Whedonesque : Comments on 19255 : James Marsters makes TV Guide's "Get These Stars a Show Now!" list.

Darn tootin'!

I agree!!!! He needs his own show as of yesterday!!! He has to sing in it at least once or twice! :)

I don't think Riley/Buffy can compete with Spike/Buffy or Angel/Buffy in terms of writing, thematic depth or chemistry, but I wouldn't include it in that list, either. There are way worse couples on television.

Agree 100% about James Marsters, though. I've been disappointed with most of his post-Buffy projects, now that I know exactly how charismatic an actor he is.

Enisy | February 26, 15:52 CET

So nice to see our James getting some mainstream media love!

cronopiogal | February 26, 15:54 CET

Uh oh, BRiley criticism, you guys are in trouble now :).

zeitgeist | February 26, 16:02 CET

I'm not sure to totally agree. I mean, it would be perfect but I would love to watch more films starred by James _and specially plays. I missed hist las performance in UK, the closest he's been to Spain, and I'm curious to listen to James' Shakespeare.

Small Blue Thing | February 26, 16:18 CET

I'd love to see James Marsters and Jason Dohring together.

Also, have to put in my ongoing plea for a sitcom (a good one) for Charisma Carpenter who is such a great comic actor.

barboo | February 26, 16:31 CET

I would love to get a weekly dose of James again. How I miss it. Just not in one of those incredibly boring, CSI, Law and Order, procedural type shows.

The one thing we've never seen James in is any kind of sitcom in a guest role. Wonder how that would be?

Xane | February 26, 16:36 CET

James Marsters freaks me out whenever he doesn't have bleached blonde hair and a British accent. He needs to get those back.
Then we can talk about possible TV shows.

barboo, I agree with you. I think Charisma would be great on her own sitcom.

twinkiefoo | February 26, 16:36 CET

The one thing we've never seen James in is any kind of sitcom in a guest role. Wonder how that would be?

That would be fun. He had excellent comic timing in Buffy, especially Season 4.

James Marsters freaks me out whenever he doesn't have bleached blonde hair and a British accent. He needs to get those back.

He said he would bleach his hair again "when Sarah comes back from Africa". What a tease! ;)

[ edited by Enisy on 2009-02-26 16:37 ]

Enisy | February 26, 16:37 CET

I have to admit, I would love to see him as a blonde again. Probably never gonna happen though.

Ooh. How about a sitcom with James, Charisma, and Emma!

Xane | February 26, 16:40 CET

I love his dark hair. He looks more like - James.

redeem147 | February 26, 16:58 CET

I'd love to see JM as a regular in a series again. They're right, he does manage to enrich nearly every show that he's been on.

Hell, It was JM's appearance on Torchwood that finally managed to make watching that show a joy for me, and thats no mean feat I can tell you. *g*

sueworld2003 | February 26, 16:59 CET

James starring in a TV series would be a dream scenario. Hopefully, one day soon !

Shade of Pale | February 26, 17:13 CET

Let's see - how many eons have we been saying this as we watched him go from one journeyman actor role to another? Let's just say my natural hair was a lot less silver. I wouldn't begrudge James his journey thus far; I'm sure he's learned a lot from it, but he's a star, not a hired gun.

[ edited by Tonya J on 2009-02-26 17:14 ]

Tonya J | February 26, 17:14 CET

.....picked Buffy/Riley as one of TV's Worst Couples.

*fumes*

A needy prom date!!!!!!

Speechless at that, obviously.

[ edited by menomegirl on 2009-02-26 17:21 ]

menomegirl | February 26, 17:18 CET

And...erm...Adam Baldwin. It's about gorram time he was the LEAD in something on the box! Comedy, drama, rom/com...

VeraSamuels | February 26, 17:27 CET

Considering how much James has to offer, I have to wonder what to think about a show that couldn't or wouldn't make use of his talents. Without A Trace had him on for a while, but the story went nowhere so they ditched the storyline and moved on without him. I think it says more about their limitations than his abilities, so after giving them a bit more of a chance, I wound up finding something else to watch.

