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"People were fighting on me"
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October 28 2014

(SPOILER) Discuss Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. 2x06 "A Fractured House". The episode was written by Rafe Judkins and Lauren LeFranc. It was directed by Ron Underwood.

I can’t wait for the FitzSimmons reunion! Only ~3 more hours!
Um... Lightning speed posting?
It's my superhero power.
If being exhausted was a superpower, I would be the the most powerful dead meat ever.
And like Maurissa twitted, the Age of Ultron scene is written by some other dude.

[ edited by Numfar PTB on 2014-10-29 01:59 ]
Now I want sweet potatoes. Not yams. They're brown and white and fibrous.
Checking in -- trying to process this Halloween competition thing.
Still can't wait to see the sneak peek!
It's a sham with yams though.
My F---ing cable box was refusing to switch to ABC!
I'm behind! I'm still watching The Flash.
I feel very strange hearing General Moustache cite the Avengers.

AWWW NO, LIARS
Good, some world setting.
Will Rainas' wart start blinking red? Will Bobby and Hunter hate F^(&? Will Dr. Bad Dad kill a bunch of people? Find out on Casa DeLa Whedon!
GRUMPY CAT!!!
What's with the ugly cat mug?
I missed everything before the credits, damn it. I assume it was the attack on the U.N.?
Angry Coulson is cool?
It was the attack on the UN.
Nowaaaaaaay!! Senator Ward!
javelina you missed Talbot speech to the UN, in which The Avengers are mentioned and then the attack.
So that's Ward's evil brother? Interesting.
And it's now an episode of 'White Collar'.
I guess I better watch "White Collar"
Aaaaaaaaa, just saw agent carter!
Agent Carter promo!
I like the Agent Carter promo! Just a teaser, but looks fantastic.
"So that's Ward's evil brother? Interesting."
erendis

How many big bads are we gonna have.
I've never seen 'White Collar.'

Was there a change in settings for this site? I can't update this discussion by clicking on the main link anymore.
I like Skye's hair better wavy.
@Nebula - as a joke, I suspect? Thank you for the heads-up on what I missed.
I guess I better watch "White Collar"
hann23

Iiiiiit's pretty fluff.
Woooooh, we didn't know that about May did we?
May's silent conversation thing doesn't get old.
I have feels about Fits-Simmonds. :(
Shut your pie hole Hunter.
Damn mockingbird's supertall
She's 5'11"! Coulson and the grumpy cat mug is going to get gifed to oblivion.

[ edited by the ninja report on 2014-10-29 02:20 ]
She's 5' 11" plus awesome boots
@roddikinathome - I don't think shutting up is Hunter's forte.
That's why Palicki was also great casting for Wonder Woman, the bad writing that didn't help.
Holy heck -- she is tall. I keep calling her Mockingjay.

Um, how did we get to Okinawa? I missed something and I don't want to rewind.
I can't believe she has to make out with random bad guys.
Tim DeKay makes everything better.
"Damn mockingbird's supertall"
Squishy

I have feels about Bobby's Tallness.
She's got 11 inches on me. She can reach stuff on high shelves while still with feet on the ground.
@hann23 I heard Coulson say something about Okinawa but got distracted by Grumpy Cat.
They just walk out the door and there's Okinawa.
No! May with a HICKEY?!?!
I like Hunter. I like that his world is upended by her presence and he's the irrational one.
Definately gonna hate f^(&.
@ roddikinathome, no, no, it was Hunter who had the hickey- from the young lady on the beach.
The lovers spats during the mission is coming off very contrived.
Ouch FitzSimmons, Ouch.
Adrianne Palicki kicked so much ass in John Wick. I hope she gets more action roles.
So the fact that Coulson is alive is all common knowledge now, right? I still want to see The Avengers react to that.
Ward will continue to be evil. He's a manipulator.
Both Wards are evil.
No Skye! That's two eps in a row you've done something stupid.
Coulson will not fall for older Ward's lies.
Skye's letting her emotions get to her.
"Both Wards are evil."
Nebula1400 |

Well, YEAH!
Please tell me Skye is playing him. Damn.
I wonder if SKye is playing him, like Natasha played Loki.

[ edited by Numfar PTB on 2014-10-29 02:35 ]
Ward vs Ward? Who cracks with the details first?

