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"PAFT!"
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February 23 2010

(SPOILER) "Spike: The Devil You Know" miniseries announced. Written by Bill Williams and art by Chris Cross. Cover and page shown.

Could be good, could be awful. To me, it depends on Williams characterization of Spike. I'm really hating how Willingham is writing him for various reasons that I have listed and elaborated on elsewhere. I'm also one of the people who isn't a huge Urru fan.( although the awful art in Aftermath gave me some newfound appreciation) I like how he draws demons and Betta George, but I don't always like his character likenesses, particularly Spike. I think I enjoy how he draws Angel and Gunn more, but I haven't re-read ATF lately so I could be forgetting things about his style.

Also, I'm a little confused as to how Spike being in Willinghams arc, Spike being in this miniseries, and Spike being in his own Lynch penned series is going to work out and resolve itself timeline, character, and canon-wise. I enjoy Bryan's work so that's what I'm most looking forward to as far as stories of Spike go( besides Season 8 obviously, I'm most excited to see how Spike works into that!)

I've dropped the main Angel title as of Issue #30, but I may look into this, we'll see.
Also, the first promotional image looks kind of interesting. It might be neat to see those characters meet up. I forgot to talk about that in all my tangent-y rambling. I'm new to Whedonesque so I get a little over-enthusiastic sometimes.....I've been lurking for a long time waiting to register, =)
IDW is overusing the Angel property in my opinion. There's so many Angel series, Spike series, one shots, episode adaptions, and spin offs, I stopped buying them. I don't even buy the main series anymore. I'm happy Buffy at Darkhorse is more focused, and they've shown restraint.
I agree, the market is flooded. I can't keep track of all these tangential storylines. It's too much. Angel is now like CSI or Law & Order with all the spinoffs. It's making me less excited for every announcement they make especially when recent developments in the past few months have been disappointing.

I'm wondering if Bill Williams and Brian Lynch are talking about Spike's character arc also. Do these sort of talks happen? I know that's not really the common practice for comic books (is it?) but it's an expectation that's arisen in me from how the TV show was created and how the Buffy comic is being written.
Urru's art never ceases to impress.
Actually... I kind of like that there are a lot of Angel titles.

There are really only two titles: the Angel and the forthcoming Spike title.

The way I see it, the spin-off miniseries add to the main storyline. That's just what I expect them to do, I haven't actually read any of the miniseries. But I would hope that they tie into the main series really well, but aren't really necessary to understand the whole series; kind of like the Spike:ATF did with the ATF title.

I just like my 'verse stories. I kind of wish Joss had more time to actually "executive produce" some off shoot stories for season 8 to focus on some of the under used characters, some slayers that we don't see at all... you know, just add to the 'verse.

That being said, I wish IDW had a creative force controlling the whole franchise. For season 8, everything is run by Joss. He plots the stories. It seems like with every new writer, there is a new change in franchise. I wish Lynch would be promoted to like "executive producer" of the entire Angel franchise, approving all of the miniseries and main title arcs for the Spike and Angel series and making sure everything is pretty coherent - and matches up with what's going on in Season 8. I also wish IDW and DH had some sort of formal communication wherein they could collaborate, or at least let each other know the major plot points they are going to be using that will affect the entire 'verse -
I might start buying the issues and not expect the HC/TPB to come out! Looks like fun and it will tie into current Angel continuity (according to Williams).
IDW is overusing the Angel property in my opinion.


I think there's a natural resistance in the fandom to the characters actually being used as comic book characters. A medium shift is not a pleasant experience for some.
I will give Williams's Spike a chance, i hope it's nothing like Willingham's Spike who just does not get the character. I also hope that like Spike:After the fall, this mini series can stand on it's own two feet, i don't want to buy the main-series to understand the mini-series.
The next series i'm looking forward to is Lynch's Spike series.
Simon said:

I think there's a natural resistance in the fandom to the characters actually being used as comic book characters. A medium shift is not a pleasant experience for some.


This is true. As a longtime comic book fan, I guess I'm kind of used to the idea that characters will show up in a variety of works and be "different."

I like that IDW is using the Angel characters as comic book characters instead of TV characters that happen to be in a comic book. I appreciate and respect what DH is doing by doing a TV season in comic book form, but honestly, you can't expect every company to do that. Nor would I necessarily want them to. IDW is being to true to the medium, true to longstanding traditions within the industry. In some ways, I wish DH would do the same. I want to have a Willow/Kennedy miniseries, I want to know the backstory of how Riley got hooked up with Twilight... what more about the rogue slayers. That's where miniseries and tie-ins can come in handy.

Oh and when season 8 is over, I want a separate Faith title. Just saying.
Hmm could be interesting. I don't have my hopes set high. Although I actually appreciate the "overuse", its a good testing ground for bringing in new writers... I only wish they'd vetted Armstrong and Willingham with a miniseries. It seems like nobody has had much of a grip on the characters at all.

