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Whedonesque - a community weblog about Joss Whedon
"I think that hydrant wasn't there.."
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October 28 2014

Marvel unveils Phase Three of Marvel Cinematic Universe. Lots of surprises on the way.

P.S. Looking for more sources if anyone can find them. Den of Geek is usually pretty spot-on though.

Comic Book Resources was there.
Just check Devin Faraci's twitter. He has pics. ChadwickBoseman is Black Panther.

[ edited by eddy on 2014-10-28 19:48 ]
Entertainment Weekly:
Excited for this slate, yet disappointed there is no solo movie for Black Widow.

Well probably only learn in which capacity Joss will be involved in the production of Phase 3, in a few months during the promotion for Age of Ultron.
I'm sure Black Widow will continue to pop up in several films. Cheers to finally getting a female-lead solo film with Captain Marvel at least!
Yes please! This is a great slate. I'm happy to see women and african-americans will be better represented in these hugely popular international blockbusters.
Black Panther and Captain Marvel have been rumored for a while. It's good to see them expanding into other demographics.

Inhumans in the MCU confirmed! Wonder what this means for SHIELD and it's very interesting how it's right in between Avengers movies, and a bit gutsy they are willing to split a movie, something usually done only for YA novel adaptions right now.

Anyone want to guess at the chances of Joss directing?

P.S. is this site going to do Agent Carter threads during SHIELD's hiatus?
The fact that they're splitting the last two movies makes me feel like Joss won't return (who knows though). That would be another five years of his life devoted to Marvel- I have doubts.
Since the next Avengers movie after Age of Ultron will be a two-parter, I really don't see Joss directing. I already didn't think he'd be back for A3, but this would be an additional two-movie commitment that would mean an additional 5 years, at least, of not being able to do his own projects.

My prediction: Joss leaves as director after A2 but continues on in his overall advisory role through Phase 3.
Was hoping for some kind of announcement regarding Joss' status in the MCU going forward, though I suppose that will be made clear soon enough. You'd think Joss would at least consider helming either one of the Avengers films or Captain Marvel, which may give him time to do his own thing(s) between now and then?

BTW - Really think Chadwick Boseman is a casting homerun and much in line with Marvel's previous blueprint on signing the Chris'
Joss helming Captain Marvel would be sweet.... Considering that the Avengers movies are a two-parter, it's likely that both are going to go to one main creative voice-team.
Making the ramblings that Joss won't be directing those very likely, and I wouldn't be annoyed at all, I'd be happy if it's 100% confirmed. I really miss the original stuff, we need him back on Dr. Horrible 2 and Wastelanders.
Will he be co-writing those, is something we may also wonder.
Considering that Feige made special mention that he was in attendance for this session, Joss still being involved in some capacity seems very likely.
I won't lie, I teared up a little because now we're finally getting a Captain Marvel movie.

There's supposedly a lot of Black Widow coming up in a bunch of different movies, so I wonder if it's going to act as set up for a solo movie in Phase 4. And if Marvel doesn't want to pay her the amount of money she wants, or SJ decides she doesn't want to do any more after that, then they'll still have had a lot of Black Widow.
But WHO is going play Captain Marvel?!! And WHO is going to write/direct?
... It's a long wait.
Oh, and not even just a Captain Marvel movie. A CAROL DANVERS MOVIE.
Numfar PTB: Making the ramblings that Joss won't be directing those very likely, and I wouldn't be annoyed at all, I'd be happy if it's 100% confirmed. I really miss the original stuff, we need him back on Dr. Horrible 2 and Wastelanders.

Yes! Absolutely agree. While Joss made me care about comic book movies and I started appreciating them more, I'm definitely longing for the pure Jossness. Use the fame to revive Goners, get on with DH2 and make Wastelanders happen before we all forgot that we were really excited for that! I'd love all of these things but ultimately, and most selfishly what I would love most in my fantasy world where everything happens as according to my desires: Joss would find himself on TV again, preferably on some non-network space (the Netflixes, etc are a thing now so it doesn't have to be "cable" anymore).

