That's pretty matter of fact. Still keeping my fingers crossed.

cabri | March 06, 09:02 CET

I didn't think "launching two new dramas" had anything to do with Dollhouse. I thought it was Fringe and Lie to Me. All I saw re: Dollhouse was

Advertisers have liked the shows. Both shows are doing well on a c7 basis. It's too early to rule them out.

[ edited by The One True b!X on 2009-03-06 09:09 ]

The One True b!X | March 06, 09:08 CET

Except they launched three new dramas, and neglected to mention one. I've cut them a lot of slack, but it bugs me that they obviously favor Fringe and Lie to Me so much more. Practically every show they launch gets a massive lead in. Dollhouse gets nada. That's what's not fair. Whatever. Obviously it'll have to scratch and claw its own way.

hacksaway | March 06, 09:14 CET

Er. Now I assumed it was Lie to Me and Dollhouse he was talking about because they launched Fringe last fall. Maybe I'm just optimistic.

cabri | March 06, 09:26 CET

Well, this past Fall is still "this season". (I was just sort of assuming that he wouldn't refer to something that's "too early to rule out" as "successful".)

The One True b!X | March 06, 09:30 CET

While I assumed since he was talking about the House move he meant recently.

cabri | March 06, 09:33 CET

This may be a dumb question, but what does "a c7 basis" mean?

ShanshuBugaboo | March 06, 09:42 CET

Well, I consider this good news. Round about when will we get a more definite answer of a renewal or cancellation? I need to know when that would be to get some anxiety medicine in advance... he he

Wimpie | March 06, 09:43 CET

The phrase "too early to rule out" is discouraging. I am hopeful that it'll pick up viewers as the season progresses, though.

jkalderash | March 06, 09:46 CET

This was not a vote of confidence and he really never answered the question definitively. That was a hedge.

Dana5140 | March 06, 09:49 CET

Interesting to note that Kevin Reilly will be played by Jack Coleman in "Fox! The Musical".



Something that the fans will seize upon for optimism.

Simon | March 06, 09:57 CET

I assume C7 is an extension of C3, which is, I believe, Commercial viewing over three days, so the same but over seven?

[ edited by The One True b!X on 2009-03-06 09:58 ]

The One True b!X | March 06, 09:58 CET

It is too early to tell. Seemed pretty honest to me.

TamaraC | March 06, 09:59 CET

Yep, that's what I'm thinking too, b!X. He vaguely confirms what Nick C has been saying all along: Dollhouse's commercial viewing is good. That's all advertisers care about. Whether that's enough for Fox, we'll see.

wiesengrund | March 06, 10:52 CET

I think we're in the "wait and see" phase, but if advertisers are happy, Fox are happy. Let's hope it lasts.

Perseo | March 06, 11:00 CET

TV by the numbers' Bill Gorman translates this as "We’re close to ruling them out."

wiesengrund | March 06, 11:52 CET

yeah, it's not a vote of confidence. Or, I didn't take it as such.

nyrk | March 06, 11:58 CET

I'm not going to read this as positive or negative. I believe it is too early to decide Dollhouse's fate and I think it will be a close decision either way.

theclynn | March 06, 12:05 CET

I think it's an honest answer. While it's a long shot for Dollhouse to be renewed at this point, they said they would give the show 13 episodes to find an audience and if they said now that the show is not going to be renewed, it would be difficult for the show to actually find an audience and ratings would drop for sure. The ratings for Pushing Daisies dropped, once it was announced that ABC was not going to order more episodes for the second season. The show needs to pick up some more viewers though, it's vital to the show's survival. While FOX probably tends to cancellation right now, an uptick in viewership would make them think about it.

There are many things that speak against a second season of Dollhouse, but there also a few things that speak for a second season of Dollhouse. While the ratings are not good, the show has the luck to be on Friday nights (ha!) where nothing besides CBS shows works really well. If Dollhouse had aired on another night, it would need to have twice the audience it has now to be even considered a bubble show, but on Friday nights the expectations are lower and the show still has some time to gain some viewers. The third episode of the show had nearly the same demos which the reality shows had that aired in that timeslot before Dollhouse. While reality shows are cheaper to produce, they are not well liked by advertisers. Advertisers prefer scripted programming, because they think they can reach a more educated audience with a better income, so advertisers might still be willing to pay more money for having their ads shown during Dollhouse, even though the show has the same demos which the reality shows had.

