Whedonesque : Comments on 20365 : "Epitaph One" will be aired on Fox says Dollverse.

O frabjous day!

I'm in the UK so was anticipating the episode to air anyway, but this is still fantastic news in my book. FOX are really treating Dollhouse well, IMO.

brynmars | May 18, 13:44 CET

How exciting! Now that there will be a season 2, I wonder how it will do in ratings... Hopefully better than Omega.

Vortigun | May 18, 13:47 CET

Epitaph One was always going to air internationally and it has nothing to do with the FOX network. The studio always needed a thirteen episode for international distribution and that is the reason why it was filmed in the first place. It wasn't filmed just to put on the Blu-ray set (DVDs are so last year).

Zoic_Fan | May 18, 13:47 CET

Yay. This is good news to all US viewers. Here's hoping it'll pop up before the episode in Sweden. Of course, only the big fans would probably be downloading the episode anyway, if it aired there first; the same people who'd very likely still watch it when airing on FOX to help the show (and who'll buy the DVD afterwards). Still, it'd nontheless make sense to try to air it first.

GVH | May 18, 13:48 CET

Glad that they're reconsidering their decision not to air this episode, my only concern though is that if it does end up airing in July sometime, we can't really expect too much from the ratings for this ep seeing as there are less people watching tv during the summer in general.

SteveJ2008 | May 18, 13:57 CET

As others already said, I was assuming that the episode would air on the UK SciFi anyway but this is still great news for the US fans. Only seems fair they get to see it on television too. Also, this shows another sign of respect for the show from FOX, which is nice to see. We may really have entered a bold new day in the way television networks are run, kids. Good times!

Darkest Soul | May 18, 13:58 CET

Great news. And I'm sure Joss will have one less headache now. With all viewers having a chance to watch Epitaph One planning season 2 should be a lot easier.

Michael | May 18, 14:06 CET

All very interesting really. It's a bit like a u-turn from a month or so ago!

bubblecat | May 18, 14:10 CET

To me it's a better idea to keep Epitaph One for the Blu-ray set. Maybe air it later as part of season 2. Maybe they could air the original pilot as well, as an alternate reality start to season 2, wouldn't that funny?

Zoic_Fan | May 18, 14:13 CET

Maybe they could air the original pilot as well, as an alternate reality start to season 2, wouldn't that funny?

Well, since the used parts from it already, I don't see how that should work out. Also, Joss basically said that while the original pilot came at things differently than the first 5 episode we got, the season was eventually heading in the same direction and ended exactly how he wanted it to end originally.

Also, I think it is weird to do a second season knowing that only a small percentage of your viewers has seen "Epitaph One". It's good to air it so that everyone is on the same page before fall. (I don't think half of the people that watch Dollhouse live on TV will have bought the DVD/Blu-Ray by then. But I'm not that versed in DVD/Blu-Ray sales, could be bogus.)

wiesengrund | May 18, 14:18 CET

The suits must have been very impressed by "Epitaph One"...

Ronald_SF | May 18, 14:20 CET

TV on DVD sales are far fewer than live viewers on broadcast TV, so you're right wiesengrund, only a fractional percentage of viewers would have seen it on DVD come fall.

"Echo", the original pilot, is unairable. In terms of narrative. So that won't happen.

FOX have now paid for "Epitaph One" so it'll air, no idea when.

Ronald, it's my understanding the decision to pick up season two was informed by the quality of "Epitaph One".

[ edited by gossi on 2009-05-18 14:23 ]

gossi | May 18, 14:22 CET

No. This is was a simple business decision. Once they decided to renew, there was a need to ensure that they cut some costs. What better way to do so than to broadcast an already filmed eipisode for which no additional costs need be incurred. They get 13 eps for the price of 12. Win win.

Dana5140 | May 18, 14:23 CET

Except that's wrong, Dana.

gossi | May 18, 14:28 CET

No. This is was a simple business decision. Once they decided to renew, there was a need to ensure that they cut some costs. What better way to do so than to broadcast an already filmed eipisode for which no additional costs need be incurred. They get 13 eps for the price of 12. Win win.

While you could be right, I'm not sure that's completely the case. All reports are that the show was picked up for 13 episodes to air next season. I seriously doubt that they'll hold off on airing Epitaph One until fall and actually air it as part of Season 2, as the dvd set will have been out for months by then and the episode will already be all over the torrent downloads etc. It would be pointless to air it in that case.

Maybe gossi or someone else can confirm, but it would seem to me that they've decided to purchase the rights to this ep IN ADDITION to the 13 eps for next season.

SteveJ2008 | May 18, 14:30 CET

So, it's definitely not part of Season 2? They paid for "Epitaph One" and additionally for 13 new episodes in the fall? Nice.

