We're in the middle of season 2 of Carnivale and absolutely loving it and really really annoyed that there were only two seasons... looking forward to Virtuality now even more!

Kirochka | June 30, 18:16 CET

The main problem IMO with the "later seasons" of Carnivale is, they didn't exist ;). ETA: As Shey said.

(it was cancelled after 2 seasons - and "cable seasons" at that i.e. 12 episodes - and *redacted for Kirochka* ;)

[ edited by Saje on 2008-06-30 15:21 ]

Saje | June 30, 18:20 CET

Fans of New Amsterdam may be interested to hear that Nikolaj Coster-Waldau has been cast as the ship's Captain Pike, according to what I read the other day.

pillboxed | June 30, 18:55 CET

Those concerned about Dollhouse and Virtuality as compared to Fringe should keep in mind that I bet you can pretty much count on the the Whedon and Moore shows two being heavily promoted during the Abrams show.

theonetruebix | June 30, 20:06 CET

So I'm not crazy. I could've sworn the first time I read anything about this show it mentioned reality tv, and I was completely confused as to why Ron Moore would be doing a reality show. Then it was about space travel, and I couldn't find anything about reality tv so I thought I was mistaken. Thanks for the link.

hacksaway | June 30, 20:21 CET

I don't want to start a LOST vs BSG thing but, as fine as LOST is, I just don't think J.J. is even on the same level as Whedon and Moore in concerns to T.V. or Sci-Fi stuffs. Despite the presence of Lance Reddick, I'm just not very intrigued by FRINGE. I have a lot more faith in Joss and Ron but, like stated above, I worry what the network and general audiences will think.

HBO has a lot of amazing shows, but I think I would rank CARNIVAL near the top of my favs. So thats cool for Clea.

RCM | June 30, 20:26 CET

My friends been talking the other day, depite Clea having quite bulkier roles in show such Heroes, but especially Carnivale, we still deeply remember her as Marcie Ross, despite she barely really appearing in the episode at all, for the nature of Invisible Girl and all.

Really curious of how Virtuality will come out. There are rumors of another BSG tv movie to be done this year, but I think they're all done on the shooting for the TV show, and Ron, will finally get more time to work on other projects.

Numfar PTB | June 30, 20:34 CET

I don't want to start a LOST vs BSG thing but, as fine as LOST is, I just don't think J.J. is even on the same level as Whedon and Moore in concerns to T.V. or Sci-Fi stuffs.

To be fair in several directions here: One, it's not a workable comparison because they're all kind of doing different things. One can't say "Lost isn't as good at this as BSG" because Lost isn't doing the same "this" as BSG is.

But also, if you want to make the comparison, you can't use it to dis Abrams, because Lost really is Cuse and Lindeloff, not Abrams.

theonetruebix | June 30, 21:28 CET

Thanks for the link dzr, that's the most I've heard about the premise. I will follow RDM pretty much anywhere and luckily the plot outline sounds quite interesting. I always like the holodeck sequences on TNG (should I be ashamed to admit that?) and I suspect these 'modules' will be taken to a whole new not-so-squeaky-clean level.

onthedrift | June 30, 21:34 CET

Thanks, Saje! :-)

Kirochka | June 30, 21:55 CET

Shiny! Clea DuVall....*swoon*

death is my gift | June 30, 23:56 CET

"But also, if you want to make the comparison, you can't use it to dis Abrams, because Lost really is Cuse and Lindeloff, not Abrams."

I guess I didn't know that because I haven't followed LOST enough. So, what exactly does Abrams do? People seem to give him tons of credit for projects that I later learn he has less creative influence on than I realized.

Anyway, I only made the comparison because I find it to be a common debate online (BSG vs LOST). We all know that LOST gets far higher ratings, and it just had me concerned now that Moore and Whedon, whom I love, will be facing off with a prime time giant, Abrams, who I think is okay, in his playground.

[ edited by RCM on 2008-06-30 21:23 ]

RCM | July 01, 00:22 CET

Abrams was a co-creator of Lost, but Carlton and Cuse have always run the show. Abrams has been off doing movies. He isn't going to be the showrunner for Fringe either. His name is marketing at this point.

TamaraC | July 01, 00:24 CET

His name is marketing at this point.

And marketing which will pay off for Whedon and Moore as well, since as I said it's inevitable that Dollhouse and Virtuality will be promoted during Fringe.

theonetruebix | July 01, 00:29 CET

I agree with you completely, bix. I can only imagine the Dollhouse ads that will be running constantly during Fringe in November sweeps on Fox. It is going to be situated very very well.

TamaraC | July 01, 00:35 CET

Assuming 'Fringe' makes it to November sweeps ;).

(my impression is that Abrams is to 'Lost' more or less as Singer is to 'House' i.e. directed the pilot and had a hand - maybe a big one - in shaping the concept but then the day to day executive producers actually, y'know, produce it)

Saje | July 01, 01:11 CET

Add another excited fan of Clea DuVall! Like many here I loved her in Carnivale (and loved Carnivale) and the combination of her with Ron Moore will make me definitely tune in for Virtuality. It would be interesting to see how many Carnivale fans are part of Whedonesque - though Daniel Knauf and Joss are not particularly similar sorts of writers, they are both incredibly creative and enjoy creating very off-beat characters, plots, and situations.

icelimbo | July 01, 03:41 CET

She is kinda cute.

It still interests me which one-shot guest stars become part of our "fansession" and which don't.

Admittedly Amy Adams and Clea both had prominent roles in their guest ep.s and also both have gained a good bit of attention for their larger projects. So they drag our obsessed bunch along with them. (I wonder if Amy Adams even knows we follow her here? Okay, I don't mean that question literally.)

By contrast, Megahn Perry has never been a highprofile actress. And her biggest part ever was probably in the Gravedancers in which "Clare the K." would naturally draw our interest.

PErsia White is actually quite well-known but she had one line (and barely that) in her BtVS appearance.

KAtherine Towne and Nicole Bilderback are in sort of a middle ground, both among Jossfans and the general public, and the middle is essential to defining things.

I guess Adam Kauffman and Jason Behr are considered lost to a different 'verse, since I see them mentioned never and rarely respectively on Jossverse sites.

DaddyCatALSO | July 01, 03:44 CET

"It would be interesting to see how many Carnivale fans are part of Whedonesque"

Another one here. And I loved her on Heroes too (and was sorry she was in only a couple episodes).

willbueche | July 01, 04:06 CET

DaddyCatAlso, I was thinking the same thing. I'd add Paige Moss (Veruca), Serena Scott-Thomas (Mrs. Post) and Jeff Korber(Kralick and Rack).

Others, who had even smaller roles, comparable to Amy Adams' Cousin Beth, but who did great jobs, also never get mentioned. Off the top of my head, John Hawke(the janitor who killed the teacher in IOHEFY), who was on Deadwood, and Glenn Morshower (Cassie's alcoholic dad), who's done excellent work on 24 and Friday Night Lights.

Hats off to them all for their contributions.

shambleau | July 01, 04:32 CET

J.J. Abrams = creator/executive producer, Alias.
By all accounts, a more hands-on project for him than Lost.

Shey | July 01, 16:22 CET

shambleau, shout-out for Serena Scott-Thomas, my favorite one-off of all seven seasons -- with the possible exception of the great Hinton Battle.

doghouse | July 01, 18:17 CET