Scraggles | February 26, 17:42 CET

Yeah, go James.

But also: sigh. Buffy/Riley is not, not, a bad screen couple. It's a realistic presentation of a relationship founded on an attempt at normalcy rather than passion. They don't have chemistry? That's the point.

From "Something Blue":

Buffy on Riley, before vaguely admitting to Willow that it doesn't seem like it's enough: "I like him. I do."
Buffy on Spike, to Riley (while under the spell): "I don't even really like him! Well, nobody really likes him.... But I love him. I do."

Buffy never tells Riley she loves him, even though she comes close once or twice. And she never, for that matter, hates him the way she constantly reminded Spike. Buffy really does like Riley a lot. But she never loves him. And the text acknowledged this right from the get go. So what's the problem?

And Marc Blucas did a fantastic job playing a gradual realization that his passion for her was unrequited.

WilliamTheB | February 26, 17:43 CET

Marsters is one of the most versatile actors I've ever seen, of his generation. Maybe carrying a lead at this point isn't something he aspires to? I dunno.

Tonya J | February 26, 17:44 CET

It's a realistic presentation of a relationship founded on an attempt at normalcy rather than passion. They don't have chemistry? That's the point.

...

But she never loves him. And the text acknowledged this right from the get go

It always seemed to me that the writers were originally going for passion but when they realised the audience wasn't responding they turned it into a story about a 'normal', not particularly passionate relationship. I might be wrong; it's been some time since I watched season 4

Let Down | February 26, 18:18 CET

I think I agree with WilliamTheB about the lack of chemistry being intentional.

Jane Espenson: We had all been feeling this, about the Buffy/Riley relationship. It never had the fire that Buffy/Angel did. It wasn't really meant to.

(Whereas Buffy/Spike did have that fire; was practically characterised by it, as seen in Chosen.)

I still think Buffy/Riley was well-written for what it was supposed to be, though; enough not to deserve a place in that list, at the very least.

[ edited by Enisy on 2009-02-26 18:28 ]

Enisy | February 26, 18:25 CET

Yes, Riley/Buffy was supposed to be everything that is "normal" to show that Buffy doesn't love a "normal" relationship - she can't be in a "normal" relationship. So it was doomed from the getgo.

But it was a great relationship - my favorite moment being when Riley tells Xander that Buffy doesn't love him. That was so gut wrenchly beautiful.

As for James Marsters, he's a great actor, but they'd have to build a great co-star cast for a series to really work.

BrownCoat_Tabz | February 26, 18:35 CET

Series, film, narrating for The History Channel

I don't care

More James is always of the good!

debw | February 26, 18:42 CET

Since that's a TV guide reader's poll answer I think, as fans, they're entitled to their opinion. Besides, I agree. My eyes glaze over when I watch them together. However, I think Marc Blucas did a great job as the relationship deteriorated, and I finally liked Riley just before he left. We shall keep As You Were out of the discussion. *eep*

I did appreciate that they put Lana and Clark on that list. This season of Smallville was going so well until she showed up.

I think if someone offered James a series with a good script and it could shoot in LA he'd probably do it. He did say he'd gotten a lot of bad scripts from SciFi but his manager told him Alien Western was the one to do.

redeem147 | February 26, 18:45 CET

I'd love to see James get his own show, and I agree - he has to sing! The accent and blond hair would be cool too. (I couldn't believe he and Alexis Denisof weren't British)

And I also agree that Buffy/Riley wasn't supposed to have the fire that Buffy/Angel had - it was about Buffy trying to get over Angel and trying to have that 'normal life' which Angel left her for, but finding out that she couldn't. (I loved Spike's name for him though - 'Captain Cardboard')

Shep | February 26, 18:57 CET

He said he would bleach his hair again "when Sarah comes back from Africa". What a tease! ;)

Seriously??? Lol, what a tease..

When I saw him with his natural hair color I freaked out a bit too, but then I completely changed my mind about that, and now I wouldn't want to see him any different from how he naturally is.. well, except if he was playing Spike..!
No need to say I'd love to see him as the star of a show..but a good one, for Pete's sake!!!.. pretty please?!