ETA on preview: Or, what SteveJ2008 said. :)

So, that episode, huh. Olivia Williams is sitting around holding her head, Zoic is freaking out, Joss thinks it's a capper for seven years of awesomeness, and even Fox likes it that much that they let it influence the renewal-decision. That must be one interesting episode.

[ edited by wiesengrund on 2009-05-18 14:33 ]

wiesengrund | May 18, 14:33 CET

Great news but I'm much more impressed that someone has figured out a way to type out loud

Let Down | May 18, 14:43 CET

best. weekend. ever.

alittledarkcorner | May 18, 15:08 CET

This is great news. I can't wait to see this episode.

JMaloney | May 18, 15:11 CET

Hmm, Jennifer Godwin from E Online's "Watch with Kristin" just tweeted this:

Re missing "Epitaph One" episode, Fox currently has "no plans to air #dollhouse this summer." Will let you know if that changes...

http://twitter.com/jennifergodwin/statuses/1835985691

SteveJ2008 | May 18, 15:20 CET

Epitaph One for season two opener, for the win. Stick it at 8pm leading into new DH, that's what I say.

gossi | May 18, 15:22 CET

Epitaph One for season two opener, for the win. Stick it at 8pm leading into new DH, that's what I say.

But then the question becomes, as mentioned earlier, does season 2 then contain 14 eps if Epitaph One is aired to start the new season, or do they decide to cut costs by counting it as one of the 13 and just producing 12 actual new eps?

SteveJ2008 | May 18, 15:32 CET

Well, we'll find out shortly - the FOX upfront starts in 4 hours and includes "Epitaph One" as promo material I understand. As far as I know they've ordered production on 13 new episodes.

gossi | May 18, 15:39 CET

Don't they have a conference call in about an hour too?

wiesengrund | May 18, 15:40 CET

Is there?

gossi | May 18, 15:42 CET

Unless I got the time zone convertion totally wrong...

wiesengrund | May 18, 15:45 CET

Yes, that is correct: about a half hour from now. (It's just about 11:00 here on the East Coast.)

JMaloney | May 18, 15:55 CET

Well, leaking a good episode online often helps a show, the first episodes of Lost, Heroes, Fringe and Battlestar Galactica where all up on bittorent sites before they aired and the positive word of mouth actually helped all these shows get off to very successful starts.

Also as I understand it Epitaph one is a standalone episode that theoretically could be show at any point as part of the series or separately from the series. To me they should use this episode as a way of selling Blu-rays (and DVDs) and not just show it when no one will be watching TV. They should hold off and show it at a better time (as a special episode).

Zoic_Fan | May 18, 16:06 CET

Again, my sense is that they are getting 13 episodes, of which 12 will be new and the 13th will be Epitaph. (I love that this is named after a King Crimson song- proving once again that Joss loves prog rock....... ). Somewhere I read that this was one of the issues on the table, and I am sure it is in one of the several million links we have from the past 6 weeks or so. :-)

Anyway, time will tell.

Dana5140 | May 18, 16:06 CET

I love that this is named after a King Crimson song- proving once again that Joss loves prog rock....... )

You sure about that?

Simon | May 18, 16:08 CET

Hey Dana5140 - a while back you mentioned a prog rock band you really like. While prog's far from my favourite genre your description of the band sounded really awesome. Just wondering what it was called. Thanks :)

Let Down | May 18, 16:11 CET

Hmm, I just googled 'King Crimson Epitaph One' and apparently there's a King Crimson song called 'Epitaph' but since that's, you know, a word I don't think it's a reference

Let Down | May 18, 16:13 CET

Wow, that's great news!!! I'm in shock. First the renewal and then this news. I'm just not used to all this good news about shows I like. I'm just used to hearing how they renewed another CSI show or another legal procedural.

Cant wait for Epi-taffy-One...Bring on the Cheese-man!

alexreager | May 18, 16:15 CET

"Also, Dollhouse season two. I just wanted to type those words out loud. "

mmmm echoey of Obama-day :)

Showers | May 18, 16:17 CET

While I agree it would be nonsensicle to air the episode after the DVD has been out and shown internationally looking at ABC's handling of Pushing Daisies (and Eli Stone and DSM) its possible. The last three episodes of PD have aired in several countries and the Season 2 boxset is even out in the UK a week before the first of the final free airs in the US.

Granted its a different network but...I dunno, I'm still in pain about PD I suppose.

Good news about the episode though, now give us a good air date. Its been just over a week and I'm already itching for it.

Ashley | May 18, 16:23 CET

I seriously doubt that Epitaph One will air until the fall. I also doubt that it is part of the 13 ep order.

TamaraC | May 18, 16:27 CET

Would they take it off the DVD, do you think?