Those were some intense scenes.

[ edited by hann23 on 2014-10-29 02:35 ]
LOVE the plot twist!
Yah, she was great in john wick.
Wow, that was cold. As evil as he is, I kinda feel bad for Ward right now.
They are eviler than evil, roddikinathome, as in Grant Ward can't be redeemed, and his brother is a politician.
Oh no, I'll miss Ward! He's one of the best characters.
What mentally deficient advert executive gave Andrew WK money? Gak.
Oh wait, maybe the ward's will team up now.
Skye is growing up to be like Natasha, though she could also be like Hulk.
@Nebula - "and his brother is a politician." Laughing!
Not nonsense...
"They are eviler than evil, roddikinathome, as in Grant Ward can't be redeemed, and his brother is a politician."
Nebula1400

Yup.
Umm kinda confused now.
I'm still stuck on Ward thinking he's on Coulson's team.
I loved Coulson's rant!
Why would Ward think he is still on Coulson's team?
Oh and seriously, the part where May says, "You know I don't like you, right?" may be the best part of the episode. Season. Series? We'll see if they can top it. It was so casual and hilarious.
Yeah, I like how delusional Ward is. "Rebuilding trust," seriously? After last season, I was worried the show would try to make him a good guy again too quickly .... instead, he's all creepy and nuts, and everyone hates him a lot. Good stuff.
Ward on public trial? Not gonna happen.
@Nebula1400 I think that is how much Ward needs someone to be his leader that he could delude himself into thinking Coulson was still his. Now that Garrett is gone.
roddikin is just going to shout "Plot Twist!" all evening.
OK. Bobbi and Sotty (his name is Lance, right?) are adorable.
Wow, so kill bill!!
Hey... guess what.. the girls didn't end up fighting girls while the boys took on the boys! Yay writers!
I agree @NYPinTA, that was perfect.

And now I don't care if I'm confused about Bruges because that was a fun fight scene.
The girl's are the toughest fighters.

And brutal truth to Simmons!
I'm pretty sure Ward is going to escape.
Wards about to escape.
Wonder if there is a reason to show the Age of Ultron footage with this episode.
Can it please be May?
Ok. Loved Thor looking a little worried when Steve moved the Hammer. Hahaha.
I'm scared of Ultron.
Annnnnnd cue the next generation of fan tattoos.
So the next episode is on my birthday!
Wait till they reveal that the tattoos spell "I am full of donkey testicles."
I really hope they aren't just teasing us with this potential Simmons-Fitz-Mac love triangle.
I don't get that knife on a chain thing… the physics are totally wonky…
That Ward escape was freaky. I imagine something takes control of him just like his brother described. That may also be why he wakes up at the same time every day like Simmons mentioned.
Great episode tonight.Didn't see the ending with Ward coming although I guess they couldn't keep him Hannibal Lectering all season.
ugh didn't get the age of ultron sneak peak in canada... shame
Holy heck to ALL of that.

May was amazing this episode. About to be garroted and she gets that peeved look on her face and you just know ... WHAM.

Loved Bobbi too. Of course.

So happy Ward isn't turning good.

As for the Avengers footage, shudder. Will have to re-watch.
Well @Buffyfantic, he did escape rather brutally, which is still very Hannibal.

Do we know tattoo guy?
What would take control of Ward?
I suspected this was the clip they were going to show since they had already showed this during SDCC. I loved Tony and Rhodey trying to lift it together.
The dialogue in AOU sounds cracklin' good. love how they're making fun of Thor's cheesy mjolnir tag line.
I have a feeling Age of Ultron is going to be much better than the first movie. May is too far away!
So it's not on next week? So much for 10 episodes in a row.

Did Mac just become the least popular character on the show?

And I couldn't see whose dossier Coulson was looking at there toward the end... the one he closed while listening to Sen. Ward's speech.

Nice to see Talbot is an ally now. I thought it would take a bit longer.

I actually liked May's fight scene more than Bobbi's. They use too many cuts and edits. They need to learn that a great fight scene has to flow, not jump.
@Nebula1400 Maybe 'take control' was the wrong phrase but I definitely get the sense that something comes over him that he can't control sometimes.