That he thinks of "Fringe" and "Lie To Me" as his network's breaout-hits is understandable, even though they got a lot of life-support by being on the air after "American Idol"/"House".

I think of "Terminator" as pretty much done, "Dollhouse" is likely to be done, but in case of "Dollhouse", I also think it's more likely to get another chance. "Terminator" had 18 million viewers for its series premiere and 7-8 million viewers during its first season. The show got a decent shot to become a hit, Dollhouse didn't.

Donnie | March 06, 12:20 CET

Wiesengrund, how strange or uncharacteristic of Tvbythenumbers to interpret it that way:-)

Perseo | March 06, 12:27 CET

The vagueness does bother me, But mostly what I could do was just hope for the best.

Numfar PTB | March 06, 12:40 CET

Bah. Just a fancy way of saying 'no comment'.

Sly | March 06, 13:33 CET

It's a fancy way of saying TSCC is done and we haven't decided on Dollhouse.

zeitgeist | March 06, 13:56 CET

zeitgeist is absolutely correct.

gossi | March 06, 14:03 CET

They are axing TSCC?
Pushing Daisies gone, Dr Who will have a mid-mid season, now what?

Brasilian Chaos Man | March 06, 14:24 CET

Who is this Nick C we keep hearing about? I've never seen him post.

Squishy | March 06, 14:46 CET

I think he's a poster on the TV by the numbers forum who may or may not have "inside information".

nyrk | March 06, 14:59 CET

Eliza just called in to my local radio station. She sounded pretty damn half asleep. LOL. She was watching ESPN while she was talking to the DJs.

edcsLover9 | March 06, 15:18 CET

What was she seing?
Please not a strange thing like baseball.

Brasilian Chaos Man | March 06, 15:43 CET

That TV by the Numbers link is pretty sad--Dollhouse, Life, Terminator, and maybe even Chuck? :(
Guess I'll get more reading done next year.

jcs | March 06, 15:52 CET

Or soccer/footie ;). I kid, but strange to one country is normal to another. Eliza did DATE a pitcher and is a known fan of her hometown Red Sox.

zeitgeist | March 06, 16:14 CET

That TV by the Numbers link is pretty sad--Dollhouse, Life, Terminator, and maybe even Chuck? :(
Guess I'll get more reading done next year.

Seriously, that'll wipe out the only scripted shows I watch (all but Terminator), since this is BSG's last season.

swanjun | March 06, 16:24 CET

Thanks zeitgeist
And I refer Footall. If I'll go be colonized better be from the source :)

Brasilian Chaos Man | March 06, 16:26 CET

:) Nice! As someone once said - "Some people juggle geese...".

Of course he also said "I'm a leaf on the wind."

zeitgeist | March 06, 16:32 CET

Guys, it's really to early to tell.

The later ratings will be the most important. These early ratings don't mean anything.

The only think we can do for now is wait. Don't be desperate over nothing.

Rikardo | March 06, 16:35 CET

"Of course he also said "I'm a leaf on the wind.""

The last time he tried to say it, he was rather rudely interrupted.

DisChunk | March 06, 16:36 CET

Yes, inanimate objects can be SO rude. Also, the early ratings don't "mean nothing". A 0.6 would mean quite a lot :)

zeitgeist | March 06, 16:38 CET

I don't think there's any reason for panicking yet. Yet. I hope the ratings do improve over time and that the season finale will be paired with AI for major ratings.

Off-topic: I just made a Dollhouse fanvid, if anyone's interested.

J.I.G. | March 06, 16:40 CET

By the time the season finale is shown, I imagine the renewal decision will have already been made an announced.

Septimus | March 06, 16:46 CET

Go Red Sox!

The One True b!X | March 06, 17:04 CET

Septimus, by the time the finale airs the renewal decision will definitely have been made. I believe they will be making it over the next month or so. I doubt they will announce it. They have to decide before the end of April due to May sweeps, pilot season for the sets, contractual reasons for the writers & certain options for cast members come up.

[ edited by gossi on 2009-03-06 17:11 ]

gossi | March 06, 17:11 CET

I give baseball a point for being great in many movies, even those with Kevin Costner (we are allowed to say good things about him here? :), what football is never, but as a sport it Sox :)

By the time the season finale is shown, I imagine the renewal decision will have already been made an announced.

Septimus

I hope so, or they won't have much time for production.

