This site will work and look better in a browser that supports web standards, but it is accessible to any browser or Internet device.

Whedonesque - a community weblog about Joss Whedon
"Oh no. Is that dragon thing behind me?"
11945 members | you are not logged in | 24 November 2014




Tweet







March 17 2004

An ad thanking SMG And the point is.....?

Seems almost as pointless as that ad a few months ago about how great the Buffy/Angel relationship was and how "Chosen" proved they'd get back together one day. I agree that she did a great job on Buffy, but is this just fans kissing up to try and persuade her to do a guest spot on Angel.

Wasn't there an ad not so long ago urging a Spuffy ending to Angel?
This one wasn't nearly as embarrassing as that Buffy/Angel one.
Urging a Spuffy ending, if anyone has a link to that I'd be greatful, the world seems to be full of Bangel shippers.
No, there was an ad thanking ME and the WB for bringing Spike to ATS and asking viewers to watch on Wednesday night. No mention of Spuffy.. (although I would prefer them to Buffy/Angel any day of the year)

Link to ad:

http://www.supportspike.com/Campaign04/spike_3.jpg

[ edited by twiggy on 2004-03-17 16:54 ]
::beats head into a wall::

God, what will the Ducks do with their money when the Jossverse is over? Maybe pay for some therapy...
Okay, I love SMG and think she's a great actress but I don't get the point of this ad. I can understand an ad thanking her when Buffy ended, and I would expect there will most likely be an ad when Angel ends too. But to just have a thank you ad for no apparent reason seems a little, um, obsessed fan thingy going on.
Maybe it's a thankyou for her no doubt stellar performance in the upcoming box-office smash, Scooby Doo 2!!
I'm assuming it's a bit of asskissing so SMG will see the ad and think, "OMG!!!111!! I must go do a guest appearance on AtS before it ends and give a twu wuv ending to the neverending angst-a-thon that is Bangel! Cause, see the ad! The fans who really love me are Bangel fans."

*rolls eyes*

I almost find it insulting to the actress. It's so...cheap.

[ edited by syd on 2004-03-17 18:24 ]
wow thats about as pointless as her role in scooby doo.
Agree the ad is pointless

Interesting to note that some people have taken it as an opportunity to bash SMG even though she had nothing to do with the ad

[ edited by garda39 on 2004-03-17 18:09 ]
Beautiful picture of Sarah
Yes, can we ease up on the actor bashing? It's a recent development here that I'm not loving. We started this site to get away from that stuff.
You know, exactly what SMG and most of us feared is happening: The ending of Angel is becoming all. about. Buffy.
Maybe I'll do a Thank You ad to James in a couple of years when he's doing the convention circuit or something.....
Yeah, a little obsessive. I think if SMG saw this she'd go, "Oh, that's.....sweet....?"
When I think about how much money is being spent on stuff like this, it makes me so sad. These people have an agenda, all right, but they have no charity - not even for SMG, who is taking the heat for it.
I agree with Caroline. I don't like reading comments attacking SMG. I think the only people who we can be critical of here are the overly obsessed fans that have placed this ad.

I hope casual viewers are not steered away from being proper fans because they are woried that they might become as 'obsessive' as these people.
I think these people should send their money to me to help me pay my rent, cause I think I could use it more.

And yes, no more actor bashing. It is a recent and highly annoying new trend around these parts.
My only concern is the timing of this ad (I assume it is full page?). The savingangel campaign just put an ad in the Hollywood Reporter, too. To me, this type of ad for SMG would seem to take the wind out of our sails (since this is kind of over-the-top cheesy, could it rub off on us?) Couldn't they have waited for awhile to publish this? I love SMG too but I just think the timing is all wrong and could detract from Angel. I can't imagine why the die-hard SMG fans would want to steal our thunder right now.
It could have been done by particularly stupid (maybe ignorant is a better word) SMG fans that are annoyed that there's been such a huge movement to save Angel, yet there was nothing of the sort to get an 8th season BtVS.

Though that would require a large amount of stupidity.
I agree it would be nice to be able to read a thread that is about SMG (and others) without having to read the inevitable not so nice comments.

I enjoyed the first Scooby movie and am looking forward to the second. I'm happy she's been successful and I only wish her the best. I still think this ad was over the top though and comes across as obsessive.
yeah i saw the first scooby movie with my friend and her daughter. it was cute and done pretty good. i think people have to remember what the audience is for those movies. all my nieces and nephews, etc. love the movie and cant wait to see the next one. im glad shes successful and i cant wait to see her new movie the grudge when it comes out. i also think it was wise not too sign on to a third movie just yet.
All this complaining is off-putting. Fans put this out there with thier money, and they have every right to. If ya don't like it, don't buy it. What is so wrong with the fans showing SMG how much they appreciate her? And this actor bashing is soo not kewl.

Sheesh!!

And may I remind some of you that the same people who paid for this ad, had a hand in helping pay for ads thanking the entire cast, of both Buffy and Angel once they reached the 100th episode. These same people donated to the save Angel campaign. Again... it's their money, they can spend it which ever way they wish and if thanking or sucking up to SMG is a way, then be it.