JotheCat | February 26, 19:01 CET

I'd love to see James in a 'Warehouse 13' type show- or even 'Life on Mars'- the latter can handle strong, almost over the top characters and 'Warehouse' sounds like it has an X-Files feel to it (albeit it less bleak).

Taryn21 | February 26, 19:03 CET

RE: Charisma Carpenter. She is scheduled to be a guest star on an upcoming episode of CSI, Las Vegas version.

Dana5140 | February 26, 19:43 CET

Chiming in to agree about giving James a steady, mainstream gig! Joss has been showing so much love with the Dollhouse casting, I keep hoping I'll read a spoiler that he's giving James a guest spot (or, even better, a character role). There's always season 2, Joss!! Hinty McHint!

mackenzie | February 26, 20:10 CET

Let Down, that's the reason I quoted from "Something Blue," which was very early in B/R--even then the message was that Buffy likes him, that he has good arms ("those are good arms to have"), but not much more: Riley is likeable and physically attractive, but there isn't that much else to her want for him. But when she goes gaga for Spike, she goes gaga over him. I don't think putting Buffy's "I want to want him"-type conversation in the same episode as a Buffy-in-love-with-Spike plot (and immdiately after "I Will Remember You's" Buffy-in-love-with-Angel plot) is a coincidence. I'm not really convinced they were ever going for passion in the writers room. Like? Sexual attraction? Definitely. But passion? Nah.

WilliamTheB | February 26, 21:03 CET

And...erm...Adam Baldwin. It's about gorram time he was the LEAD in something on the box! Comedy, drama, rom/com...

At least he is a regular supporting cast member of Chuck. Plus he is basically playing a smarter version of Jayne on that show which is great.

He is a great "straight man" though, so he will always have to be teamed up with someone else in a comedy show. This is why he was/is so great in Firefly, Chuck and even Angel.

I do hope James Marsters does more on Dr. Who or Torchwood though. His character was insane enough to really improve an otherwise dull plot.

But why would an actor do TV when they can do movies. On Tv they do a lot of work for a little pay. For movies they do a little work for a lot of pay. While I know James isn't in it entirely for the cash, the cash and freetime is always nice. Since he once said that he got out of stage acting to make money after he had a child, the money is important. Plus movie actors get a lot more respect.

Jayne's Hat | February 26, 21:27 CET

But why would an actor do TV when they can do movies.

I would imagine the pressure to get a role on a movie is even more intense than getting a role on TV. Very few actors are well paid.

Simon | February 26, 21:30 CET

James Marsters on a daily...weekly...or even monthly basis would be a dream come true for me.
I think he is one of the most talented and versitile actors out there and it amazes me that he doesn't have his own show yet.
Maybe the stars will align the right way this time and a new lead role will be in his future SOON!!!!!
I know I'll sure be there to watch when it happens!!!!

kathylovesspike | February 26, 21:31 CET

Having a Ball On a round hilltop nicknamed "the Ball," sits Glenbourne Preparatory. To this staid institution comes iconoclastic, wise-cracking, jazz-loving English lit teacher and baseball coach Danny Ball (James Marsters) to shake things up, much to the chagrin of stabilitiy-oriented headmaster Louis Vallone (Hector Elizondo.) Elizabeth Anne Allen plays brilliant, perkily cute, earnestly socially-activist science teacher Leanna Balducci, potential love interest.

Charisma apparently does have a recurring part on Greeks beyond that not sure. Glad that sitrcoms ehw as up for earleir didn't sell; she would have been totally fonzarellied by the younger brother character, same as would have happened to Alyson if Americana had sold, and neithwer deserves that.

And it was a true crime that there was no s-5 arc with Spike and Cordelia snarking on each other full-cylinder for a few epsiodes.

I loved Riley, jsut not as Buffy's b/f and i agree thatw as the point. the reason they appear on this list is probably a fanquake of negative votes. On UPN's old Threaded Bronze, that particular group of Spuffies were fierce! And I'm sure some others are as well. Even with Riley happily married to his perfect match, ie. even for absolutely no reason remaining at this time, wanted horrid things to happen to Riley.

