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Whedonesque - a community weblog about Joss Whedon
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November 05 2003

Herc's Seen The First ANGEL Of Sweeps!!

Ok, pretty good ep. I enjoyed it a lot more when I relaxed and wasn't so antsy waiting for something to happen. When I just took a breath and let the story unfold, it became interesting and unlike most AtS episodes. At least for me. So is number 5 still going to work at W&H? I know he's dead, but so? That never stops anyone on this show.

Also, didja notice? They turned down the lights! Someone is listening to us...
I haven't seen it yet but I've read various comments that described it as one for Angel fanatics.
I enjoyed it. Dragged a little in the middle, with the story telling, but the 'old footage' was good. And hey, they left the office!
Nice episode. I particularly liked the devil's robot bit.

The prophecy stuff is weird, though. With Wesley having no clue what Angel meant by "the father will kill the son" reference, I had to wonder: did everyone but Angel simply forget Connor, or did his existence as his son magically never happen except in Angel's memories?

Because, either way, that still leaves the question of what everyone else thinks they have been doing for the past couple of years. In their minds, why did Wesley betray the group? And, if he didn't, why would he have ended up with Lilah? How do they explain Jasmine without Connor? Do they even remember her? Do they have different memories than Angel? Did something different actually happen? Or do they just have these big Swiss-cheese holes in their memories that they don't seem to notice or care about?

But, as for the episode, I liked it.
It had Angel going out in a black coat and with a sword again and it had more Wesley than Spike, which is nice too. As for the memory problems, I'm glad they finally mentioned something from the past that only Angel remembers. What I like about this season is how they mention one thing in an episode and then pick it up again in the next to get more detailed. That probably means they won't ignore the questions unreality asked until the end of the season.
Good episode.
I really enjoyed this episode. There were a lot of subtle funny elements that I liked, the look on Angel's face after Numeros Uno-Quattro rose from the grave and started wrestling the demon, hilarious.

I have all the same questions, unreality! It's killing me! I kind of wonder if the events just never happened because I don't think Wes has the scar from Justine slitting his throat to kidnap Conner (but I could just be blind.)
I thought this was a great episode too and had a lot going for it. I also liked that they addressed the prophecy thing and had both Angel and Spike checking into it. I had my problems with the series finale last year and had asked all these questions regarding the change in Wesley and how would they explain it. So far this season we really haven't seen enough of Wesley to judge if he's more like the old Wesley or if he's the new, darker Wesely. I can't even tell if he has the scar on his neck anymore. I'm guessing that at some point everyone will have their memories restored and that possibly Cordy will be the key to that happening. She was in the coma when the spell was cast. As for Lila, last season the show ended with Lila in the background, Angel walking away and Fred asking "Who's Connor?". So from what I can see this season, in Wesley's mind, he remembers nothing of the kidnapping and his relationship with Lila. He's back to mooning over Fred like he was before all this happened. The darker Wesley still wanted Fred but he certainly wasn't mooning over her anymore.
The only part of the episode that really interested me was Wesley broaching the subject of Angel's disconnectedness ... though I love that they had Mexican wrestler mailman for 6 episodes, getting us curious about whether they'd cut the demon makeup department or what...
I too thought this was a solid episode. It had a nice all-of-a-piece/one central idea feel to it, instead of a let's cram a lot of exposition and back story between some fights feeling. And yes, they left the damn building.

I liked the "cautionary" tale part of it-they way both Numero Cinco and Wes both warned Angel that could be him in 50 years, the idea that heroes don't just die, they can also fade away into cynicsim.

Loved the scene in the grave yard.

I think the no memory of Connor thing is an interesting bizarro world mirror of the way everone on Buffy can remember Dawn but she wasn't there. Everyone on Angel can't remember Connor but he was there. like blwessels, I wonder if Cordy might not central to this memory issue
Righto, Jeebs. It also reminds me of the Ben/Glory thing.

"Wait, Ben is Glory?"
Right now this is one of my favorite Angel episodes. I liked the story, the pacing, and the music. Also the theme of redemption and becoming a hero has always been one of my favorite Angel themes.
The memory thing irks me too, but I'm remaining as patient as possible for that to unfold. I guess my question is: If they can't remember Conner, how could they remember Jasmine?...which leads me to...Why the hell did they accept W&H's offer? In their minds...what is the reason if they supposedly cannot remember killing Jasmine, hence ending "world peace"....just a thought.
Joss usually wraps up loose ends. We all speculated on when Dawn was introduced how the heck they were going to explain that and I thought there would be no way they could give us a logical explanation as to why Buffy suddenly had a sister and of course Joss came up with a great episode that fit in perfectly and made sense as to how Dawn came about. So I know I'll have to be patient to have my questions regarding their memories answered but I'm sure we will get some closure on all of that.
If Angel's heart is indeed beef jerky, then Gwen Electro is not to be found and Season 4 is *gasps* one long shower scene for everyone but Angel.

I really can't see ME taking the conk-to-the-noggin route for the whole season, plus the set up in Season 3. Someone is going to remember.

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