[ edited by nychick on 2004-03-17 19:47 ]
Its a waste of money when theres a far more worthy cause in "Angel", than thanking an actress who hasnt done anything in the franschise for nearly a year now.
Waste of money for who? For you maybe, but for those who gave their money willingly, not so much a waste of time. It's all about perspective and for anyone to be condesending towards it, is really lacking in respect.
I personally think that a lot of people are afraid that the end of Angel is going to become all about Buffy and placing this ad after Buffy has been off the air for almost a year may confirm those fears. I think it's a nice sentiment that was already done and really didn't need to be addressed again. If people want to show their apprecation for SMG work on Buffy & spend money, that's their choice. I would be the first person to do the Snoopy dance if she made an appearance on Angel before it ends but I just would hate for it to overshadow Angel's final farewell....
I think what bothers me is how it gives life to
the story of Buffy and 'her Angel' (as if nothing worth knowing
happened to Buffy after that) and is so obviously designed to shame SMG into agreeing to be in the AtS finale and give them (they think) the big B/A ending they want. It's so transparant and something that was pulled in the end of BtVS as well. AtS is ending, if anything, why not take out an ad thanking DB for playing the part of Angel for the last eight years? That'd make more sense than this shameless bid to get the ending they want.
People can do whatever they want to with their money. But then people can have whatever opinion they want too. And this happens to be an opinion board.

(BTW Caroline, it's your site, but who's 'bashing' here? I agree the basher-boards are a pain, but just as bad are the boards where you are not allowed to do anything but praise and rave or get banned. Please tell me that's not where we're going here.)

Personally I never saw much point in thanking an actor. I have no intentions of thanking an SMG or a James or a Kevin Spacy for for that matter, for their career. If I met them I would tell them I appreciate their work and think they're good actors. But I'm not going to thank them for it.

An ad thanking 'all involved' to show appreciation for a show like Buffy and Angel, that I can see more. Plenty of people work hard for those shows, starting with the writers and the guy who came up with the whole thing in the first place, Joss. And then there's the cameramen, the people in charge of light, decors, effects, etc. It's a group effort. The actors are visible and this culture gives their celebrity an enormous status, but it irks me sometimes that we almost act like they're all that matters.

Well, I guess it helps that they photograph so well, doesn't it?

And that's another thing I find a bit odd about the tone this ad, it sort of thanks her too for being pretty. As for the timing, yes right after BtVS S7 would have been more appropriate. If the ads purpose is indeed to convince her to appear on Angel, then it would help to simply ask her. And while I'm sure she'll appreciate the whole gesture, I doubt it will change her mind if she had decided not to guest star.

I don't know. Liking their work, thinking they're great, thinking they're hot, I get all that. But things like these almost seem closer to 'worship'. To each their own, I just get a weird vibe from that.

[ edited by EdDantes on 2004-03-17 20:27 ]
Well, if the overshadowing of "Angel" is what folks are worried about, going from what's taken place before, I doubt there is any reason to worry. Angel made his little appearance on Buffy (all of 6 minutes), and that didn't over shadow the ending of "BtVs" in anyway, so I don't see where the worrying is coming from.

Personally, I just think many have a thing against SMG for whatever reason and that's quite a shame. I don't know whether it's a dissasociation problem or her rumored diva-ness or just personal, but whichever it is, no need for the harsh bashing and condecending remarks towards the fans.

ETA: Um, can I just say this. I hear all this stuff about how the ad comes off as obsessive and it's wierd etc. Um, we are here on a site talking about said obsessive and wierd ad, hence... finish the rest!! :)

[ edited by nychick on 2004-03-17 21:27 ]
I'm usually one of the first people to speak out against undue SMG-bashing, but come on...this ad is just weird.
Well, I think it's unnecessary and pointless, but there are several people(some on this board) who think that people supporting Angel's renewal is unnecessary and pointless. So, whatever people want to do with their money is their own business, but this is just very odd timing.
Well, here comes my two cents. I would personally thank all of the cast of Buffy and Angel if I could. I believe I would thank Joss first though before SMG,after all, he made her. Second would be SMG because in my opinion no one could have played it better. The character is my hero, the first one I've ever had, and I'm 35. Buffy was absolutely the only show I ever LOST myself in, and If that makes me a tremendous loser, so be it, but every week after I watched it, I couldn't wait until the next episode. It was an absolute escape for me, from whatever was going on in my life. Some people knit, some people golf, some people drink their troubles away. My therapy was Buffy. It meant something more to me than entertainment. Maybe the people who took out out the ad feel the same way about SMG, and want her to know it. They will probably never be able to meet her in person, but it doesn't mean they can't get a message to her.

Some people don't care for SMG for whatever reason, but it's really too bad since she plays Buffy, and, well, that's the name of the show. I would love to know how people who have only heard about a person being a &%#@^$# in the media can go ahead and decide that's how she is. You don't know someone, until you KNOW someone.

As for people wanting the Bangel thing or the Spuffy thing, I think we all want a happy ending, and everyone has their own idea of one. Either way, it will be interesting to see how it will end :-(
I'll chime in and say I think this ad comes off as a bit silly and too scary-fan-obsessional, but hey, everyone has their passion(s) and if people want to give money to something like this it's their business. I'm sure I have passions that others would find silly.

