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April 01 2009

Spike vs. Edward - who would win in a fight? James Marsters diplomatically tries to settle that Buffy/Twilight question.

I've never read the Twilight series or watched the movie, I mean I started reading it, but I got five chapters in and I just couldn't finish it, it was so horrible. It was written as if some 12 year old wrote his/her favourite fan fiction and it got published.

It steams my broccoli that people try to compare Buffy to Twilight. It even makes me a tad more angrier when people say that Edward or Bella could kick Buffy or Angel or Spike's ass. Like hell they could. Edward and Bella would be in little pieces in the trash can within 2 minutes.
Stupid question, since even Xander could take Edward in a fight.
Oh James, you are far too PC! Spike would mop the floor with Edward! And then laugh about it.
Ok, I've been a loyal Buffy fan since the beginning and I read all the Twilight series books. I know who would win. Spike! Duh...

Buffy was a trained VAMPIRE SLAYER and Spike lived to fight against/with her all the time. Obviously he can handle himself against 1 teenage vampire who drinks animal blood making him weaker in a fight.

But it would be funny to see them both drunk, Spike reading his poetry and Edward playing the piano to it..
At first, I was reading the post title and thinking, Edward, who the heck is Edward? And then I laughed, cause there's no question that Spike would knock Edward into the next century. And then some.
Astronauts, definitely.
Well, if you want to go full-geek about it, it's actually an unfair question. It's like who would win, "Star Wars" ships or "Star Trek" ships -- if you actually dig into the mythology, the "Star Trek" ships are like a bazillion times faster and better armed.

Same problem here -- Spike is infinitely cooler than Edward. But, Meyer's mythology has preposterously overpowered vampires who are immune to sunlight, their bodies are basically granite so they can't be staked, they move faster than human beings can even identify, etc. The power-scale is tipped definitively in favor of Meyer's vampires (which is part of why her vampire mythos is so lousy). If there was a way to normalize the scale between them, if we just said "vampire = vampire" and ignore the mythological differences, Spike would pulverize him. As would Angel. Unfortunately, the mythologies being what they are, Edward would probably pull Spike's head off before he actually realized the fight had started.
Edward could win...

...If it were Anita Blake's Edward.
I can't believe anyone thinks a fictional vampire could win against a real one.
Depends. Is this a remake of High Noon?
If it was, would it not be "pile of vampire dust vs sparkly person"?
Bwah! Thanks, b!X.
"Star Trek" ships are like a bazillion times faster and better armed.


Yeah, but SW had the Death Star!
However, a Borg cube could kick that ball.
As I see it, Spike would kick his ass. But if they were to have a 'whine-off' regarding their mortal loves, ehhhh..... Too close to call. :)
While I admit that I did enjoy reading the Twilight series, and like Edward's character (the movie is an entirely different story, however), I think it's no question that Edward is nothing in comparison to Spike. Clearly, Spike would win in a fight!
The "scale" problem beats the popularity. Wizard magazine had a great illustration of this a few months back -- who would win between Wolverine and Superman? "Well, after Superman burnt all the flesh off Wolverine's skeleton and kicked him into outer space..."

Still, go Spike if it ever went down.

[ edited by KingofCretins on 2009-04-01 21:25 ]
Caveman Spike!
Edward could win...

...If it were Anita Blake's Edward.

Bwa hahahahaha! Holy crap, yes, Brasilian Chaos Man. *goes back to reading the trashy Anita Blake books*
I just want to be a fly on the wall for the mocking. No one mocks quite so well as Spike.
I thought Edward was more of an Angel rip off but..
go Spike!
Hell of a lot more fighting experience and he looks cool kicking ass! He'd thrash Edward, if not physically, he'd just mock him to death - that would be hilarious to watch! Doubt Edward could read his mind (Buffy couldn't read Angel's in 'Earshot')

This would make a great fanfic!
Umm... how is this even a question? Seems pretty obviously Spike.
I'd rather see the Angel vs. Edward showdown, if the idea is a battle between parallel characters. Edward always struck me as much more reminiscent of Angel than Spike (in a thoroughly Gary Stu-ified way), what with the brooding and self-depreciation. And their fight would go like this.
I can't believe anyone thinks a fictional vampire could win against a real one.

LOL.
I can't believe anyone thinks a fictional vampire could win against a real one.

I second jcs's LOL :).
I miss Spike. I want him back.
Taaroko - hehe! I'd pay to watch that!
KingofCretins | April 01, 21:24 CET:

The "scale" problem beats the popularity. Wizard magazine had a great illustration of this a few months back -- who would win between Wolverine and Superman? "Well, after Superman burnt all the flesh off Wolverine's skeleton and kicked him into outer space..."


