel's hell dimension, Buffy's heaven dimension, the hell dimension Buffy visits in "Anne", Wolfram & Hart's holding dimension -- time passes at different rates relative to the normal world in each one, and we have no idea to what degree that is the case, if at all, in "After the Fall".

For instance, maybe it doesn't seem LA is gone. Could be the "months" of Hell A time have been passing and, in the regular Buffyverse, it's still a rainy night in Los Angeles the night of "Not Fade Away". Or, "After the Fall" could end and the survivors of Hell A step out into "Fray" (which would certainly be a great way to phlebotenize the return of demons).

KingofCretins | May 24, 01:23 CET

I’m not hating on Spider. Actually, initially I didn’t care either way – perhaps, more leaning towards liking her because she seemed to have Spike’s back. But, then, she made that Spike/Angel comment and she instantly went into my Good list. I’m easy that way ;) Still, I might ‘like’ her… but I won’t turn my back to her, that’s for sure.

Mirage | May 24, 01:42 CET

Brian gives great Q&A, I'm so glad he is continuing to do these little podcasts! And I always find the tidbits of information to be huge fun.

embers | May 24, 02:13 CET

I didn't really have strong feelings about Spider either way. With that said, I don't really understand her character. She fulfills a role, but until I know more about her I will remain neutral.

I like these little podcasts, I think they are a really terrific ideas. The writing of the series means I would have loved the series either way, but Brian Lynch going out of his way to communicate with the fans like this actually does increase my enjoyment.

rabid | May 24, 02:37 CET

I don't care enough about Spider. She's really not on my horizon one bit.

Simon | May 24, 02:44 CET

Great podcast, it's so cool Brian does these. Also, I just want to put a "happy" out there and say that I loved the artwork for Urru's Spike/Illyria cover. In fact, it's one of my favorite covers thus far. Looking forward to the next podcast!

fiatlux | May 24, 03:23 CET

Ditto.

And I liked Riley Finn.

menomegirl | May 24, 09:40 CET