The timing of the ad strikes me as curious, though. What is it meant to accomplish besides extending the obvious general appreciation to SMG? (Which I think she fully deserves, by the way.) Why emphasize SMG as Buffy and the Buffy/Angel relationship now, almost a year after the actress and the character have wrapped up BtVS? I don't get it. And I do agree that the ad appearing right now might lessen the impact of the Save Angel ad in the same magazine. Then again, maybe not. Maybe the ad could be seen as another example of fan devotion to the general BuffyAngelverse and thus generally supportive of Angel as a character and show.
I couldn't have said it better lisi. Buffy was like therapy for me as well, and it truly helped me through a very dark and strange time in my life. I'll be forever grateful to Joss, SMG, and everyone else who had a hand in the series, as well as Angel. I also agree that you can't really believe rumors about supposed divaness that you hear in the media. I form my opinion of certain actors based on their body of work and, to a lesser extent, the interviews they do. SMG has always come across as very poised and professional, so that's how I choose to think of her.
Lisi - I'm 39 (actually closer to 40) and I feel the same way you do. Buffy is my hero!! I don't think it's silly because the show was just so well written and acted. I also lost myself in the story week after week and couldn't wait to see what would happen next. But for me, this ad came across as a tad obsessive and if I were SMG it might creep me out a little that people are that obsessed. It made sense when Buffy ended and it was nice and thoughtful when they did that then. But the timing does seem like an attempt to overshadow Angel and/or guilt SMG into returning. I'd love it if she does but I don't want her to be guilted into doing it.

I too also feel that unless you know the person in real life, you really can't know who they are or what they are about.

If Angel had already ended and they wanted to thank the stars of Buffy and Angel and the writers that would've been really nice and the timing would've made sense. But from what I understand, they already did this when Buffy ended.

Also, I don't know if I met SMG that I would run up and thank her personally for her role in Buffy. I think I'd tell her how much I loved her portrayal and what a wonderful job she did in the role. I do think if I met Joss Whedon I would thank him for creating these great shows and bringing to life these wonderful characters. He did create them and he is the mastermind behind the shows and therefore, I think he would deserve to be thanked.

But it's all perspective, again, and just because it's something I wouldn't do doesn't mean it's not okay for these people to want to do it. But for me, the timing was weird and it came across as a little creepy.

Mindpieces: "SMG has always come across as very poised and professional, so that's how I choose to think of her"

Totally agree with that statement.

And Ringworm, just because you don't like this ad doesn't mean you are bashing SMG. She has nothing to do with the ad. I think she's lovely and a wonderful actress and it was a beautiful picture of her (albeit a bit "Dynasty" looking).
Making a 90 degree turn here to say something about ME's cinematographers and editors. I cannot tell you how HOT I am for those guys! Episode after episode, they turn a TV show into a visual work of art.
Next time you're watching your DVDs, try watching an episode with the sound turned off. You will be astonished at how much you are getting from the program because of the way it was filmed and how it was put together.
Just felt like sayin' it.
wissxwe brings up a very valid point, I was watching "Reunion" the other day on DVD (hadn't seen it in two years) and I was blown away by the visual richness on screen.
And Ringworm, just because you don't like this ad doesn't mean you are bashing SMG. She has nothing to do with the ad. I think she's lovely and a wonderful actress and it was a beautiful picture of her (albeit a bit "Dynasty" looking).

Yeah...my statement was worded so poorly even I'm not sure what I meant. I never meant to imply that not liking the ad means not liking SMG, though I can't see how anyone could interepret my statement any other way. :)

Regardless, the pic in the ad is great. It's the words that weird me out.
Very well put Blwessels.
EdDantes, if you have complaints about how we run this site, you can e-mail us. We don't discuss our policies on the board itself.
Although I feel like an obsessed fan sometimes, I would never write a letter to an actor, or take out an ad.
The ad is somewhat strange as far as how dramatic it is, and the timing obviously. Maybe they are sort of trying to "kiss up" to her in hopes of her making an appearance. Perhaps they should have just taken an ad out and asked her to, at least they would look a little less obsessive!
I would love to know how people who have only heard about a person being a &%#@^$# in the media can go ahead and decide that's how she is. You don't know someone, until you KNOW someone.

By the same token, you can wonder how someone could think SMG is great without KNOWing her.

For me personally(and this isn't necessarily about SMG or any Buffyverse person, just anyone in the public eye), when I hear one story about someone being a jerk(or having some negative personality attribute), I can write it off to being a bad day or even a misrepresentation of events.
When I hear more than one story, it makes me think there might be some truth to it. When an actor will gush about one coworker, but will only give cursory, polite responses regarding another, I have a brain, I can read between the lines.