But if you had Spike in the Twilight universe, with the powers of a native, he'd kick Edward's arse. If you put Edward in the Buffyverse, with the powers of a native, Spike'd still kick Edward's arse. It's only if you do the apples/undead comparison that things favor the new kid.

Superman vs. Wolverine would be unfair in either universe unless it was discovered that Adamantium is made of Kryptonite or something.
I love that James Marsters refers to Spike as "I".

“It’s usually the guy who connects first. If Edward swung first and I wasn’t looking in the right direction…”
I haven't read Twilight, but Edward seems more supernatural from what you guys have been saying; so wouldn't it be more accurate to compare Buffy to Edward?

Whatever. Spike would win.
That really depends on how hard Spike is laughing when he discovers that Edward sparkles in sunlight.
Scale problem is still there if it's Buffy vs. Edward. But in either world's homefield, Grotesk is right, Spike wins as would Buffy.

Here's the thing... and this is touched on very well in Buffy 8.15 with Dracula when If you normalize the rules, you have Spike, who is a fighter. A warrior. A killer, dyed in the wool. Edward is an intellectual, he studies things and composes music and so on. Yeah, Spike has his poetry, but that's a distant, remote interest compared to Edward. Spike is a killer, Edward is only a predator for the purposes of eating. Spike or Angel or Darla or any of the other blooded *killers* in the Buffyverse would tear any of the Cullens to pieces, except for perhaps Emmett, who Meyer depicts as a fighter by nature.
Spike would win, and Angel would win even more. :)

Not a Twilight hater. I really enjoyed the story and film. The writing isn't great, that's for sure. However, the story is darn good, and hats off to the film director--no surprise to me she's been replaced. The film was totally true to the book and well-made on a low budget. Some elements of the film were better than in the book. For example, Bella's classmates were just there in the book, but really came to life in the film.

I was watching the film last night and was totally reminded of Angel's broodiness. Edward's a great character, but no Angel. Angel would so kick his arse.
except for perhaps Emmett, who Meyer depicts as a fighter by nature.

King, Jasper is a soldier by nature who shows everyone some serious tactical fighting moves. I'd say he's even more lethal than Emmett in terms of moves because he spent the first decades of his vampire life in a constant state of war.
I've never read any of the Twilight books but I have seen the film and think Edward is more Angel like than Spike.

As for who would win in a fight?Based on the mythology of the Buffyverse vs. the Twilight movie(again,I have not read the books),I think the Twilight vampires are more powerful but I think Spike has more fighting experience and could pull off a win through that.Same with Angel for that matter.

[ edited by Buffyfantic on 2009-04-02 00:22 ]
Forgot about Jasper... really, who are we kidding, *none* of Meyer's vampires, not even the bad ones, project the sense of physicality or fighting skill of vampires in the Buffyverse.
To put it in perspective... picture a fight between Dru and Alice, the black-haired seers with a past of mental instability. Dru would snap her neck in three seconds flat, n'est-ce pas? Hence, Spike wins. Easily. And then lights a cigarette from Edward's dusty/flamey remains.
Actually, Alice is the only thing I'm going to give Meyer's franchise. I think Alice is cooler than Dru. In a fight, yes, Dru wins, because, again -- killer vs. not a killer. But Alice is awesome.
Brasilian Chaos Man said:

Yeah, but SW had the Death Star!
However, a Borg cube could kick that ball.


LMAO

My local chapter of Fan Force is plotting out a Borg vs. Death Star fanfilm...
Wait.. on a Joss Whedon site most of you think the Whedonverse character will win?

...color me shocked.
I'm baffled as to how anyone could think that the Star Trek ships, the majority of which are not even war ships (at least Federation ships, they just seem to explore and have only one torpedo and phaser cannon), could stand up for more than a second against the might of the Imperial Navy, especially an Imperial Star Destroyer, with its masses of turbolasers, numerous fighters, and such.

Oh sorry, I'm supposed to be focusing my rage towards the Spike versus sparkly boy debate, right? Spike has a trenchcoat. That he took off of a dead slayer. Doesn't get much cooler than that.
While I'm completely biased for Spike & uninformed on Edward, I thought this was a nice way to sum up Spike:

Whereas Spike was addicted to fighting. That’s how he defined himself. I would think that Spike has a little more experience.

Nicely put.

And all hail Borg cube!
killer vs. not a killer. But Alice is awesome.

Alice was certainly vicious enough when she ripped off the vamps head in the final fight scene of Twilight. This is like saying Buffy is less dangerous than a vampire because she has a conscience or isn't a killer. As for Dru's killing experience, it means she's able to kill humans very easily. But when matched against equals, she has to resort on her mystical powers of thrall more so. Dru in combat skills against Alice? I'd actually go with Alice there.

