The Joss Whedon method--or, why Dollhouse season 2 is a good thing - Dollhouse

"Dollhouse: The Musical".

That would be some major feat.

Still wondering when people will realize that wanting Joss to make a musical out of everything he does is asking him to reduce himself to schtick.

@theonetruebix | May 21, 23:16 CET

I like that it appears this reviewer has caught up on Dollhouse based on Twitter buzz and given their enthusiasm is highly likely to be watching season 2... may there be many more people like them! :-)

Bluey | May 22, 00:13 CET

I'm still scratching my head with "Joss Whedon" and "method" in the same sentence.

Carefully how you answer that question, we're still well-armed with fruits and various meats.

Madhatter | May 22, 01:16 CET

Blast? Sadly it isn't Wyndham-Lewis back from the dead proclaiming Dollhouse the latest step in Vorticism. Nice article anyway, though.

dzr | May 22, 02:07 CET

He's done a episode with music, without music, without speech.

Next: No Sets. Following that: No Actors.

Jaymii | May 22, 03:09 CET

Excellent article. I agree with everything in it, with two exceptions:

No musical (what b!x said), and I don't think Eliza is the "weak link". Given the monumental acting task she's been handling, I think she's been near to perfection.

Also, it would be nice to have Tahmon recognized for more than his pecs (not that they are unappealing) ;) Which I predict will happen in season 2.

Shey | May 22, 03:13 CET

I agree, dzr. (Though, honestly, the intense unlikability of the characters and the interchangeability of characters IS kind of Wyndham Lewis-y.)

Anwyay, good article. I agree that the show has SO much potential. I hope we'll look back in ten years and see the whole first season as set-up.

Septimus | May 22, 03:25 CET

Personally I found Tahmoh's acting a bit one note, aggressive and yet wooden. In fact, for me he was probably the weakest link out of all the cast. However, I thought he was excellent in fight scenes and his interaction with Alpha was hilarious.

Bluey | May 22, 03:33 CET

Although I'll be very surprised if we get a musical episode of Dollhouse (I can't imagine how it would make sense within the context of the show), it does seem to me that Dollhouse's premise is an excellent one for Joss's 'experimental' (for want of a better word) episodes. Since it deals in fantasies, you could well have a client whose fantasy is silent or singing dolls. Now that we have a second season of a Joss show I would love for Joss to try out something crazy like 'Hush' or 'Restless'. The last thing he ever did like this was 'OMWF' (or perhaps 'Spin the Bottle'. 'Objects in Space' was beautiful but it wasn't quite the formal experiment of those classic Buffy episodes). Who knows, maybe Epitaph 1 will be something along these lines

Let Down | May 22, 04:05 CET

Ah but Bluey the article was complimenting the acting of Tahmoh's pecs. Even a straight male like me can recognise their considerable talent, definitely Emmy worthy

Let Down | May 22, 04:06 CET

I don't think Tahmoh was given much to work with for most the season. I really found myself liking him more and more as the season went on, though. It's too bad they cut some very humorous moments for him from 'Omega' (as read in the script) as I think it would endeared more people to his character.

LaneMeyer | May 22, 04:14 CET

Let down: LOL! they are nice pecs... not too big, not too little, just right! ;-)

However nothing beats the pec acting of an actor in the brilliance that is Hercules Returns.

Bluey | May 22, 04:31 CET

I would like to see Vincent Ventresca's character come back. Possibly as the big bad for the season.

Simon | May 22, 04:32 CET

I'm really sick of these Eliza is the weak link out of the dolls. She's supposed to be different from the other dolls. That's the point of the show. I really hope she's not letting this crap get her down. (Like Kris Allen who's only heard since he won Idol that he didn't deserve it over Adam. I love Kris. The Idol portion of this post is done.)

edcsLover9 | May 22, 04:34 CET

Let Down, would you include Out of Gas in that list? It's been a few months since I've watched it properly, but the flashbacks/flashforwards creating three distinct time periods all cut together was trippy as when I watched it for the first time.

ThorpeWithoutShrimp | May 22, 04:42 CET

I would like to see Vincent Ventresca's character come back. Possibly as the big bad for the season.

Yeah, it's amazing how creepy and slimy he was, since I'm used to seeing him in comedic roles, like as Fun Bobby on Friends or Billy in Romy & Michele.

flugufrelsarinn | May 22, 05:04 CET

I would like to see Vincent Ventresca's character come back. Possibly as the big bad for the season.

Definitely. Some of us are still hurting from when The Invisible Man got cancelled.

deepgirl187 | May 22, 05:24 CET

With you on that one. I loved that show.

Simon | May 22, 05:45 CET

Heh, Septimus. Funnily enough I actually like the characters in Dollhouse and the characters in Wyndham-Lewis' novels.

dzr | May 22, 05:48 CET

I'll think I just step back into the looking glass and watch this afar.

Madhatter | May 22, 05:57 CET

Let Down, would you include Out of Gas in that list? It's been a few months since I've watched it properly, but the flashbacks/flashforwards creating three distinct time periods all cut together was trippy as when I watched it for the first time.

Not really. I love the episode but as far as its style goes the only thing that's different about it is that it jumps back and forward in time. It does it brilliantly but it's not really uncommon

Possibly as the big bad for the season.