Actors, Russel Crowe, for example, tend to get reputations for their behaviors on and off set. I don't think that discussing those reputations is considered bashing, even when the rep is negative. To me, it seems the same as discussing something reportedly nice about the actor/actress. I can see when people get out of hand that it's a bit much, but really, saying "James is so nice and thoughtful" is the same as "James comes off as a bit rude in interviews." It's all conjecture and opinion. Just like a lot of people took offense at DB's last interview, and many didn't see anything wrong with it. Seeing negative doesn't mean you're bashing. It just means you have a different opinion.
To each his own, I guess. :) I think the ad is quite nice, actually. The only sentiment I'm not liking very much is the B/A slant to it because it gives the impression that the purpose of the ad is to help influence her to make a return on Angel. But hey, it's their ad. Also, I read somewhere that the ad was supposed to have been placed much earlier to counter all the SMG negativity in the last few years but was shelved for some reason. Let's face it, though, I don't think an ad is going to change SMG's mind if she has decided not to appear on Angel at all.
"I would love to know how people who have only heard about a person being a &%#@^$# in the media can go ahead and decide that's how she is. You don't know someone, until you KNOW someone."

"By the same token, you can wonder how someone could think SMG is great without KNOWing her."

Well I assume a person is nice first and then change my opinion based on what I see and hear them say and their demeanour in interviews
Well I assume a person is nice first and then change my opinion based on what I see and hear them say and their demeanour in interviews

Well I think, and some will disagree with me, an interview is a poor judge of someone's character. It simply shows they know how to act in front of a camera or an interviewer(and, hey, actors, so not that hard). I mean, everyone thought Rosie O'Donnell was the "Queen of Nice" because she seemed so on her show. Then things came to the surface that she wasn't as great as everyone thought.

I mean, I think Russel Crowe is a total jerk, but at least he's true to his character all the time--his character NOT being a jerk, but just not caring much about political correctness and stuff.

There are VERY few interviews I've seen(save the Mishka Barton interview.....brrrr) where an actor comes off really poorly or negatively. But I'm sure there are more actors who are just plain jerks than are exposed in interviews.

I like to take a whole picture of the person to decide. For instance, I've read only one bad thing about James Marsters, and that was an account written by a rude fan who was mad that all of the magazines she had him autograph so she could sell on Ebay got smudged and then she asked him to re-sign them. And she thought he was a jerk because she yelled something at him while he was on stage and he gave her an odd look. That's it. So yeah, those things I toss out as crap. But if their were repeated reports that James was a jerk or acted a certain way to fans or on set, I wouldn't dismiss them as readily. And I'm certain he would still seem just as nice and sweet in interviews.
My point was I assume that they are nice first
The worst thing about this ad might be the cheap way Ducks cheated other SMG fans out of their money by saying it would be just an SMG appreciation ad, then sneaking their obsessive crazed shipping into it. It gives the very wrong impression that all SMG fans want to see a hollow Bangel ending, when in fact there are many of us who gag at the prospect. I am really tired of these fan attempts to manipulate the writers.
"Cheap, cheating, sneaking, obsessive, crazed." Them be fighting words for someone's second ever post on this site. I am pretty sure you can talk about whatever is going on with that ad in less aggressive terms.
I assume Sarah is a nice person because every interview I've seen with her she comes across as nice and I have heard co-workers say very nice things about her as well, like James Marsters saying she feels like a little sister to him. Seth Green had nothing but nice things to say about her when he did his commentary on the Buffy dvds. And I forget which writer on one of the dvds talked about how nice she was and how she even brought a cake to the set of Angel to celebrate the new series. Also, the guy that played Jake in Jake 2.0 talked about how nice and sweet she was when he guested on Buffy and how even though he didn't have a big part she made sure he was comfortable. And she does a lot of charity work and isn't into all the partying that a lot of young celebrities think is a necessary thing to do nowadays. I think she comes across as a fine young lady with a lot of class and that's how I see her.

[ edited by blwessels on 2004-03-18 01:25 ]
Ok, just in direct discussion of BLWessels, I will say this: the following people have had negative and/or borderline comments regarding SMG: James, David, Joss, Nicholas, Allison. I could go into detail, but I'm sure it would be considered bashing, and we've already went over most of the things these people said many times.

My point is, you really have to take things in context and realize that most public figures know how to act in front of a camera/interviewer and what to say about themselves and coworkers. That the above actors SAID the things they said in interviews/commentaries etc, says a lot to me about SMG's character.

Also, tangential things I learned about her shape my opinion too. Like the fact that she didn't invite any costars to her wedding, like the fact that she didn't want to hang out with her coworkers during OMWF filming when her parts were over, like the fact that she didn't show to her own wrap party.....

And I'm sure folks will say she has good excuses for those events, and I'm not implying she has to be best friends with anyone, but it's just a contrast to someone like Aly or Tony whose characters I rate higher. Just my opinion. I don't aim to change anyone else's and I certainly don't mean to bash. Just info sharing and trying to explain my position.
Well this is kind of pointless. Different people get different vibes and draw different conclusions. We all have read/heard/seen the same stuff and we all have our opinion and I doubt anyone is going to change anyone's mind about it.

And yes the public personas of actors is a very real part of their job and considering PR reasons and how often they change their tune, it's not much to go by either way.

As Joss said, not everyone on the set of Buffy got along. And face it, if we'd have worked there, we would've 'chosen sides' which is how it goes at most offices/workplaces. Some people you get along with better than others.

But since we didn't work there we draw our conclusions from what we got. And those conclusions will differ per person.