I think the main difference between the two is that Meyer's vampires don't rely on martial arts skills and moves because they're already so supernaturally strong and fast. Why would they need flashy moves? It's just difficult to compare the two. But I agree that based on fighting experience, Angel and Spike would come out ahead if they were vampire = vampire in terms of supernatural ability.
At work I was told to be the host for our midnight Twilight party, and when we ran out of activities (very very very fast) we did brackets. It came down to Edward vs. Angel (not Angelus!) and all the little tweenies voted for Angel. YAY! I think that just proves how much better our vamps are than Meyers'.
It is interesting that James's niece thought that Edward was Spike-ish. When I first read Twilight I couldn't help but wonder if Ms. Meyer had deliberately 'borrowed' heavily from the Buffy/Angel story but when I read 'Midnight Sun' (Twilight from Edward's perspective, written by Meyer and available on her website) I was struck by the similarities between Spike and Edward. Oh, and I think Spike would win the fight too. Easily.
Spike versus Edward, who would win?

Da Bears!
I was being diplomatic -- Alice is more aggressive than Dru, and I suspect Rosalie would dispatch her pretty readily, too. It is a Whedon site, after all.

I don't think the Buffy example is apt -- she doesn't kill people, no, but she's a remorseless killer of demons and vampires, she's as much a "killer" in that context as any vampire.
Well, it's not like Alice felt any remorse at killing those who threatened her family. I think it's pretty clear that Meyer's vampires also have a built-in aggression and while the family might be 'vegetarian', it doesn't divorce them from their killer instincts. If Buffy is remorseless in killing demons and vampires, how about how vicious the Cullens are hunting grizzly bears and wild animals for fun? Even Spike was scared of the bear in Pangs (for comedic purposes, of course). Where as Emmett thinks they're fun to scrapple with and the tastiest treat.

Better skilled fighters? Buffyverse hands down. But in terms of deadly instincts? They seem pretty well-matched to me, though soulless vamps in the Buffyverse again have the edge on evil.
I always thought the hunting grizzly bears vs. stags or anything else made little sense -- Meyer made her vampires far too invincible to ordinary threats for it to matter a damn bit what her vampires hunted. Seriously, the only things that were ever shown to even remotely damage them were either wolves or each other, both of which are supernatural. I don't consider Emmett hunting bears or Edward hunting lions to require anymore viciousness or courage or predatory skill than Fraggles hunting Doozer construction sites. Blame the bad mythology.
Maybe we should swap Spike with Harmony, and make this really interesting.
Arsenal OMGLOL! Great, now I've got a mental image of the Slap Fight of Harmony vs. Xander with Edward in Xander's place.

Throw in a bit of the Stooge Fight between Sam & Diane, and you'll have 'em rolling in the aisles.

Ohhhh...a serious fight? Pffft! Who killed 2 Slayers and lived to tell about it? Who slaughtered several villages just for the fun of it? Who drove a young woman insane, and then turned her?

Who's gonna rip off Pretty Boy's head and play a mad game of Keep Away with it?

Spike and Angel! That's who!
Ah, so we're getting vicious now, Arsenal?

Spike by a mile. Angelus by a mile. Angel... by 5/8th of a mile.

Buffy by four or five miles, and she wouldn't even have to stake or decapitate; she'd win by mockery alone.
What MamEnoughtoAdmit It said. ;)
When I first read Twilight I couldn't help but wonder if Ms. Meyer had deliberately 'borrowed' heavily from the Buffy/Angel story...


According to this article that we discussed back in August 2007, Stephenie Meyer claims never to have watched 'Buffy'. Uh-huh.

Also, bix's words...
I can't believe anyone thinks a fictional vampire could win against a real one.


..should SO go on a shirt!
There is also another recent James interview on MTV here where he talks a bit about Buffy as well.
Edward has Superman-speed, granite skin and can rip trees out of the ground. Of course, if Spike gets a hold of a very, very, hard (possibly magical) axe I guess he might have a chance to maim Edward.

Maaaaybe....

[ edited by Skytteflickan88 on 2009-04-02 14:06 ]

[ edited by Skytteflickan88 on 2009-04-02 14:12 ]
Ok Spike is like the coolest of cool but Edward is just to die for, literally :)
Spike would not only win but drive Bella insane just to give Dru something to play with.