But whatever The Joss does, me is gonna watch!
I assume Joss will still be involved in the MCU as a consultant or producer atleast and he still has Agents Of Shield.
So happy about Carol Danvers, can't even process the rest of the news, just really delighted she is getting a movie at last even if its 4 years away.
I hope Kelly Sue Deconnick is involved somehow with Captain Marvel.

I also hope pave the way for a Ms. Marvel cinematic or television version based on G. Willow Wilson's run which is doing really well in the comics.
Katee Sackhoff=Captain Marvel
I am pretty sure Joss will buy a set of janitors clothes with his avengers money and come back to "clean up" the Marvel offices. The following day Marvel's writers and directors will magically find their plotting and character probems fixed as if by magic.

[ edited by Tausif on 2014-10-28 21:22 ]
I'm confused. What's the difference between Captain Marvel and Ms. Marvel? Are they one in the same? Is Carol Danvers Captain Marvel or is she Ms. Marvel? I can't keep up and the internet is confusing me.
Wastelanders also needs Warren Ellis. That is a project I want them to complete the most.
I wonder if they are treating Joss like a cinematic showrunner. Will he come back to write/direct the concluding Avengers movies if there are plans for that?
I like the idea of Joss as a sort of screenwriting Obi-Wan who's around to help, but not doing the heavy lifting.

But I like the idea of Joss getting back to his own stuff now (with, quite likely, rather considerable resources to hand) even more. Luckily the two are not incompatible!

Very good news with Captain Marvel (Katie Sackhoff, please) and with Black Panther. The rest I am less interested in, aside from maybe the Avengers through-line and "Civil War."

[ edited by ManEnoughToAdmitIt on 2014-10-28 21:28 ]
In the newest iteration Carol Danvers became Captain Marvel and a young Pakistani-American girl from Jersey named Kamala Khan took over as Ms. Marvel.
I would love it if Joss snagged a deal where he would do Avengers 3 for them, but in exchange he is given a non-Marvel show on ABC with guaranteed 5 seasons of 22 episodes each. He is given the option of it being an original show, or if he prefers, they will buy the rights to Firefly from the appropriate studios and he can make a continuation/sequel series.
What Tausif said. "Katee Sackoff=Captain Marvel" I'm so beyond thrilled about the Carol Danvers movie that I can't think straight. I hoped and hoped and hoped but was prepared to be angry and bitter (my natural state). So very pleased to get this wonderful news.
Has the rights for Goners reverted back to Joss or is that under permanent Universal lockdown?
And given the word logo for Captain Marvel, it certainly looks like they might lift straight from Kelly Sue DeConnick's work, which is stellar. I bet they could go a little cosmic with it since Carol is hanging out with the Guardians right now.
No, I'd rather have someone else as Captain Marvel. Nothing against Katee Sackoff but someone like Yvonne Strahovski is to my mind, a better match for Carol Danvers..
Here's a follow-up interview with Kevin Feige from EW:
Goners is owned by Universal, as far as I know.
Video of announcements:
Yeah, it's filmed with a shaky potato, but better than nothing :)

Edit: two more from the event and Q&A:

[ edited by Udo Schmitz on 2014-10-28 22:05 ]
Disappointed there's still no Natasha/Clint prequel but wow... 10 movies for Phase 3. Amazing.
Thanks for the info gossi. That's what I thought, seems that for Joss to pursue Goners it be hard if he was still under Disney/Marvel contract even if only in a consultant capacity.

That is sad.
I'm sure whoever is eventually cast as Carol for a movie that far in the future will probably be inappropriately young and neither Yvonne (who is 32) or Katee (34) will be considered. I didn't say I approve of this (before I'm accused of that), I'm saying that is the way it will work. Unless I'm wrong and then Yay!
Briefly re: Goners. AFAIK we are in the period in which Joss, under WGA rules, has the right to buy back the script. I have no earthly idea if he's tried to do so. /threadjack
Technically, 9 movies in Phase 3. Ant-Man has been shifted to close out Phase 2.
I think Captain Marvel is one key casting decision Marvel is gonna have to nail.
Also adding to the comic Ms. Marvel talk; Kamala Khan was inspired by Carol to take the name, her comic has been selling well and is liked by critics. She is also an Inhuman so that ties to the Inhumans movie and therefore also maybe SHIELD if the Skye speculation is correct.
Yeah, I fear you are right IrrationaliTV. You'd think they'd have learned something though from RDJ's casting. But I suppose there is still a bit of a double standard when it comes to them casting women's roles, alas..
To add to the video list, here's a link to the Age of Ultron clip that was shown. It's supposed to be different from the one showing with SHIELD tonight.