One thing though, while assuming the positive is a nice attitude to have in life, I'm not sure why I should have to assume Buffy/Angel actors are incapable of being less than nice sometimes. They're not saints, they're all just people too.
Here's a lame attempt to lighten things up (I ain't too comfortable when ya'll get snarly)

How come we never have threads extolling the virtues of
Biles/Guffy/Buffles/Giffy/make up your own...
"Like the fact that she didn't invite any costars to her wedding, like the fact that she didn't want to hang out with her coworkers during OMWF filming when her parts were over, like the fact that she didn't show to her own wrap party..... "

So apparently this proves I'm not a very nice person because I have been guilty of all of these offences (adjusted to my life of course)

AlL it actually proves is that I place my family above my work and I don't feel comfortable hanging around at social occasions wearing a fake smile and making small talk

If other people feel comfortable doing those things good for them
I've seen pictures of her wedding and Anthony Head was there. From my perspective and from interviews I've seen (and I'm not talking written words on paper - I'm talking seeing the actual words come out of peoples mouths or hearing them speak on the commentarys - I have heard nothing but nice things said about her. All the written stuff I take with a grain of salt. If you don't like her that's fine but you don't need to work so hard at trying to get other people to dislike her too. And don't say you aren't trying to get people to dislike her because anytime someone posts that they think she's a nice person you come out with a post that makes a point of trying to say she's not. I don't understand why it's so important for you that other people agree with you on this matter.

And I really don't care if she went to wrap parties or not or if she hung out with the crew later. I've worked with people that I've gotten along wonderfully with but outside of my job I didn't have much in common with them or had different interests. It doesn't mean I'm a bad person. It also doesn't mean that I never got in an argument or had a disagreement with a co-worker because those types of things happen all the time when people are put together. People have arguments and then they make up, it's a part of life. So I wouldn't be surprised if that sort of thing happened on the BtVS too.

And as for the comments about Russell Crowe "I mean, I think Russel Crowe is a total jerk, but at least he's true to his character all the time--his character NOT being a jerk, but just not caring much about political correctness and stuff." Are you suggesting that if on the inside you might not be such a nice person then you should be true to yourself and just go around acting like a big ass because then you are being real? God I hope not. If everyone who had a not so nice thought in their head just started saying everything they really felt, so they could be "real" and not care "about political correctness and stuff" would make this world even more scary than it is. No one is a nice person 100% of the time and it doesn't make you a bad person or a phony because you show yourself in a good light by trying to do and say the right things.


EdDantes: "One thing though, while assuming the positive is a nice attitude to have in life, I'm not sure why I should have to assume Buffy/Angel actors are incapable of being less than nice sometimes. They're not saints, they're all just people too."

And because no one is a saint, no one should really judge someone else until they've walked a mile in their shoes, because afterall, they're just people too.

I'd rather be the type of person who tries to see the positive and good in someone because I honestly feel everyone has good in them. To me, it is pointless to always see the negative.
I was just wondering if anyone knows what taking out an ad like this costs?
by the way, happy st. pat's to everyone!!
Well put, blwessels.

Yes, and a happy st. pat's to everyone, too.
Yes, before you judge someone you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, you're a mile away from them, and you have their shoes.

(Sorry, I've always loved that joke.)
I've always loved that joke too! :)
nice one refern. they way you phrased it sounded like some kinky, foursome slasher fanfic.
i wonder though with Spuffy vs Spiffy and Giffy vs Guffy do fans place more emphasis on one of the two involved parties?
(yes i have yet to see a nickname involving more than two individuals)
I've seen pictures of her wedding and Anthony Head was there.
If you have links, I'd be very appreciative. I can admit if I'm wrong, but I've never heard or seen that.

If you don't like her that's fine but you don't need to work so hard at trying to get other people to dislike her too. And don't say you aren't trying to get people to dislike her because anytime someone posts that they think she's a nice person you come out with a post that makes a point of trying to say she's not. I don't understand why it's so important for you that other people agree with you on this matter.


Well, as I said before, I'm not trying to get anyone to dislike her. I'm sure I couldn't if I wanted to. But the same can be said for you, why is it so important everyone like her? You have no problem extoling her virtues, but if I bring up issues in contrast(just to balance things, because I feel all sides of an issue are important), you don't see that I'm just presenting the other side of your argument, you see it as an attempt to 'convert.' It seems SMG is above reproach in your opinion(otherwise why would you get so upset about something negative being said?), which I feel no one is. Not even my Perfect James.

I'm talking seeing the actual words come out of peoples mouths or hearing them speak on the commentarys - I have heard nothing but nice things said about her.

Can I recommend the Firefly dvd commentary then!

And if you don't believe written interviews, that's fine. But I don't happen to dismiss them as readily. Aly and Nick both made comments in magazine interviews that they thought it was rotten they weren't told by SMG that she had decided to quit the show, and that they found out from Entertainment Weekly. David's comments are well known. I refer you to the above dvd set for Joss's comments(as well as the well-known Freddie Prinze 'nonsense' discussion). James is always diplomatic, but did make a comment at a Q&A that Sarah made fun of his method acting--I'll concede that might be good natured teasing, then again, who knows. There are numerous accounts of SMG being very controlling on the set, telling visiting directors what they should be doing. These are the things I base my opinion on, even moreso than seeing SMG talk about herself or her show. She's an ACTOR for Pete's sake! She knows how to act in front of the public. And she's not going to say anything negative about herself! (Almost)Everyone is different when they're interviewed or asked to comment on someone else. You can usually get a better idea of how someone really is if you ask/listen to those around them, rather than asking that person to comment on their coworkers/work.