Spike just feels out of place in the Angel series at the moment. He's hanging out at the Hyperion and taking orders from Angel's son and acting like a Scooby... it all just feels so wrong.
On the other hand I can't wait for Lynch's Spike series. I pretty much consider anything written by him to be canon. So I hope he ignores what Willingham and future writers do, and just develops the character in his own way.
If these sell, then good for IDW, but I'm definitely a TV-fan reading comic books - not the other way round. Long histories, weird continuities, cross-overs; I don't really understand comic books and it'd cost way to much for me to look into them properly. I'll stick with my occasional Batman or Supes hardback, Season 8 and my manga, thank you very much.

Also, Chris Cross! That has to be a pen name, its too awesome to be real.
Spike just feels out of place in the Angel series at the moment. He's hanging out at the Hyperion and taking orders from Angel's son and acting like a Scooby... it all just feels so wrong.
On the other hand I can't wait for Lynch's Spike series. I pretty much consider anything written by him to be canon. So I hope he ignores what Willingham and future writers do, and just develops the character in his own way.


100% agreed, it's really amazing(not in a good way) seeing what they reduced the character to in the Angel series. I also hope that Brian does his own thing and doesn't try to tie it in to the Angel series. The Spike series should focus on Spike, not on the oh so chosen ones(Angel/Connor).

[ edited by Vergil on 2010-02-23 12:54 ]
I must say that I can't muster much enthusiasm for any of these IDW projects and it isn't just because they’re not canon (yes I am a canon whore and I have no shame in admitting that) but because they're not well-written at all. And I don’t really understand the logic behind releasing so many of these titles, often out of order in the timeline, as I think it just becomes a big confusing mess. I’m afraid they’ve totally lost me until there are some major changes over how the franchise is being handled.

[ edited by vampmogs on 2010-02-23 14:35 ]
I would welcome (ie be extremely excited about) another Spike series by Brian Lynch, but I am resistant to any other writer (other than Joss himself) because I have not been thrilled with IDW's many and various 'Angel' comics. If Whedonesquers rave about it then, and only then, I'll give it a try.
I wonder if IDW considered getting the spec for Tim Minear's Spike DVD movie and adapting it in comic book format.
They've already used some of the Spike DVD movie stuff in Angel:ATF,Spike:ATF and will be using some ideas from it for the Spike monthly acording to Brian Lynch from a Slayalive Q/A.

I would love to see IDW do a comic book adaptation for the lost second episode of Angel called,"Corrupt" by David Fury.The network felt it was too dark and it was re-written into,"Lonely Hearts.""Corrupt" involved prostitutes.Kate was going to be a drug-addicted undercover cop.

Wiki has a good summery of the lost episode.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corrupt_(unaired_Angel_episode)

Would loved to of seen Cordy as a undercover hooker named Cookie.
Wow, all my years in the fandom and this is the first I've ever heard of a lost Angel episode. Quite surprising!
Hm, gotta say I'm not crazy about the art. I have been meaning to check out more of Bryan Lynch's Spike, I may do that instead. The one issue of his I did read had a pretty funny line (or offensive, depending on your feelings on the topic). Spike is in Japan (I think?), fighting with the Smile Time puppets (I think), and the puppets have this cannon that says OFFICIAL CANNON on the side. So they shoot Spike with it, and afterwards he's lying in a pile of rubble, and he says, "I hate... official cannon."
That's a comic book episode adaptation I'd buy, with the right artist(s) involved. I think I read the script for "Corrupt" before the shows were done (before Angel was done, at least) and while I understand why The WB wouldn't allow something like that to air on their network (at least not that early in the show's life, since darker stuff probably aired later), it's a shame. It's an incredibly well-constructed script, seems like it would've been better than "Lonely Hearts" (didn't hate "Lonely Hearts" though).
I agree and disagree on a couple of things. I love IDW's treatment of Angel for the most part, but I agree that they are flooding the market with Angel titles and one offs. It's getting hard to juggle all these titles. But I do love Urru's style and am interested to see further development of Spike as a character. But have we learned anything about Lynch's series? I'm worried this series might ruin things.
Wyndam, we've discussed it here before: http://whedonesque.com/comments/3715. The link to the Geocities site is no longer valid, but you can find the script here: http://www.whedon.info/Angel-1x02bis-Corrupt-Read-The.html
Having been hugely disappointed by the quality of Lynch's Angel, and having given up on the series because of it, I'm happy to hear that someone else is taking the helm. I don't care if Lynch "gets" the characters - his writing is dull and the dialogue just doesn't have the kick that can be found by ANY of the writers of Buffy s8 (even those, like Vaughan, who weren't involved with the show). On the other hand, I never really got into Fables, despite all its accolades, so perhaps this isn't much of a step up.

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