Whedonesque : Comments on 18124 : Favorite TV and Movie Vampires.

You know, I've always never been that big a fan of Spike. I always saw him as a pretty hollowed out character over the course of the show. I am, however, taking my current holiday break to watch the entire series of Buffy from start to finish, and I'm amazed at how much my opinion is changing. Maybe it's cos of the distance between the time the show has finished and now and my more level headed approach, or maybe cos Spike has been totally awesome in Angel/Spike: After the Fall, but it's all brought a new light, and I'm loving him. So yayness for changing of tune! I'm enjoying the show much more now.

aapac | November 14, 12:57 CET

"His alliance with Angel"? Is that an oblique reference to his soul, or are they getting the order of events all mixed up?

At any rate, SQUEE! He's my favourite vampire, too. (And gotta love Highlander's tags. *g*)

Enisy | November 14, 13:10 CET

Edited tags (I didn't really want to spend the morning moderating a Spike vs. Angel debate thread). Plus, to be honest we're awash in lists lately.

zeitgeist | November 14, 13:27 CET

I couldn't get the last page to load, so this might be wrong. But any list that leaves out Forever Knight is full of fail. I loved that show, and was sad when it ended. I was going to get it on DVD, but the reviews I read said the transfer was really bad.

Eric_Curtis | November 14, 13:40 CET

Spike's my favourite, but Angel should be on the list too. After all, he had his own show, and it was pretty darn great.

I also lament the omission of Nick Knight. Discrimination against Canadian vampires!

redeem147 | November 14, 15:00 CET

Well, I'm not up for a Spike vs. Angel debate, but I WOULD love to see a "let's all watch Buffy again!" wave get started. I'm rewatching the whole thing too, aapac! Just drooled over School Hard this morning before work. Tasty.

[ edited by shicks on 2008-11-14 15:20 ]

shicks | November 14, 15:19 CET

Angel is both my favorite good guy and (as Angelus) my favorite villain of the Buffyverse. To me, leaving him off a list that instead includes Edward Cullen is pretty much a crime. And Nick Knight should definitely have been there as well, ~~eh?~~

I'm long overdue for another Buffy-athon. It's been, what, three months since my last one? Maybe this time I'll be able to finish both shows in French. Only got to midway through Buffy season 5/Angel season 2 before realizing that I didn't have the scripts memorized from rewatching the episodes so many times beyond that point, and I had to go back to English because I couldn't follow the dialogue anymore. Which took my pride in how well I'd been understanding the French down a few notches.

Taaroko | November 14, 15:33 CET

"I didn't really want to spend the morning moderating a Spike vs. Angel debate thread."

Hehe, sorry, zeitgeist. Was meant as a tongue in cheek dig at the last list that included the Buffy/Angel relationship and not the Buffy/Spike one but can't say I blame you for wanting to avoid that particular debate. ;)

Spike was always my favourite of the two main vamps but then he was my favourite Buffy character altogether, so that kind of goes without saying. Only Faith and Oz came close to knocking Spike off the top of the list. Loved the character of Angel too but Spike was the character I identified with the most. Plus, Ramones fan. ;)

The Highlander | November 14, 15:40 CET

Not many female vampires on that list. Although the two they did think of I'd completely forgotten about: Kate Beckinsale in Underworld and Salma Hayek in From Dusk Till Dawn. Of course the Buffyverse has Darla, Drusilla and Harmony. But outside of that, who are the great female vampires? Maybe Catherine Deneuve in The Hunger, or maybe Lili Taylor in The Addiction (but maybe she doesn't count as it's unclear whether they really are vampires).

Any ideas? Best female vampires: go!

dzr | November 14, 15:41 CET

Lucy in Dracula?

redeem147 | November 14, 15:45 CET

Best female vamp has to be Darla (because... Julie Benz) but outside the Buffyverse it's got to be the lovely Kate Beckinsale as Selene (because... Kate and leather).

The Highlander | November 14, 15:48 CET

I've been rewatching both series, more or less as broadcast (we started going back and forth between shows once AtS began, which I'd never done before), with a friend who's never seen any of them and it's been great. Watching this thing I love so much with a newbie has kind of made me watch it all with new eyes myself.

Spike has stood up well to that "like new" viewing of his arc. His development as a character is among the most interesting and moving of anyone's, in no small part because he starts out as a little more than a cardboard cutout (who wasn't meant to last all that long) and becomes... well, you know. I'm not a big fan of his relationship with Buffy (though I understand why it was necessary in S6), so that isn't what does it for me. I guess it's that he's the series' Han Solo - the guy that goes from totally self-absorbed rogue to the one who'll put it all on the line for the cause and the people he cares about. I dig that stuff.

Vague That Up | November 14, 15:49 CET

I think it's pretty cool that we've been "awash with lists" lately and it's pretty nice that Spike is number four.
But I'm not sure if that's a typo and they meant to say his alliance with Buffy, or his alliance against Angel, but the way it is makes the kind of sense that doesn't.

[ edited by Xane on 2008-11-14 16:16 ]

Xane | November 14, 15:59 CET

[ edited by . on 2009-01-15 04:28 ]

| November 14, 18:10 CET

I love my Whedon vampire boys equally (although very differently), so I'm not going to whine about Angel being left off...much. But really--the Count from Sesame Street, but no Angel? I understand TVG wanting to maintain balance...but huh?

ScullyWant2B | November 14, 18:16 CET

"But really--the Count from Sesame Street, but no Angel?"

Hey! What's wrong with the Count? For someone who spent their todler years waching him, I'd be ashamed if they left him off the list.