If everyone who had a not so nice thought in their head just started saying everything they really felt, so they could be "real" and not care "about political correctness and stuff" would make this world even more scary than it is.

No, I said jerky people, not people who have a bad thought in their head. I have to give a bit of respect to Russell, because as much as I think he acts like a jerk, at least he is "real." We waste too much time being fake in our lives. I'm not saying it's cool to be rude, but there is something between fake nice and rude. Sometimes I'm disappointed when I see actors I like being "real", but they're human and shouldn't have to put on a facade for fans.(Re: the recent David article, I'm glad he can be relieved, but he could have worded himself differently without being fake--unless he really WON'T miss anything or anyone, and ISN'T glad he had the opportunities, and in that case, he's just of a lower character, but that's who he is)

And because no one is a saint, no one should really judge someone else until they've walked a mile in their shoes, because afterall, they're just people too.


Yes, and aren't you guilty of judging SMG also? Just because some people's judgment is positive doesn't mean you're any less 'judging.'

Look the bottom line is(though I'm sure not the last word) some people think SMG is great, some people think she's less than great, and some people hate her. Everyone relies on their own methods of getting the info, and no one is going to convince anyone of something they don't already believe. I just feel that unabashed praise should be tempered with the not so positive aspects of someone's character. Then you get a whole picture. I don't hate SMG nor think she's evil. My personal opinion of her is that she's a controlling, professional actress who has been raised in the industry and knows how to get what she wants. I think her character perhaps meant she didn't have any close friends on set. I also think she was tired of/burned out by Buffy a couple of years before it was over, and that may have contributed to her percieved attitude. None of this is necessarily bad, but just my opinion. I'd be first in line for her autograph because I think she's a great actress and I can't imagine Buffy being played by anyone else. I just might not have her over for tea.
I wish her the best in her career, and hope that my assumptions about her are completely off the mark.

Now, on that entirely too long note, I'm gonna scram so I can dodge the fruit.

PS: I've always liked the idea of a particular Naughty Slayer and her Stern Watcher......mmmm.....B'Giles
(yes i have yet to see a nickname involving more than two individuals)

Spufangel
Spufander
Bangiles
Bangillow
Bangander
Spufanya(hmm, that one sounds funny)
Banganya(that one too...)
And, drumroll please......Spufangiles!!! Hot Foursome! Lucky Slayer....
Never heard that one before, Prufrock! LOL, thanks -- now I'll have to inflict it on others.

As for all the conjecture about whether some celeb is one thing or another, it's just human nature to gossip about others. Celebs are easy targets because they're always in the public eye. People are going to make their own conclusions in any case.

In a recent SFX interview, JM said, when pressed for gossip about his castmates, "You're never gonna get dirt out of me. First of all, there's very little dirt to get, and second of all, you don't speak out about it. At the end of the day we created something beautiful, and we will always have that." That's a nice way to look at it.

As for the ad, I found it weird as well, but my take on it is mostly from a business pov. I don't mind if they want to push their agenda -- that's what advertising is all about -- but it's so poorly written it suggests that they have ulterior motives in thanking SMG, which undermines any positive intent behind the ad. Basically, I found it very clumsy and unsophisticated, although nowhere near as bad as the Bangel ad that appeared last year. If fans want to take out ads, it might be a good idea to get some professional help in designing/writing them if they want the best impact for their bucks and frankly, to avoid embarrassment. After all, this stuff appears in a major entertainment trade publication. If you think we're hyper-critical, imagine how Hollywood insiders are going to see this ad. What's the point, after all, if your ad ends up embarrassing, rather than celebrating, your beloved idol?
Sigh, if it's judging a person to not go out of my way to find fault with them, then I'll gladly be guilty of that.

I don't go out of my way to defend anyone, I have a right to say that I think she's a nice person, as others do and even when the commentator of the site asks people to stop actor bashing, you still can't resist to argue with anyone who has something nice to say about SMG. I didn't chose to open this discussion with you, you did by signaling me out as you did with two other people who posted why they liked her. No one is perfect, I'm sure she has faults as everyone else does I just don't care to really put the time and effort into going out of my way to be a negative person.

As for the Tony Head picture at her wedding, no I don't have a link. I saw the picture and that's good enough for me. I saw it back when she got married and looked at the pictures on someones site back then.

And in order for me, or anyone, to be able to judge her, or anyone else, I disagree with your views of a whole picture. A whole picture to me would be knowing the person in person, not what you've read, not what you've read between the lines on what others have said and not anything on TV.

I just don't get why if someone says they think she's nice that you feel you need to "balance" it out by pointing out all you think she's done. It's basically the same argument you had over and over with Allyson regarding your opinion that "why can't she just let people have hope" about Angel being renewed. You had issue with her feeling the need to tell people it's hopeless yet you are basically kind of doing the same thing in regards to anyone saying SMGs a nice person.
Sigh, if it's judging a person to not go out of my way to find fault with them, then I'll gladly be guilty of that.