[ edited by DaddyCatALSO on 2009-02-26 21:36 ]

DaddyCatALSO | February 26, 21:34 CET

I would imagine the pressure to get a role on a movie is even more intense than getting a role on TV. Very few actors are well paid.

He's doing a movie. A movie that might not exactly be Oscar material, but is getting him a lot of attention. And a PR trip to Asia (which is not too shabby).

redeem147 | February 26, 21:58 CET

Even with Riley happily married to his perfect match, ie. even for absolutely no reason remaining at this time, wanted horrid things to happen to Riley.

I still think she was a robot.

redeem147 | February 26, 21:59 CET

LOL@redeem147.

menomegirl | February 26, 22:18 CET

I never believed in Riley when he was going dark in the middle of season 5. His "encounters" with the blood-sucker for hire were completely unconvincing. Plus, how whiny can a guy get - Buffy's mother has a life-threatening illness and all he can do is complain that she isn't paying HIM enough attention.

That said - every time I rewatch the series I like Riley better up to that point. There isn't the same kind of sparkage, but he's a decent guy who loves Buffy and he gives her a lot of support, at a point in her life where she's still emotionally reeling from 3 years of Angel-angst. I'm glad that he finds the right woman for him in "As You Were".

barboo | February 26, 22:35 CET

I would love to see JM in one of those BBC period-costume mini-series. :)

Sarrava | February 26, 22:47 CET

He's doing a movie.

That I know but I would imagine that there were a lot of auditions for movie parts before he landed the plum role in Dragonball. I'd like to see him do more comedy, he does have the touch.

Simon | February 26, 22:52 CET

Plus, how whiny can a guy get - Buffy's mother has a life-threatening illness and all he can do is complain that she isn't paying HIM enough attention.

Yeah, this always bugs me. I think it's something the writers actually kinda lost sight of--they were tracking the "Joyce dying" story and the "writing Riley out" story separately, and didn't really realize how horribly selfish and insensitive they made Riley seem. I say that because I think we were supposed to feel some sympathy for Riley--that he was madly in love with Buffy and she would never really requite that love. We were also supposed to feel that Buffy really wasn't giving him his due (the Xander speech etc.).

But in those last few episodes all I can think when I see Riley pouting and clenching his jaw and going off to get a suckjob because Buffy hasn't thought to call HIM first when Joyce collapses is "Her fricking mother is dying you big crybaby! Man up and be as supportive as you can! She's got bigger problems to deal with than your pathetically fragile ego." And I LIKE Riley (and think that Blucas did a great job with the character).

snot monster from outer space | February 26, 23:06 CET

barboo, smfos; I give that a "yessish" at best; one point was that Buffy, at a needy period for her, wasn't turning to him, wasn't asking him for help, wasn't letting him be there for her. It's hard to love someone who doesn't expect anything from you.

DaddyCatALSO | February 26, 23:15 CET

barboo, smfos; I give that a "yessish" at best; one point was that Buffy, at a needy period for her, wasn't turning to him, wasn't asking him for help, wasn't letting him be there for her. It's hard to love someone who doesn't expect anything from you.

Grief and fear can turn someone inwards. If your response to that is to have little tantrums, go off looking for whores, and ultimately leave, you're not a very mature person. Sure, if Buffy had remained distant, say, three or four months after Joyce's death, Riley would have had a point. To skip out while Joyce was still dying was the act of a real cad. And I really don't think they wanted us to think of Riley as a cad or as emotionally immature.

snot monster from outer space | February 26, 23:28 CET

I would love to see James with a Shakespeare DVD coming out. But he is so good with comedy, Joss said he was one of the few actors that could go from Dracula to Jack Benny in a heartbeat. I also started watching Torchwood after I saw James was in it, am going to stop watching Smallville because they have written Milton Fine out I guess. I can't hardly wait until Dragonball:Evolution comes out, James is going to nail that part. Even with all the makeup on, I can still see James. He needs a good Sci-Fi series and I would LOVE to see Spike in his own show. Hey FOX even get him for a few guest spots on Bones. James and David work great together. I am buying all The Dresden Files audio books because James reads them and it is such fun hearing a word or two that sounds like Spike. The next 3 come out in April.