And given today's announcements, I officially rescind my theory that Thor dies in Avengers 2.

Like many others, as much as I'd like Joss to finish off the Avengers saga, I'm hoping he bows out after Ultron so he can get back to making his own stuff again without that Marvel exclusivity getting in the way.
I really hope Joss takes a bit of a backseat and James Gunn or someone else directs the last two Avengers movies. The purple one can be like an overseer of sorts, meanwhile having more free time for other projects. I wouldn't mind him writing Captain Marvel, though. He'd nail it.

[ edited by Boto on 2014-10-28 23:39 ]
I could swear I read the Russos are in for the directors chair(s) on Avengers 3
"I really hope Joss takes a bit of a backseat and James Gunn or someone else directs the last two Avengers movies."

I think that would be a great option. Although, I think they might very well keep Gunn on Guardians 2, so he wouldn't be able to do the Avengers films too.

I share what I think is the common opinion here though; I kind of hope that Whedon isn't directing those two Avengers films. I really enjoyed The Avengers and I'm looking forward to Age of Ultron, but part of me is looking forward to it coming out, so that he can get on with creating his own worlds again, preferably on TV (or an online series.)

Also hope that the rumours that he might be joining the writing room for Agents of Shield once Ultron is out is true. Would love to see him write/direct an episode or two now that the show has found its feet.
Is it Captain America: Civil War, or Serpent Society?
Civil War. SS was a joke. People saying what they want Joss' career to be always makes my skin crawl. Do whatever you want, boss. I'll keep handing over my money. :)

My wish list would include a female writer/director for Captain Marvel.
If this was Magical Fairyland, I'd want the Avengers 3 two-parter to be quad directed: Whedon, Goddard, DeKnight, and Minear. The workload would be spread out, they've worked together in the past, and I think each makes the others better.

Plus there is always the chance that putting them in the same room will form an Eternal Uni-Mind.
I don't think anyone is telling Joss what he should or shouldn't do, but we're entitled to our opinions on what we would LIKE him to do or not do. But yes, I'll support him no matter what.

[ edited by libradude on 2014-10-29 00:29 ]
If Avengers 3 had been the one movie, I'd have loved to have seen Joss write and direct it. As I know he really gets the Thanos character. But two more movies would be a lot to ask of the man. So yeah, I'm happy with whatever he decides on. He's certainly earned it!
Is it possible for Joss to write but not direct one of these movies ?
As super hero movies and Joss are my life, fingers crossed he signs on for A3
Not sure I'd be down for Joss writing and someone else directing. Too many directors have botched Joss' work in the past (the Buffy movie, Alien: Resurrection, and In Your Eyes in my opinion). Cabin in the Woods is an exception, but Joss was heavily involved in the filming process of that (he was second-unit director).

I think the Russo brothers are the most likely to take over writing/directing duties for The Avengers if Joss steps down. They did an excellent job with Winter Soldier. Also, notice how there is is 2 years between Captain America: Civil War (2016) and The Avengers 3, Pt 1 (2018). Enough time for them to step in.
I know I'm a pessimist by nature, but I can't help fearing the public is going to start losing its appetite for superhero movies before we get to the end of that list, even if the quality keeps up. Between movies and TV, we're just mainlining superheroes lately.

I know Marvel and Disney have to strike while the iron is hot, but I hope they don't overextend themselves.
It's possible, mainstream interest in superheroes has always been cyclical in nature. I'm betting Disney can keep interest up for another five years though. Whether DC, Sony, and FOX's film/tv efforts help or hurt things is yet to be seen.
As long as the movies are actually GOOD, the genre will have longevity.
Maybe, but there are thousands of movies each year. Three or four superhero movies is a drop in the bucket.
I really want Joss to finish off his Avengers saga. It wont feel right if someone else takes over at this point.