Never had to go out of my way to hear negative things. They come just as easily as positive things.


A whole picture to me would be knowing the person in person, not what you've read, not what you've read between the lines on what others have said and not anything on TV.


Obviously, but I don't think anyone on this board knows these actors in person, so we go with the info we get, that's all. I'm sure you'll agree that your positive view of SMG isn't anymore whole than my view.

when the commentator of the site asks people to stop actor bashing, you still can't resist to argue with anyone who has something nice to say about SMG.

Again, we have different views of bashing. I don't felt I've bashed at all. (I'm sure the Mods will let me know, and hopefully email me with the requirements of what constitutes a bash if I'm wrong) And haven't really argued, either. Just presented my viewpoints and things I've heard and seen, just like you. Just because my view is less sunny than yours doesn't mean it's bashing. And obviously you suffer from the same problem I do, you can't resist 'arguing' with someone who has something less than stellar to say about SMG.

You had issue with her feeling the need to tell people it's hopeless yet you are basically kind of doing the same thing in regards to anyone saying SMGs a nice person.

Not true. I feel a more accurate comparison would have been if everytime someone says something nice about SMG, that I came out and said, "You people are ridiculous. SMG is a terrible person and everyone hates her. It's pointless to like her, because there is nothing likeable about her." Allyson spoke in absolutes, which I try never to do.
I'm merely saying, "Hey, she might not be the angel she's made out to be." Why is it wrong to let people hear another side? I feel it's no more or less necessary than spouting her attributes.
It's like with a politician. I may support someone, but I want to know all their viewpoints so I can make an informed judgment. And even with the negative, I may still support them. I'm not going to make a judgment call on an actor's character based on some E! special interview they do. Nor on all the bad gossip I hear.

BTW, BLWessels, why(in your opinion) is it acceptable for you to post on this board a paragraph of why you think SMG is nice, and all the people who have said nice things about her, yet it's just terrible and I'm trying to make people dislike SMG when I bring up opposing opinions? For every negative I have, you will come up with a positive, and vice versa. I don't see the problem with hearing all sides in a discussion like this. I'd just say, you are guilty of anything you have accused me of.
Obviously we are not going to agree on this. I'll make a point of not singaling you out if you agree not to single me out from now on regarding this matter.

Here's a link to a picture from SMGs wedding. This is not the picture I was referring to earlier, I tried, but I couldn't find that one. This one isn't a very clear shot but I believe that is Tony Head in the second row back with his head tilted. The picture I saw was a picture of SMG standing with guests and Tony was behind her but a little to her side laughing. The picture I saw was very clear and a close up shot of both of them. Here's the url:

http://www.smgfan.com/images2002/wedding/smgweddingbuffyaddict2.jpg


[ edited by blwessels on 2004-03-18 06:12 ]

[ edited by blwessels on 2004-03-18 06:26 ]
I'll make a point of not singaling you out if you agree not to single me out from now on regarding this matter.


If by singling out you mean replying directly to something you post, I'm sorry I can't 'make a point' of it. It's what people do here. Usually why the threads are so long. If you felt attacked or took offense at me replying directly to your comments, I'm sorry. But I'll probably reply to other posts you do at some point. Feel free not to respond.

As for the pic, it's just too unclear for me to tell. It very well could be him, but I was under the impression Tony didn't wear glasses in real life. I may be wrong. Hey, I'd love to believe she invited some folks from Buffy to her wedding.
By singling out I meant if I reply to someone or post myself saying why I like SMG I'd appreciate it if you would not respond to my post. There is no point because we are obviously not going to agree and on my part, if I feel you've said something that I think is negative about her I will not respond either. You specifically quoted something I said which, to me, is asking for a response, I am just requesting that we chose not to do that when it comes to this subject. It's not because I felt attacked or took offense, it's just that we clearly do not agree and to just keep posting back and forth explaining our views over and over again is just a waste of time and effort.

As I stated before this picture is not the one I mentioned in my earlier post. That picture was clearly him and this link I listed is just not a clear enough or close enough one to determine for sure but it does look like him. I posted the link anyway because I thought you and others would still be interested in seeing it and determining for yourselves whether or not you thought it was him. While searching for this photo I did come across a picture of Tony at what appeared to be a book signing and he was wearing glasses in that photo. That was from
http://www.anthonyhead.org/ if your interested. It was under the Galleries section and it was in Gallery 5, the first picture of the bottom row. They had a lot of great photos of him on that site.
"There are numerous accounts of SMG being very controlling on the set, telling visiting directors what they should be doing."

Go read interviews about other shows ,Star Trek etc,as this happens a lot on sets where the cast has been together a long time and knows themselves the best way things should be shot

If you listen to the commentary for "Consquences" the director on that says that when SMG noticed that the lights had been set up in the slightly wrong place on the docks she moved to the new location without any fuss ,implying to me he's met people who did cause a stink
I, too, was looking for wedding pics of SMG. I have found the one you linked to in several places. Some sites have a lot of wedding pics, but I've never seen one of ASH. I did see a wedding picture with a younger man wearing glasses who could possibly be the one in the pic. Again, I just can't tell, but will gladly admit I was wrong if I find out otherwise. Like I said, I'd love to think she invited a co-worker.