Don't get me wrong, though. I don't see this as an excuse for his actions but just an added layer.
@AndrewCrossett I'm pretty sure it was Ward's file
Not at all, I love Mac. As much as I love Fitz-Simmons, I'm totally shipping Fitz-Mac hard.
@Destructo Girl - I wonder if there is something more about his brother, other than he's a flaming psychopath, that allows him to have such control over Ward.
God they referenced like, a billion marvel issues in like 5 seconds wth that avengers clip.

Yeah, do we know tattoo guy?
Mac can do me, instead.
Mac dropping emotional truth bombs! I like that he's telling Simmons what she needs to hear. And I really liked Simmons stepping in front of Skye and telling Ward she'll kill him next time.

Ward is totally going to escape.
What marvel issues?! I didn't catch any!!
@AndrewCrosset - Mac unpopular inside SHIELD or among fans? I still like him!

My impression of the dossier was that those were the agents Hydra just slaughtered.
@Squishy: look up all the idffernt people woh have lifted thor's hammer in the comics.
When the guys were talking about ex-girlfriends in a previous episode, Mac simply said he had 'exes.' I'm still pulling for him to be the first out, confirmed gay character in the MCU, and I really think they're setting him up to be.
The tattoo guy at the end looked so familiar to me and I can't place him. Anyone? Help me not drive myself crazy?
Good point, libradude. But it's weird to me that in that episode, Fitz says he doesn't have any exes. That...isn't possible, right? He can't be that sheltered. Even if you date someone a few times and break up, that makes them an ex.
Fitz went from school to SHIELD academy to the bus. I think it's completely possible he hasn't dated or has any exes.

ETA: not necessarily because he's sheltered or socially awkward, but honestly I think he was the type of person to be too focused to care about dating. (Plus, he is a little awkward and sheltered.)

[ edited by NYPinTA on 2014-10-29 03:21 ]
A lot of people really ship FitzSimmons hard... either romantically or platonically (I'm the latter). Mac basically just walked in out of Central Casting and smashed them with a hammer. The fact that Simmons immediately admitted he was right might have made some difference, but never underestimate the wrath of a thwarted shipper.

So... are they trying to push sexual tension between Fitz and Mac, or is this a case of what Joss calls "bring your own subtext?"
Fitz reminds me of my son, except my son is an actor instead of a brilliant young scientist.
Do we think Ward's younger brother will show up at some point?
The dialogue, especially this episode, still makes me cringe sometimes. But the pacing is much much better than last season, IMO. There's a good amount of reveals and twists per episode.

Thanks for the tip Grack!
Fitz checking out Mac in the previous episode kind of dropped the subtext barrier IMO, but I know some people are still arguing that that scene meant nothing. We'll see. #forevershipping
Few people are as good at dialogue as Joss is, Squishy. I think we have to be grateful that the dialogue isn't as bad as in "Z Nation." The dialogue has to be written by a couple of 11-year-old boys.
Yeah... were is Ward's little brother? And is he crazypants too?
@NYPinTA - probably, though I would love to see him be the kind of crazy that offs his own brother(s).
Has that Agent Carter promo been show before this? I completely forgot about it til just now.
No. I think the promo just debuted today.

This episode ended really strong. I don't think theres been a bad episode yet this season.
I liked this one less, but everyone (except Trip) had something to do and a purpose, so it's still an improvement over bad episodes from last season.
I love that the women in this are the muscle, yet aren't macho.
Another good episode - as others have noted, the pacing may be the most notable change since last season and here's hoping they keep it up. My highlights:

*May's "You know I don't like you"
*Ward's "I'm a member of this team" delusion reveal
*Ward's perp walk
*Fight scene was again top notch as was "Buffy Stake Flying Disc"
*Every Single Moment Bobbi Morse was on screen
*The Ward Negotiations Cross Cutting was effective

Ward on the loose, Skyedad lurking, Whitehall plotting, Raina undoubtedly still to reappear - our heroes have their hands full. Just the way I like it.
I really thought they would bring up an old photo of Whitehall and that Simmons would start unraveling the mystery of why he hasn't aged. But it was that guy from the beginning of the episode instead.