Definitely need either a female writer or director for Captain Marvel. MCU films are so male dominated they need to be really on the ball with this one.

I also think Marvel have been really good in their castings. I don't get the feeling they will pick someone "inappropriately young".
I agree with @Kaan about the Captain Marvel casting. Marvel has been spot on every time. I really hope it's Sackhoff, but I trust their judgement. Have yet to let us down in that department.
The problem with Joss continuing to direct the movies is that each one takes another ~2 years of his professional life, during which time he can do basically nothing else (unless he keeps shooting 10-day movies around his house). The next installment will be two movies, so it would be next decade before he's free to tell a different story, with his own characters.

I would be OK with him writing the movies, but he needs to hand over the director duties so he can do other things too.

It would be interesting to see the two A3 movies written by Joss and directed by Drew Goddard. Those two work so well together they're almost like the same person.

Joss said he'd be interested in joining the AoS writing staff after he's done with A2, which would be next season. But if he was going to write and direct another Avengers movie, he'd have to start working on it sooner than that. That tells me he's not planning to do anymore Marvel movies in the immediate future, but will stay part of the project.
Everything that Stan Lee told us a few years ago has come to pass. Remind me never to tell him any secrets. He REALLY sucks at keeping them.

@Kann From what I've read in interviews with Joss over the last two years, Age of Ultron is the end of his Avengers saga and was always intended that way. He reportedly pitched it this way to Kevin Feige back in 2009 or 2010 when Feige brought him in to get his opinion on Zak Penn's original screenplay.

[ edited by JesusSavedIn01 on 2014-10-29 12:50 ]
Boto: Since when is Black Panther American?
skizzoid, If I remember correctly, Ragnarok was an artificial Thor. So it is still conceivable that Thor dies in Avengers: AoU.
I also want a Black Widow movie. Hawkeye could be her sidekick. In case anyone is counting votes.

Why couldn't someone like Kathryn Bigelow direct the last two Avengers movies?
The lack of a Black Widow movie? She gets killed off in Avengers 2. Same goes for The Hulk. Probably.
Wow. I sometimes forget how mean you can be. ;)

PS Prequel! I want to know what happened in Budapest.
The prequel could be Rashomon style, since they both remember Budapest very differently.
Given the prevalence of "women in refrigerators" trope in comics I hope Joss doesn't kill off Black Widow. She has so much to clear up including all the red in her ledger. Hawkeye could be the one. As SNL points out after he runs put of arrows what makes him special?
Also, Feige didn't announce the movie I was looking forward to

Galactus: Nom, Nom, Nom

Does anyone know when Marvel gets Namor rights back from Universal? Is Universal planning on doing anything with Namor?
garyyager- Ragnarok was an artificial Thor in the comics, which at least justified my original theory that Thor dies and gets replaced while keeping Hemsworth in the MCU. I still like that idea, but if there's a third Thor movie, it makes less sense to have an artificial Thor starring in it (unless this is a backdoor way to have Loki headline his own movie... since he's probably more popular than Thor at this point).

And Ragnarok is also a Norse apocalypse, which could be the game changer that Feige was hyping it up to be. Who knows, both Ragnaroks might show up in the third Thor for all we know.

The rights to Namor transferred from Universal and Legendary Pictures to Marvel Studios this May. But, as Kevin Feige told IGN in July, third parties are unfortunately making it more complicated than that.

IGN: Finally, there were rumours circulating awhile back that Universal and Legendary Pictures were developing a Sub-Mariner movie, but there was also some confusion about who holds the rights to the character. So could Legendary make that movie at this point?

Feige: No.

IGN: So if a film were to happen it would be you guys making it?

Feige: Yes, but its slightly more complicated than that. Lets put it this way there are entanglements that make it less easy. There are older contracts that still involve other parties that mean we need to work things out before we move forward on it. As opposed to an Iron Man or any of the Avengers or any of the other Marvel characters where we could just put them in.

Source: IGN Interview

[ edited by JesusSavedIn01 on 2014-10-30 04:09 ]
Random hunch, I wouldn't be surprised if Joss doesn't do Avengers: IW1&2 but rather introduces Carol Danvers in AoU and helms her solo film, freeing his schedule up a little and bringing another strong female to our screens.

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