As for replying, I just can't say that I won't reply to a comment you make. Half the time I am already replying before I notice who the writer is. Sometimes I reply without knowing who it is at all. Yes, I pointed you out specifically only in an effort not to seem like I was 'bashing', but to give a response to something posted. So yeah, I will probably reply to you in the future. Possibly even in regards to Sarah. Hazards of the board. Again, feel free not to respond.

I know, this is the age old battle of the so-called Sarah apologists and so-called Sarah bashers. Nothing gonna change there.
Go read interviews about other shows ,Star Trek etc,as this happens a lot on sets where the cast has been together a long time and knows themselves the best way things should be shot


Well, this goes back to my belief that actors should just act and let the directors and writers do their job. I know a lot of people feel differently.

If you listen to the commentary for "Consquences" the director on that says that when SMG noticed that the lights had been set up in the slightly wrong place on the docks she moved to the new location without any fuss ,implying to me he's met people who did cause a stink.

Well, that's what she's supposed to do! Go where the director tells her. I never said she was a complete terror to work with. I think if she didn't follow any direction, she'd be quickly out of a job. Yes, I believe there are much worse actors to work with than SMG. SMG is professional and I think when push comes to shove, she will bend to the director's authority, whether she agrees or not.
"Well, that's what she's supposed to do! Go where the director tells her."

Read my post or go listen to the commentary

He didn't have to tell her

[ edited by garda39 on 2004-03-18 08:20 ]
When I initially saw the picture of ASH at her wedding, it was right after she got married and the site I was on had about 70 pictures and it took a long time looking at all of them. I was unable to find any site that had that many pictures and it's most likely because it is so long after the wedding. If anyone has a link to the picture I'm talking about or a site that has an abundance of wedding pictures I'd love to have it.

I have Buffy websites in my Favorites but I usually don't have any sites that are just about SMG and that's why I didn't save the site with the wedding pictures.

Okay, if you do post to a SMG comment of mine, I will try to just ignore it. I don't have issues with you when it comes to other topics and we usually agree on most things but on this subject we never agree. I do notice who I am replying to and if I know that person is touchy on a subject I try my best to avoid commenting unless they single me out on something I said specifically.
I hear the same complaints about Gellar time and again.

1) She didn't appear at the wrap party. Why? The shot for Buffy was three weeks overdue. (Drew Goddard, Succubus Club Interview) The original start date for the shooting of SD2 was the last week of March, they were already shooting SD2 when she arrived. Is Gellar, the consumate professional, supposed to delay work on a set just to attend a party? From people who attended the bash, I heard the producers or the network, did setup a teleconferencing link so that SMG could say something to the partiers.

2) SMG didn't hang out with the other cast members when OMWF was filmed. No one seems to take into account that they were simultaneously filming four other episodes of Buffy. SMG was taking 16 hours of dance rehearsal and an additional 18 hours of voice training. She may not have been totally behind the idea, at first, but she did contribute. She enlisted the aid of personal friend, Adam Shankman, to choreograph the dance numbers. Adam Shankman in addition to being a major dance choreographer, is a feature film director. His directorial work includes The Wedding Planner, A Walk to Remember, and Bringing Down the House (The ninth highest grossing movie of 2003). Somehow, I think, this man had better things to do than to visit a set of supposedly squabbling actors and producers.

No she did not attend the premier of OMWF. I think, the girl has a right to a much needed rest. As a rule, she doesn't attend very many premiers. She reportedly hates crowds. The entire time that she was on Buffy (7 years) she attended 16 premiers, mostly for her's or her husband's films. Compare that to MT whose been to about 6 in the last year alone. (This last comment is not meant as a bash, it is just a comparison.)

3) None of the actors and producers attended her wedding. Well only sixty friends and family actually attended the four day wedding. Let's assume some were invited, who could attend? Joss Whedon has a wife who is seven months pregnant at the time. Joss is also running three network shows. Marti Noxon is on pregnancy leave. She just gave birth less than three months ago. Is she supposed to pack an infant son to Mexico? All things considered, they were probably better off not going, between the hurricane, the earthquake, and the food poisoning that hit half the wedding party (SMG and Freddie Prinze, Jr included) it didn't seem like a particularly healthy place to be. Odds are, if they did attend and delays in production resulted, we the fans, would be cursing SMG for inviting them and putting them in peril. lol.

IMHO
What I find most interesting about this discussion thread is that no matter how much people love/hate SMG, one thing is never disputed - Sarah Michelle Gellar's talent. Personally, I don't care about the lives and personalities of an actor/entertainer (except when I find them reprehensible or their actions offensive). Since this is not the case with SMG, the widely varying reports on her behavior are of no consequence to me. All that matters, in my opinion, is her brilliant portrayal of Buffy. I think most people would agree that BTVS would not have been a critical success had a different actress portrayed the lead character.

You need to log in to be able to post comments.
About membership.



joss speaks back home back home back home back home back home