Lance and Bobbi's bickering is a bit cliche but it's fun, and I think it provides them with a little more personality. I don't think he's leaving at all, though it would be fun if he did and found an escaped Ward.
I think Jemma is going to kill Ward, just as she promised.
I think someone will take out Ward this season ... I think I can put away my full on Redemption Arc fears. I wouldn't be surprised come finale time he shows up to save Skye's life but dies in attempt, but is denied any "He died a good man" platitudes.

I'm also guessing Skye's powers manifest to take out the Big Bad, whether that be Whitehall or PapaSkye. Also gotta think there'll be SHIELD casualties as well.
I wonder if Senator Ward is a bigger bad than the other two.
Count me as another totally digging the MacFitz vibe.

The improvement in the show this season has been phenomenal. It has gone from being a show that I'd squeeze in at some point during the week to one I watch before all others. Kudos to the crew and cast.

I also hope they do whatever they can to sign Adrianne Palicki on as a permanent cast member.
Did anyone else get a sense of deja vu when Ward walked past Triplett, Coulson, Fitz, Skye, and Simmons. I thought it was eerily similar to Loki being brought onto the Helicarrier and walking past Bruce Banner.

The Mac/Fitz vibe has been present since the beginning of the season. I can dig it, whether it stays platonic or turns into something else, I just want Fitz to feel better about his current state.

I don't trust Grant and Christian Ward. I hope Trip, Mac, Bobbi, and Lance get more screen time, and the Wards' pop in every few episodes as big/minor bads.
Hrmmm I wonder if Tattoo guy is the younger Ward sibling.
Tattoo guy looks much older than Grant Ward, so I'm thinking not.
Good ep. Good show, lately.
ok hi hello I haven't been here in forever but AOS IS SO FRICKIN GOOD THIS SEASON. And so here I am.

So I'm very interested in Ward's internal alarm clock but also the way he just kept saying he could take Skye to her father but not that he knew where he was. You sort of read it as him just trying to get out and be with her, but I think it's more-- something weird is going on with him. So does anyone think Skye's father is... idk controlling him or linked to him or some kind of thing?

Also put me down for team Mac/Fitz all the way! hell yeah. I feel like they're throwing it at us pretty heavily-- I really hope they follow through.
Am I nuts or was Tattoo Guy at the end of the episode played by the same actor as FBI agent Colby Granger in Numb3rs, Dylan Bruno?

And was I the only one who initially started to geek out when Coulson referred to the SHIELD agent leading the team in Belgium as "Agent Walters" and started thinking "Are they introducing She-Hulk to the MCU as a SHIELD agent?!" before having her character offed by a Diviner Disk?

And Ward's behaviour, both shown and referred to, in the episode...does it not strike you as like Skye's dad but the calm periods not quite as even? Because all the Ward-focused scenes and dialogue seem to paint a picture of something a tad more crazy than just psychosis.
BlueEyedBrigadier: I just got off work & haven't seen this ep yet, but Dylan Bruno was Rooster in the episode with Sif (1x15 "Yes Men"). If tattoo guy wasn't him, Dylan's older brother Chris (most notably of USA's Dead Zone) looks and sounds a lot like him.

[ edited by QingTing on 2014-10-29 11:08 ]
BlueEyedBrigadier, no you weren't the only one. I wondered if it was Jennifer Walters too!
Though Chris Bruno is around the same age as Tim DeKay, and definitely not younger than Brett Dalton.
If the guy was younger than Brett, he wasn't one of the Brunos. Dylan is 42, Chris is 48. Neither of them could even kind of pass for younger than Brett's not-quite 32.
@aphasia
@BlueEyedBrigadier

It's All Connected. Unless It's Not. I Don't Know.
I'm pretty sure Tattoo Guy is Brian Van Holt from Cougar Town :-)
Also, I don't think he is related to the Wards at all, but is probably the one who made the carvings behind the religious painting.
Maybe they are going for the Ward Brothers spinoff. They tag line should be something like: "Two brothers, one is an evil backstabbing hypocrite, the other is a crazy former Hydra agent".
"Wards of the State" Coming next Fall to ABC.

[ edited by JesusSavedIn01 on 2014-10-29 14:14 ]
I doubt they will pull the trigger on Fitz/Mac, as far as anything beyond "bromance." They are targeting an action-oriented male demographic with this show, and unfortunately that demographic is not friendly toward male gay storylines.