How can someone write a vampire/love story and not have watched Buffy before? Maybe if she wrote the story in the 80's..
I have read all the Twilight books, and the Breaking Dawn was so boring it took 3 tries before I finished it. The movie was beautiful and did follow the book, but was very disappointed with who they got to play Edward, not at all as I had him pictured, in fact the only characters I liked were Bella, Alice, James and Jacob. Since vampire minds can not be read, Spike would clean the floor with Edward, now if the whole family jumped in it might be different. Love the picture of Spike that says "I don't need to Sparkle"..great stuff.

Love this. *goes back to reading the trashy Anita Blake books* I have been using these books as a S*X HOW TO. LOL
I can't imagine why Edward and Spike would even get into a fight unless Spike's gone evil again. Maybe Spike got jealous because he really wants to sparkle?

I think the sparkles are very pretty and the movie was cute. Love our Universe more though. Way more.
Spike for the win. The universe of Twilight does not make any sense, it's more of a parody of Buffy then anything else.
Those vampires would be rulling the world since they have almost zero weakness. And Edward seemed much more like Angel on Buffy. Spike's closest copy imo was James who did have a cool actor playing him in the movie. James was very much like early Spike, with the evil lover and being an amazing hunter for sport. Which is like Spike's hunt for slayers. That said the movie was ok. As for this fight, you take either vampire to the other's world and Spike always comes out the victor. With godlike powers from the Twilight-verse he would be unstoppable, Edward in Buffyverse would be totally outmatched by a much more experienced warrior,fighter that can be quite cunning,smart when need be.
Was I the only one who read "Spike vs. Eddard"? Yeah, probably... But Eddard Stark, weilding Ice, might have a chance of cutting off Spike's head before... well, you know.
Eddard Stark could indeed win. But knowing him he'll do something dumb and honorable, allowing Spike the upper hand.

Now the Kingslayer (pre Hoat run in) versus Spike would be quite interesting. Which blonde badass with a secret good inside them will win?
Oh James, so diplomatic...why didn't you just say:

I can't believe anyone thinks a fictional vampire could win against a real one.


(thanks b!x, this was..perfect)

Btw, CAVEMEN!!
Spike for the win. The universe of Twilight does not make any sense, it's more of a parody of Buffy then anything else.
Those vampires would be rulling the world since they have almost zero weakness. And Edward seemed much more like Angel on Buffy. Spike's closest copy imo was James who did have a cool actor playing him in the movie. James was very much like early Spike, with the evil lover and being an amazing hunter for sport. Which is like Spike's hunt for slayers. That said the movie was ok. As for this fight, you take either vampire to the other's world and Spike always comes out the victor. With godlike powers from the Twilight-verse he would be unstoppable, Edward in Buffyverse would be totally outmatched by a much more experienced warrior,fighter that can be quite cunning,smart when need be.



Huh? Which movie?

And I don't think that people assume in this discussion that Edward and Spike would have the same power if they were fighting, no matter which universe they're in. Of course, if Spike and Edward did get the same pysical strength and speed, Spike'd win.

[ edited by Skytteflickan88 on 2009-04-02 21:23 ]
That really depends on how hard Spike is laughing when he discovers that Edward sparkles in sunlight.

Truest thing in here.
If the status remains quo, Ed could stake Spike before Spike even knew he was there. I can vaguely invision an elaborate set up in which Spike takes out an ignorant Ed, but mano a mano our blond bad boy comes out much worse for wear.

All things equalized, Spike would wipe the floor with him.
If all things were equalised, I think it'd be a draw.
Spike would win in a truly equal situation, because he enjoys being the one getting beaten up, too. As long as there's some fighting going down, you know?

[ edited by Sunfire on 2009-04-02 22:03 ]
So Spike would win a draw ? Truly, first among equals.

He does like a brawl though. In fact some sort of fight/drinking game combination that takes place in front of a big screen playing 'Passions' is probably what Spike heaven looks like.
"Huh? Which movie?

And I don't think that people assume in this discussion that Edward and Spike would have the same power if they were fighting, no matter which universe they're in. Of course, if Spike and Edward did get the same pysical strength and speed, Spike'd win."

The Twilight movie, so far there has been only one movie out from that verse.
I apply the laws of the verse to the characters not the other way around. The world the characters inhabit are much greater and coherent then individual characters by themselves.
Vergil, it was mainly this movie line "Spike's closest copy imo was James who did have a cool actor playing him in the movie " that threw me.

And I still don't get what you're saying about the characters and the world. I'm not questioning the greatness of a verse vs the characters in that verse, I'm comparing one verse's fighter(Buffyverse's Spike) vs another verse's fighter(Twilightverse's Edward).

It's like I put them both in a new world, with their differences intact had them fight, but it seemed like you meant that in case Spike was transfered to Twilightverse, he had Edward's strength and speed plus his own experience, which means he would be likely to win.

Did I misunderstand?

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