Jobo | May 18, 16:30 CET

Jobo, no.

gossi | May 18, 16:33 CET

Dollhouse season two, Bones renewed for not one, but 2 seasons, and now they'll air Epitaph One. Wow. Fox are actually doing things right for once!

Fingers crossed that they keep it up!

Shep | May 18, 16:46 CET

This news just kind of makes me LOL.

UnpluggedCrazy | May 18, 16:50 CET

Excellent news! I had a feeling they'd consider airing the episode after renewing the show.

Ameer | May 18, 17:02 CET

I can't wait to see Epitaph One, myself. Wonder when it will air. Will we get an Epitaph Two at the end of season 2? ;-)

Ashley, I'm still in pain about Pushing Daisies too. I really feel like the second season of that show was greatly mishandled. I really loved that show.

AnotherFireflyfan | May 18, 17:13 CET

I can't wait to see Epitaph One, myself. Wonder when it will air. Will we get an Epitaph Two at the end of season 2? ;-)

That's actually been my theory for some time, sans wink.

The One True b!X | May 18, 17:15 CET

Ditto, b!X.

gossi | May 18, 17:16 CET

I do think that's just about the coolest idea I've ever heard. Having the season finale of each year be a separate story that's continued, 40 minutes at a time, every year? Assuming that's how it'd play out, of course. It's a neat idea. Has it been done before?

Jobo | May 18, 17:18 CET

How many times can Fox air it? It seems like around now would be good, with the load of publicity the show's getting. But I'm also hoping, maybe unrealistically, that they'll do a build-up/marathon/preview thingy before season two, like the cable networks do with their original shows. Epitaph One would be great for that, too.

[ edited by dreamlogic on 2009-05-18 17:21 ]

dreamlogic | May 18, 17:20 CET

Unless I'm missing something, this article mentions nothing about FOX airing or even considering airing "Epitaph One." It's all about Dollhouse airing in Australia and Sweden. The only mention of FOX airing "Epitaph One" is simply the author's wish.

Invisible Green | May 18, 17:29 CET

No, the wish part is the suggestion on when. Linked site is not the only place that's been reporting "Epitaph One" will air. It's just that no one knows when.

[ edited by The One True b!X on 2009-05-18 17:31 ]

The One True b!X | May 18, 17:31 CET

I wrote the linked thing. I know FOX have picked up the episode, 'cos they told me that.

gossi | May 18, 17:44 CET

Without this new US air date, what country will air it first? Sweden?

Brasilian Chaos Man | May 18, 17:57 CET

Can't wait!

Although Fox is obviously doing this for strategic reasons, I'm glad what they are doing coincides with the fan's interests.

I have some concerns about the rumors(?) that Season 2 will be based off Epitaph One. Since it is set in the future, what happens to all the actors in the present day? Unless they do flash backs/forwards. Or it's in the near future.

Also, being set in the future might have some negative effects, as Joss had to agree to a lower budget. It seems that being set in the future would cost heavily for effects and sets and such.

I probably have some facts wrong though. :)

geratongs3000 | May 18, 18:09 CET

Fox just told Mo Ryan there are no plans to air Epitaph One also.

zeitgeist | May 18, 18:46 CET

Actually, what she tweeted as their response was "No plans for that at this time". I think that parses differently than no plans ever at all.

The One True b!X | May 18, 19:00 CET

They've got the thing, and despite what may be said to press, they plan to air it. I'm told they haven't decided on when yet.

[ edited by gossi on 2009-05-18 19:03 ]

gossi | May 18, 19:02 CET

Soon, please!

mouse | May 18, 19:29 CET

Part of me, the honorable, logical, greater-good part, wants Fox to deploy "Epitaph One" strategically in a way that garners as many new eyeballs for season 2 as possible.

But then this other, darker, selfish part just wants to see it. Immediately. NOW.

Tin Ear Tom | May 18, 19:34 CET

Not saying pro or con, just tracking what they are saying publicly vs. privately :).

zeitgeist | May 18, 19:45 CET

If they're marketing it as a DVD extra they may want to hold off announcing an actual airing date until the DVD is out in case news that it'll actually be seen on FOX might deter some purchasers from getting the box set.

helcat | May 18, 19:47 CET

If they cut it close (that means no interruption for the rest of the run), Sweden will air it July 12th, two weeks before Comic Con.

wiesengrund | May 18, 20:06 CET

You know what they should do? Make a deal with int'l markets to hold off, and then air it near-simultaneously in the US, UK, and Australia. Make a statement re: the global reach of fandom.

ETA that, of course, this would mean waiting until September, given the Australian schedule.