Justin | November 14, 18:34 CET

I just finished season 2 and I'm going to start 3 tonight. I just cycle through Buffy, Angel and Firefly all year long. I might add another series in there now and again but I always mark were I left off, so I can go back into rotation....the first thing to do is acknowledge you have a problem.

buffywrestling | November 14, 19:28 CET

buffywrestling,
And this a problem because?

barboo | November 14, 19:37 CET

dzr
I'd nominate Countess Bathory as portrayed by the great Delphine Seyrig in Daughters of Darkness as a notable female vampire who wasn't listed.
It boggles my mind that Christopher Lee's Count Dracula was omitted from this list. I know Lugosi's Dracula was in there but their portrayals of the character are very different.

Yefa | November 14, 20:56 CET

In addition to Catherine Deneuve's character, I've gotta nominate Elina Löwensohn's titular role in Nadja. Love love LOVE that movie! And the sapphic overtones didn't hurt at all ;>

I wouldn't call her a favorite (mainly because she scares the CRAP out of me), but Grace Jones in Vamp? *shudders* Definitely noteworthy.

UnderTheDark | November 14, 21:13 CET

There was also Gloria Holden as Dracula's Daughter (Donna Wandrei as Roxanne on Dark Shadows, at least her 1840 version, don't know the 20th century form, was more pathetic than great. ) The female vamps in Brides of Dracula, Castle of Blood, Twins of Evil, Slaughter of the Vampires, the Count Yorga films, in themselves truly forgettable. I haven't seen any of Anulka Dzubinska's vampire films so can't comment.

As to a confusion of events, well, Angel turned evil, moved in with Drusilla and Spike-on-wheels and worked with them, then alienated Spike, which led Blondie Bear to come to Buffy to defeat The Acathla Scheme, so technically the blurb in the list is correct, in a rather odd but real (or at least realish) way.

DaddyCatALSO | November 14, 22:54 CET

I've wanted to see Brides of Dracula and Castle of Blood for years. I liked Twins of Evil quite a bit. Ingrid Pitt was good in The Vampire Lovers. Anulka and Marianne Morris were good in Vampyres.

Yefa | November 14, 23:14 CET

It's great to get BtVS another mention and make another list - even if the writer has forgotten that Spike's alliance with Angel happened *after* Spike earned a spot in Buffy's bed! :)

Moscow Watcher | November 14, 23:30 CET

I'm always disappointed when they leave Catherine Denueve and Daid Bowie off these lists - also Chris Sarandon.

cmbackshane | November 15, 01:05 CET

There has to be oil involved in one of these lists....

BrownCoat_Tabz | November 15, 01:30 CET

RE: female vampires, what about Dracula's minions on Buffy? They certainly kept Giles entertained. :)

ActualSize | November 15, 03:12 CET

I'm dying laughing over this list that includes Count Dracula from Sesame Street, Eddie Murphy's vampire from "Vampire in Brooklyn", "Blacula" and Jim Carey's vampire from "Once Bitten". It seems as much satire and mocking fun as it does serious vamp bad-assness. As much as I believe Angel to be one of THE most iconic characters, I can't say I'm sorry he isn't on this particular list. ;)

[ edited by love4ba on 2008-11-15 03:58 ]

love4ba | November 15, 03:55 CET

I have to agree with DaddyCatAlso regarding Gloria Holden as Dracula's Daughter (1936) - a bisexual female vampire with a soul who seeks redemption, all the while obsessed with a mortal man. Sounds kind of familiar.

Also gotta go with Jonathan Frid's Barnabas Collins (another vampire seeking redemption who also just happens to be obsessed with a female some 200+ years his junior) as well. If you weren't around during this gothic soaps first run, you couldn't possibly know just how big a hit this show was at its peak of popularity.

Last but not least - Barry Atwater as Janos Skorzeny from the first Kolchak:The Night Stalker TV movie. That was one nasty azz vampire.

Night Gallery | November 15, 04:25 CET

No George Hamilton Drac shout out for Love at First Bite? Heresy! Everyone loves disco and vampires!

Charmuse | November 15, 05:29 CET

How could I forget Frid's Barnabas? *headdesk*

redeem147 | November 15, 05:38 CET

Loving the Spike love, although this list seems about half serious (Spike, Lestat, Gary Oldman's Drac) and half goof (Gramps, the Sesame St. Count, Blacula) with the rest somewhere in between. And it really is unforgivable to not include Angel.
But IMO, it's just as bad to not include Darla and Dru. OK, that would make it Joss-heavy, but how is that a bad thing? Joss love aside, they are my two favorite female vampires (along with Claudia) and are always left out.

Shey | November 15, 12:52 CET

You know there are lists that have Spike and lists that have Angel. To each their own.
It's just nice that anyone still cares enough to include either of our vampires on their lists still.

And I thought that Jim Carrey movie was funny, and had some great dancing. Seriously.

Speaking of being awash with lists my hard copy of TV Guide this week had a list of TV's toughest action heroes. Guess who was number two? Buffy, yeah Buffy.

"In every generation....blah, blah,... forces of darkness. She is the slayer. And she raised the stakes for future teen titans by dispatching the undead with an acrobatic prowess and acerbic wit that was sharper than even her beloved weapon, Mr. Pointy."

Pretty nice, huh?

[ edited by Xane on 2008-11-15 19:54 ]

Xane | November 15, 19:53 CET

Shey; How recently have you seen Blacula? Yes, there are some comic relief moments and satiric themes, and the premise has an unavoidable touch of absurdity. But it is for the most part a very well done and downright scary film. And Bill Marshall could give almost anything depth and dignity. RIP.

DaddyCatALSO | November 15, 22:40 CET

November 14 2008