Brasilian Chaos Man | March 06, 17:12 CET

Does anyone know if FOX have any new plans for Dollhouse on the 20th? I'm sure they realize that the BSG finale will have a pretty big impact on Dollhouse's ratings.

Racoon Boy | March 06, 17:22 CET

If Fox really wanted to take a chance with Dollhouse, it would pair it with Bones on Thursday and see what happens. They could even test it out the week of March 20th. If the ratings are good, they could keep it there and see if it does better. Please please please let this show pull something close to an X-Files! (Except for the crappy last 3 years.)

But I'm not going to worry about this. Que sera, sera. I'm going to enjoy what we have, do my part in buying the episodes on itunes (for what that's worth), and deal with it when there's official news to actually react to.

I want Dollhouse to be an enjoyable experience, and worrying about it's fate doesn't make it so.

electricspacegirl | March 06, 18:30 CET

Racoon Boy, I totally over stepped every fanboy boundary ever and spoke a FOX exec about that. Yeah, seriously. I asked them to pair it with American Idol. Yeah, seriously. I'm an idiot, but I think it's a solid plan. And we all know idiots are all the rage. Wait, they put Obama in charge? My time is over. Argh. ARGH.

Space Girl, your plan is sane and good. And your skin is electric.

[ edited by gossi on 2009-03-06 18:32 ]

gossi | March 06, 18:31 CET

Bones is also having problems, having shed more than 20% of its audience. This would not really be a great pairing.

Dana5140 | March 06, 18:48 CET

Most shows are down, many significantly. Comedy is, on the whole, up.

gossi | March 06, 18:52 CET

"Comedy is, on the whole, up."

Joss has fabulous timing.

Caroline | March 06, 19:44 CET

Is this a tide change? Last two seasons dramas have been all the rage.

electricspacegirl | March 06, 19:47 CET

The economy is in the sh*tter. People want to laugh. (And to not have to follow from week to week.)

[ edited by The One True b!X on 2009-03-06 19:56 ]

The One True b!X | March 06, 19:55 CET

I turn on my TV to be entertained at the moment. That's not to say I don't follow drama - I watch Lost, for example - but I mostly follow drama with emotional connection and hope right now. (Oddly enough, I liked the last episode of Lost. A lot).

I'm more The Office and 30 Rock than Battlestar at the moment. I don't know why. Well, with The Office - Pam and Jim. I'm going down with that ship.

[ edited by gossi on 2009-03-06 20:04 ]

gossi | March 06, 20:03 CET

I get a lot more out of The Office than just Pam & Jim, although I love 'em and how often does a pairing stay that palatable when a series is in its fifth season ?(although to put it in perspective, it was like two, three seasons of build-up) But yes, good comedy is very valuable. Haven't checked out 30 Rock yet, will rent after finishing Weeds, in the second season of that right now. Flight of the Conchords is my other comedy--with the added bonus of being a musical--for the past couple years.

And I know everyone goes nuts over the big Locke episodes like last week's (me included, when they're really good, 'cause let's face it they're not always--example: drug commune ep), but yeah me too, I liked this week's Lost a ton. I'm more invested in the on-island happenings than most of the Oceanic 6, but luckily they've married those plotlines back together.

My mom liked Dollhouse's premiere and she's a procedural nut to the core (she watches all the CSIs, Criminal Minds, and I think some Law & Order: SVU on occasion) and she watches American Idol religiously. Like everyone's been saying, they would be very wise to air a few eps of Dollhouse after that series if they wanna see it grow (too bad they missed a big chance with last week's music-featuring ep, but they can always repeat it), they will very easily catch folks like my mom.

My dad liked it well enough too I think, he watches just about everything Joss. Neither of the parents have made the effort to tune into anything after the premiere though, Friday is not a TV-friendly night for a couple who goes to the movies or does family stuff regularly.

Kris | March 06, 20:32 CET

What did they say? :)

wiesengrund | March 06, 20:32 CET

I'm waiting for FOX to air the really good mid-later episodes of Dollhouse to see if the ratings improve before I start thinking Dollhouse's chances of being renewed are slim. Renewal also depends on what pilots FOX picks up for the 2009-2010 season.

Little Green Kid | March 06, 21:13 CET

I'm still sad they haven't picked up "Virtuality" yet...