[ edited by The One True b!X on 2009-05-18 20:13 ]

The One True b!X | May 18, 20:10 CET

Yeah, I was semi-serious about wanting an Epitaph episode for the end of each season. Although I'm only going on reports that it is really amazing, I have yet to see it myself. ;-) Plus we all need more Felicia.

AnotherFireflyfan | May 18, 20:11 CET

I got confirmation today from MioTV that they've had "Epitaph One" available (and airing) for several weeks, legally, via their subscription-based US TV service. (Note: which isn't available in the US).

[ edited by gossi on 2009-05-18 20:24 ]

gossi | May 18, 20:21 CET

That's the Singapore IPTV-thing, right? So people in Singapore are able to watch "Epitaph One" right now?

wiesengrund | May 18, 20:44 CET

"13 episodes for $34.78" (swf).

The One True b!X | May 18, 20:46 CET

Yeah, channel 550, Sundays is Dollhouse day I think.

gossi | May 18, 20:46 CET

"DNA-altered humans"? Oh hell, that's what this was about?!

wiesengrund | May 18, 20:47 CET

Even Sci-Fi UK describe it like that. It appears the Fox international sales people haven't actually watched the show.

gossi | May 18, 20:48 CET

"13 episodes for $34.78" (swf).

For a second there I wondered why b!X would warn us that such a link is safe for work.

wiesengrund | May 18, 20:59 CET

"DNA-altered humans" ha! No, that's a Dark Angel marathon...

buffyfest | May 18, 21:05 CET

Mio TV's promo for Dollhouse (flv).

The One True b!X | May 18, 21:09 CET

Did FOX pick up Epitaph One as one of the 13-episode order for season 2? I wish they would explain that to avoid the buzz they created when they announced Omega as the season finale in that press release. We might get Epitaph One + 12 new episodes or Epitaph One + 13 new episodes.

danielgm | May 18, 21:35 CET

I've found a TV that gets Swedish TV4, not mine but available. Do y'all really think they're going to try to revoke existing rights? That doesn't sound probable to me.

dreamlogic | May 18, 22:18 CET

Unless I missed something, I don't think anyone said anything about thinking they'll revoke existing rights. For my part of this discussion, at any rate, I suggested trying to make a deal to hold off in int'l markets.

The One True b!X | May 18, 22:24 CET

TV4 thinks they already have 13 episodes.

dreamlogic | May 18, 22:26 CET

As near as we can tell, all international markets should be saying they have 13, since that's the context in which "Epitaph One" was produced in the first place: To fulfill the international orders for 13 episodes.

The One True b!X | May 18, 22:31 CET

Right. b!x is not suggesting that they REVOKE the rights to the 13th episode, just that they make a deal to get them not to air it.

(I don't think it's all that likely though.)

Septimus | May 18, 22:32 CET

I don't think it's likely either. It was just an intriguing musing.

The One True b!X | May 18, 22:33 CET

So, in the event that I am able to get this, how do I share?

dreamlogic | May 18, 22:43 CET

Maybe the trend of downloading before it airs in your country is a relatively small enough phenomenon that Fox deems it not worth worrying about, but you'd think they'd wanna get "Epitaph One" aired before it's been aired in the UK and elsewhere. Otherwise a good number of fans are gonna watch online instead of on your channel. Probably some Nielsen and DVR viewers too.

That'd be incredibly cool if the episode aired all over the world at once (or at least, on the same day, since otherwise some countries would be seeing it at 3am). Though I guess that Singapore TV-on-demand download means the episode will have already leaked real soon ?

[ edited by Kris on 2009-05-18 23:19 ]

Kris | May 18, 23:17 CET

To be honest, I don't think there's any Dollhouse fans in Singapore who know how to rip Pay-To-View streams and get them online. In fact, I suspect it may not even leak from Sweden. Fact is, ripping TV is really popular in the US and the UK due to the content produced, but to having something aired first in foreign markets is rare.

gossi | May 18, 23:41 CET

Gossi, isn't Sweden home to one of the worlds biggest Torrent operators? There is a huge fuss there about the recent prosecution of the Pirate Bay people because the judge in the case was found to have ties to the recording industry.

zz9 | May 18, 23:54 CET

The last Pushing Daisies episodes leaked immediately after being aired in Germany, and they were dubbed thus basically not really interesting for most parts of the fandom. I know that Sweden is smaller than Germany, but still. People get the special-ness of such before-US airings.

wiesengrund | May 19, 10:09 CET

Oh, and one thing that I wanted to ask... is "Epitaph One" a normal-sized, 42 minutes episode? Since it wasn't produced for Fox, it probably wasn't produced for Remote Free TV. But maybe they went with consistency of the season. Anybody know something about that?

wiesengrund | May 19, 18:14 CET

May 18 2009