I just love how seemingly the entire world puts 'Angel' and 'Dark Shadows' together at every freaking opportunity.
"Don't despair...we'll give you your vampire fix. See? Dark Shadows! Yea!"
(heavy sigh)

[ edited by meredith on 2004-02-17 16:44 ]

meredith | February 17, 18:44 CET

Stupid execs who think that all we want is something with vampires. Hello? It's quality, not vampires per se! Asses.

As for Smile Time, I cannot wait to see it. I love Ben Edlund and love it in general when the Whedoners take creative chances.

I'm just hoping that Angel doesn't end up with Nina. The whole idea irritates me. I can't really say exactly why I feel this way. Am I resistant to a non-Buffy soulmate for Angel? Maybe. I wouldn't call myself a shipper of any stripe, but I guess I'm an anti-shipper when it comes to Nina and Angel. Oh heck, if the writers want it to be, I'll probably end up succumbing to the idea. Anyone else feel this way? Or care?

phlebotinin | February 17, 19:03 CET

I'm with ya, phlebotinin. Same feelings exactly. Not sure why, either. It's just....not right.

meredith | February 17, 19:24 CET

Spike's human? Really? For an article from a reporter who seems like they actually like the show and will miss it when it's gone, that's a pretty big oopsie to let slip by.

miss_tress | February 17, 19:44 CET

Glad I'm not alone.

phlebotinin | February 17, 19:44 CET

I think the reporter said "human Spike" to show that its not another Spike v Angel fight, but a fight between Angel as a puppet, and Spike in human form.

Ghost Spike | February 17, 19:53 CET

I admit that I am a Buffy/Angel shipper. I'm sorry but I cannot imagine him to end up with anyone else but her. I'm watching the Season 3 DVD and he said in all his years...which we know to be ALOT...she is the love of his life. Come on now...it has to be her.

Coll | February 17, 20:24 CET

Truthfully I would have rather have seen Anne come back and have him hook up with her. I mean in away she was Buffy or at least that is who she began to emulate in the strenght of character, thus matching up to Angel quite nicely, plus the brief history they had would make the story more interesting - questioning does he love Anne or who she reminds him of. Anne by the time she showed up on Angel had become a strong independant female character enough to rival Buffy or Darla if they kept her around more. Then you would also have her as competition for Cordellia if you really wanted to do the triangle thing.

I'm a believer that Joss created Buffy and the rest of the slayers to be alone - thus going against another cliche of always having to find that special someone - some people were just meant to end up alone for one reason or another. I mean in the series it was the guys that fell for Buffy first not the other way around - thus putting Buffy in place of the man position in that society. I mean even look at Faith, she is another form of male architype in our society. It is the man in the Joss world that has a more submissive role. So I think om Angel they should have had him move on when he got his own show. Ok that was just my 2 cents on the ship thing.

RavenU | February 17, 20:37 CET

It's probably just me, but by the end I didn't really like Buffy very much. Personally, ya ken. She got very sorry for herself and whiny and not the strong hero I'd always known her to be.
And the way she used Spike in season 6 (yes, it's the obligatory Season 6 reference) was sad and wrong. Take him or leave him, but quit yo-yoing the poor dead guy around. Before you get angry, I REALIZE the whole point of it was for her to grow up and that relationships that are easy as kids are really not when you're an adult and blah blah blah, ad nauseum.
I'm with RavenU on the slayers being alone. And maybe the Champion should be, too. Angel should not end up with her.
Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to prepare to be beaten to a bloody pulp by the B/A shippers.

meredith | February 17, 21:17 CET

I'm not a shipper of any kind, so I'm not going to beat anyone to a bloody pulp! Maybe RavenU is right. Why must everyone end up with someone? Slayers and Vampires with souls are perhaps destined to end up alone in the romantic sense. But Joss has always emphasized the importance to these special hero types of friends and families, especially of the created variety. So in that sense Buffy and Angel and I guess now Spike are never entirely alone.

I can live with no ultimate match-ups for either Angel or Buffy. In fact, I don't really want a tidy, everything's a paradise ending. That wouldn't be Joss. I loved how BtVS ended with so much uncertainty and possibility and a little enigmatic smile on Buffy's face in answer to the question, "What are we going to do now, Buffy?" But I do want the Buffy-Spike-Angel thing to be addressed and maybe even resolved. It's still important to the characters and both show(s).

phlebotinin | February 17, 21:29 CET

Well, we'll go down together Meredith. I had difficulty with Buffy off and on throughout the show. I did really come to like her but often she was my least favorite character. To some extent that's the pitfall of the hero role, there's not as much room to stretch as there is for other types of characters, though I must say they've done a remarkable job with Angel. I have more of a problem with who she would rather be if she didn't have to be the Slayer. Her aspirations are pretty shallow. I love her irreverance and I think they (and SMG) did a good job with the growing pains but she can still rub me the wrong way sometimes.

And for the clincher, I'm not so keen on the Angel/Buffy romance either. Much of the time in the first couple of seasons I just want to gag. It took until she had to kill him, which I was extremely moved by, before I got on board with it. It mostly struck me as very immature. It makes a great deal of sense for the characters--she was young and he had been an immature self-absorbed jerk as a human and then became evil so had never experienced a real emotional relationship. Nonetheless, I don't see it as a forever thing.

And I really like RavenU's point. I think it would make a much better statement not to play into the concept that someone with everything Buffy has is still not complete without a relationship. Some kind of wrap-up I could concur with but a finale where they finally get together forever and always? Not keen on it. I'm sure it would be handled with stunning grace by Joss et al so I'm sure I would like it but...

marmoset | February 17, 21:53 CET

Meredith...I would never attack anyone for their opinion. I respect it, as I would hope mine would be. Stakeholder...I actually do not want Buffy/Angel together because they "complete" each other...I think they are complete individuals destined to be together. I know that sounds a little corny...but I look at my own marriage that way. I never thought I was incomplete and that I needed my husband to fill a void in myself. We are two individuals who are best friends, have much in common, a true love for each other, and have a genuine feel that this is destined. The way it was to be. Period. I guess I look at it a bit romantically. But I never thought that a man is needed to complete any woman or vice-versa. I guess I feel that way about Buffy/Angel too. Just my thoughts. But I will also say...that I have all the faith in the world that whatever Joss and Co. come up with will be what was "destined" to be. After all...he is the master of this tale. Okay...I'm done rambling...sorry...a romantic at heart here.

Coll | February 17, 23:49 CET

Coll--I don't think that sounds corny at all. And in my estimation all the devotees that do want to see them together in the end want that for the same pure reasons you do. I guess I was thinking more about new generations over the years that become involved in the mythology (and I do think it will stand the test of time). I was just thinking that there are so few places to find that message and that I can't think of a better place I would rather be exposed to it.

marmoset | February 18, 00:40 CET

Just a comment on the comment about "Buffy using Spike in season 6". I don't think Buffy used him, I think it's the other way around, and James Marsters himself even commented on it. Buffy was destroyed when she came back from the dead and was confused and lost and Spike took advantage of it. He knew he was being "used" because she just wanted to feel something but he didn't care and he took advantage of it. She tried to end it several times and he kept coming back so I don't get how Buffy used Spike at all. She was completely open with him and tried to stay away from him but he wouldn't let her.

And to me that is why season 7 was all the sweeter. They had both grown and could be friends first and help each other and just be there without any strings attached. I always felt that they were heading towards being in love if there had been a season 8 but season 7, and not 6, is where the real respect and love for each other started.

Firefly Flanatic | February 18, 03:44 CET