J Linc | March 06, 23:16 CET

I have to say I really don't understand how having Dollhouse be on after American Idol would be a good thing. Do people really not change a channel? Maybe its because I am a music snob, and my friends are snobs, so I don't know anyone who watches American Idol, but do people really just leave the TV on after a show you like? I cannot fathom such behavior, I either have my TV schedule planned out religiously (problematic when there is a birthday party starting at the same time as Dollhouse tonight... grr), or flip around until I find a show that I know.

Am I just not the average TV viewer? I'd like to think so, of course, but does anyone here actually know people that follow the apparently popular notion of 'lead ins'?

I'm also very frustrated with Fox's support for Fringe. I tried the show, and while I loved the crazy father played by Denethor, the main character just wasn't interesting, and medical mysteries aren't nearly as fun as say crazy alien stuff or polar bears on tropical islands. Its inconceivable to me that people criticize Eliza's acting but not the Fringe lead's horrid American accent and sort of blandness.

[ edited by SteppeMerc on 2009-03-06 23:50 ]

[ edited by SteppeMerc on 2009-03-06 23:50 ]

SteppeMerc | March 06, 23:47 CET

l totally agree with little green kid wait 4 the ratings 2 come up and if it gets a full season then rejoice although according to the fox president things are starting look up 4 TTSCC and dollhouse

zee | March 06, 23:52 CET

although according to the fox president things are starting look up 4 TTSCC and dollhouse

It really doesn't say that.

The One True b!X | March 07, 00:04 CET

do people really just leave the TV on after a show you like?

I think it's the "coming up!" / "stay tuned for!" effect. Lots of eyeballs are watching AI, many of those eyeballs get pitched the easiest possible sell for watching a new program: "just sit still, leave the remote alone, and we'll bring it to you" (i.e., not "hey, plan to go watch this new show later in the week when you might be doing something else and when you'll have forgotten all about it and what time it's on etc").

I don't imagine that it makes much difference for most people, but it would only need to work on a fraction of the AI audience to make a big difference to Dollhouse's numbers.

Not that I think they should do it. I think bouncing shows around the schedule is usually a sure sign of their imminent demise.

snot monster from outer space | March 07, 00:43 CET

Do people really not change a channel?

Amazing as it may seem some people don't. We know this because you just have to look at the ratings for shows that follow highly rated shows and then when they air without the big lead-in. I suspect much of it is that people are likely to stay put if the next programme interests them a little but might forget it was there if they weren't already watching the channel. Of course, airing after something like AI doesn't mean automatic success, I seem to recall Marti's big post Buffy show got that spot and still sunk without trace for instance.

helcat | March 07, 00:47 CET

SteppeMerc said:




I feel the exact same way. I gave it three episodes or so before I just stopped bothering.

theclynn | March 07, 00:55 CET

Although one is further along than the other so it's not really fair to compare the two, I have to admit I am enjoying "Fringe" somewhat more than "Dollhouse" thus far.

J Linc | March 07, 02:00 CET

Does anyone know if it's possible to buy Dollhouse episodes from itunes or Amazon from outisde the US?

Also, does anyone know an alternative to Hotspot Shields that won't slow my computer down to a ridiculous extent?

Let Down | March 07, 05:02 CET

Yeah, I've been asking myself the same questions, Let Down. Any experts here?

wiesengrund | March 07, 12:28 CET

You can register a US iTunes account by using a US address. Any works. You can even use Apple's address. Or a hotel, whatever.

Then either get a US prepaid visa card - you can get them online - which will let you buy episodes fine. Or go on eBay and buy US iTunes vouchers. After you've got a voucher code, hit "Redeem" in the store - hey presto, you have balance on your account. Works a charm.

If anybody is wondering, with regards to pairing Dollhouse with American Idol: nope. It's not going to happen. That TVByTheNumbers guy Nick C is, as often happens, wrong.

[ edited by gossi on 2009-03-07 12:45 ]

gossi | March 07, 12:44 CET

If anybody is wondering, with regards to pairing Dollhouse with American Idol: nope. It's not going to happen. That TVByTheNumbers guy Nick C is, as often happens, wrong.

What did he say about a Dollhouse/AI-pairing? As far as I remember he only said what we all were saying: "It would do wonders." or something to that effect.

ETA: Nick C tranlastes Reilly's statement differently than Gorman, because Terminator is basically dead in the water:



I do agree that ruling Terminator out is out of the question.

[ edited by wiesengrund on 2009-03-07 13:35 ]

wiesengrund | March 07, 13:32 CET