rehabber | February 27, 00:20 CET

It's nice to see James Marsters on the big screen but if I had my way he'd be in a weekly series. Need a weekly dose of James to make me happy. Movies take way too long to go from page to screen.
I don't care if his hair is blond, brown or purple just give him a show! These guest shots have been weak and I would imagine James needs a real character to bring out his best work. Nothing is going to come close to Spike, it just ain't gonna happen. Capt John was a pale imitation, nice try but pluleese.

biffsbabe | February 27, 00:29 CET

That's it!

*throws down fan sticker*

These types of threads get me all riled up for my actors to come back... but they don't. I just can't take that kind of loss! This is what I want:

Alexis Denisof
James Marsters

Together, in a comedy show. Weekly. And some cookies. And milk.

korkster | February 27, 00:47 CET

I still think she was a robot.

No, no, she was a Doll. ;-)

I liked Riley in season 4. The season 5 writing-out-of-Riley was deeply flawed. (When your boyfriend blames you for his prostitute habit, he's not a guy worth running after--no matter how eloquent Xander is).

But, snot monster, I'm not sure you can fault Riley on the timing. When he left, Joyce wasn't "still dying," she was officially out of danger (unless I'm forgetting something). I think it would have been far worse if he had left a few months after Joyce's death . . . grief is a complicated thing, and it sometimes takes people a lot more than three or four months to open up about it.

Alexis Denisof
James Marsters

Together, in a comedy show. Weekly. And some cookies. And milk.

korkster,sounds like a recipe for happiness. But can we add some pain to the comedy? I like my heroes tragical, yet quippy. :-)

erendis | February 27, 02:39 CET

No, no, she was a Doll. ;-)

Now there's a plot bunny. I may steal that :)

redeem147 | February 27, 03:21 CET

"Considering how much James has to offer, I have to wonder what to think about a show that couldn't or wouldn't make use of his talents. Without A Trace had him on for a while, but the story went nowhere so they ditched the storyline and moved on without him. I think it says more about their limitations than his abilities, so after giving them a bit more of a chance, I wound up finding something else to watch.
Scraggles | February 26, 17:42 CET "

Actually Without A Trace wanted him for more, but he signed up for Dragonball instead. He's said they were a little upset with him because of that.
He was brilliant on it, but what a boring show. Glad he chose Dragonball.

Xane | February 27, 04:44 CET

I agree with everything snot said about Riley. I liked seeing Buffy in a completely different type of relationship, and I thought he was likable (and kinda hunky) right up until he started whining about not getting enough attention. I felt much sorrier for Groo when Cordelia didn't return his passion.

jcs | February 27, 07:26 CET

I would absolutely love to see James again on a regular basis on TV. Although he does 'normal' well (think Without a Trace, PS I Love You), he is superb when his character has a bit more to play with (ala Buffy, Angel, Torchwood) in all dimensions (comedy, angst, sexy, etc).

baxter | February 27, 11:03 CET

But, snot monster, I'm not sure you can fault Riley on the timing. When he left, Joyce wasn't "still dying," she was officially out of danger (unless I'm forgetting something).

Yeah, "still dying" is an unfair way to put it. On the other hand, she was just out of hospital after major brain surgery (I mean, "Into the Woods" begins with Joyce coming out of surgery!). Even if we give Riley the utmost benefit of the doubt and say that no one mentioned to him that the doctors have told Buffy that there remains a risk that she could drop dead at any moment, you'd have to be a class-A moron not to know that no one can be pronounced "out of danger" a day after they've had a brain tumor removed.

No, whatever way you slice it, Riley's actions in "Into the Woods" are the actions of an utterly self-centered jerk.

snot monster from outer space | February 27, 18:35 CET

February 26 2009