Do we expect a big bad each season? It would be great fun if we did but I'm not sure if this is that kind of story

Let Down | May 22, 05:57 CET

dzr I actually like them, too. But I don't think they're designed to be "likable" (especially not in Lewis's case. Tarr is really kind of a jerk.)

Septimus | May 22, 06:21 CET

I think a musical could work very well. Just like in Buffy, the reason they are all singing could become part of the story.

Just have a glitch in the computer that makes all the dolls sing, or have Alpha program them that way. If anyone can pull it off without it becoming schtick it is Joss. Besides is "talking" Schtick? Joss always has people talking in all his shows, I wish he would stop that. :)

But hey, I do not need a dollhouse musical if he can give us another Dr. Horrible at some point.

Jayne's Hat | May 22, 07:02 CET

Septimus you're right on the similarities. Topher is kind of a jerk, but I can't help but like him, and in some way he seems to be a grotesque caricature of Joss. Tarr is most definitely kind of a jerk, but I can't help but sort of like him too, and he is widely believed to be based on Wyndham Lewis himself, isn't he? Wow, I just thought I was making a silly joke about the journal being called Blast, and now it turns out there are all sorts of little parallels. Also, I just got a haircut: "Bless the hairdresser ... correcting the grotesque anachronisms of our physique." It turns out old Wyndham is relevant to just about everything!

[ edited by dzr on 2009-05-22 16:12 ]

dzr | May 22, 07:11 CET

While I've defended Eliza's acting in the past, I like how this article phrased the critique: "Her charisma shines through." That's definitely the politest way of putting it that I've seen.

Topher is kind of a jerk, but I can't help but like him, and in some way he seems to be a grotesque caricature of Joss.

Indeed, dzr. More evidence for my Grand Unified Theory of Joss, that he writes himself into all his shows... as the villain.

ManEnoughToAdmitIt | May 22, 07:19 CET

I agree that I don't need a musical episode. (I am certainly interested in Dr Horrible 2: Revenge of Captain Hammer, or whatever.) A musical episode just wouldn't fit the feel of the show, in my opinion. As someone mentioned, Joss has shown an inclination to do "special" or "experimental" episodes, and I'd love to see him do something along those lines with DH, but the musical ep has been done.

skeeler | May 22, 07:52 CET

I'm sure Joss has storyline twists a-plenty in store. As to an episode with experiemtnal format, well, that depends on what he thinks of. The last experiment I recall he mentioned wanting to do was one in ELizabethan English/Shakespearean stylings. That never happened (but could have!) in the Buffyverse but would be tricky here.

Musical ep.s are an obvious choice for a special episode, and a great choice, if they work, which so often they don't. "Lyre, Lyre" was an oaky Xena episode, nto the ebst, but by comparison to "the bitter Suite," it suffered. chicago Hope' s musical ep. I eprsonally sort of enjoyed, at moments, but it really didn't work and actually seemed silly at times. Big Brother Jake on teh other hand,a very unmemorable sitcom, has one of tis few really high points in its musical. It's a tough balance to strike, and given Joss's hands-on approach to his shows, it takes too much of his time, I feel. I think that, as great as "OMWF" is, S-6 as a whole suffered from it.

[ edited by DaddyCatALSO on 2009-05-22 17:44 ]

[ edited by DaddyCatALSO on 2009-05-22 17:45 ]

DaddyCatALSO | May 22, 07:53 CET

It seems to me that the "natural" experimental show for Dollhosue would be to have all of the actors playing each others characters for an episode. THAT would certainly be easy to fit into the premise of the show, and could be great fun.

Septimus | May 22, 07:56 CET

Neat idea, Septimus, though it only works for actives playing non-actives: Echo as DeWitt, Victor as Topher. How about Sierra as Whiskey (as Saunders)? It would be fun to have both the original and his or her copy in the room at one time.

Actually, having a character and the imprinted copy of that character in one episode, not necessarily a "special" one, would be very interesting. There are all kinds of questions that ep could ask.

Another idea: How about multiple copies of a personality in one ep? We had both Echo and Sierra as Taffy, but they weren't really together. What if all our regular actives were imprinted with the same personality? Fun!

[ edited by skeeler on 2009-05-22 18:15 ]

skeeler | May 22, 09:12 CET

Bluey said:

Personally I found Tahmoh's acting a bit one note, aggressive and yet wooden. In fact, for me he was probably the weakest link out of all the cast. However, I thought he was excellent in fight scenes and his interaction with Alpha was hilarious.

I agree, though I thought it was the lack of material that weakened his performance. It wasn't until later episodes, when his and the Dollhouse's stories started to intersect, that he became a better, more interesting character.

And as far as the idea of a musical episode... perhaps it's wishful thinking to hope that we'll get another OMWF, but I think (as some people have mentioned here) that it's more the idea of the musical episode that bodes so well for Dollhouse, meaning that surely Joss will come up with other cool, interesting, and never-been-done ideas for Dollhouse just like he did with Buffy.

Anyway, thanks for the mostly-positive response to my article, guys. I appreciate it!

krice | May 22, 11:48 CET

ditto on the the negative Eliza I'm tired of them too!

WheelsOfJoy | May 22, 14:11 CET

May 21 2009