The last thing they want surrounding this show is an angry culture-war controversy, with hashtags and death threats and boycotts and all that stuff. The writers may be up for it, but I doubt the suits are.

We may continue to get subtext and jokey references to Fitz's admiration of Mac's physique, but I don't think they'll go full-on Torchwood with this.
I'm not sure how much controversy this would actually generate. It's not like a ton of people watch the show. And it's not like there are no gay relationships of any kind on TV. But also, for the first time, the number of states that support gay marriage accurately represents the level of support for it among the population.
Among the general population, yes... but this show targets a demographic that is probably among the most uncomfortable with it.

Network TV is risk-averse. A large part of the AoS audience would be "grossed out" by a male gay relationship and would stop watching... loudly and angrily, in some cases. That's unfortunate, but good luck lecturing an audience on their intolerance and bigotry.
I have to say, I didn't read Fitz's reaction to Mac when his head Simmons was noting his muscles as Fitz being attracted. Because not only is he dealing with his injury, he's also still dealing with the idea that Simmons left after he told her he had feelings for her and he knew she and Tripp seemed to hit it off quite well before everything happened and I took it as him thinking Simmons would find Mac more to her liking if she were around. I saw it as an example of his insecurities. Even though he does like and trust Mac, which must mess with him a bit seeing as the last person he trusted was Ward... and well... that didn't work out so good.
Mac's conversation with Simmons in this episode looked an awful lot like somebody trying to run off a rival.

Does Mac really think his brand-new relationship with Fitz is such that it's his place to confront Simmons, who has been his inseparable companion since their Academy days... to the point that when she left, he hallucinated her back by his side?

Simmons is a S.H.I.E.L.D. agent. She has a job to do, and as it turns out this job was a pretty important one. Her job is not to babysit Fitz, and Mac should know that.

Even if Simmons agreed with his observation, he was out of line to make it.

I foresee some serious drama coming out of this triangle.
Also, I really do hope that we eventually get the truth about Ward and his brother and which one was the evil one (first). I did feel sorry for Ward once he found out that his brother might be able to get his hands on him. This in no way means I was even close to forgiving him for what he did to Fitz and Simmons, but I do think in his warped mind he was "saving" them. But he made concious choices to still be Garrett's man and be team Hydra after the fact, so he doesn't get a pass for anything from me. But I still feel bad that he's that afraid of his brother. So I do want to know. Is Ward telling the truth? Was his brother that vicious that he was able to make Ward basically torture his younger brother? Or is Ward so warped that he did it on his own and tried to blame his older brother for everything?
@NYPinTA - that's kind of how I see it as well. Fitz feeling insecure about himself. SIX, I mean head-Jemma, remarking on Mac's physique was FITZ imagining that Jemma would be attracted to MAC because he's buff while FITZ is skinny-nerd-friend.

@AndrewCrosset - They are all working for a common higher purpose and if Mac sees that Jemma is actually hindering Fit'z progress, then yeah, it's his place to say so. Should he potentially let missions be compromised or agents die because he doesn't want to step on Jemma's toes? I think Mac understands that it's bigger than that.

I do feel for Jemma because she genuinely doesn't know what to do. She cares for Fitz and wants to be there for him and help him but doesn't know how.
It wouldn't surprise me if the other purpose to Mac joining the team will be Coulson realizing there needs to be someone to keep an eye on everyone's state of mind. Like he's their Troi. (ST:TNG anyone?) Because it did seem a bit out of place to me too, but also necessary. So... May put together the original team with layers of purpose for everyone. That's kinda the SHIELD way, right?
They are all working for a common higher purpose and if Mac sees that Jemma is actually hindering Fit'z progress, then yeah, it's his place to say so.

If there's a problem, then it's Coulson's place to say so. Mac is a mechanic who's been on the team for all of six weeks. He is not Simmons' boss.
I also saw that scene as more about Fitz's insecurities ... he feels inadequate, and thinks that Simmons would like the big strong guy. I read it as him being jealous of someone who Simmons could actually like, not being attracted to the person himself. Obviously he likes, admires, and gets along with Mac, but I'm not seeing the romantic thing.

If someone's going to be bi, I'm kind of hoping it's Simmons. There did seem to be some flirty chemistry between her and Bobbi. But maybe I'm just seeing what I want to see, IDK.

If they *are* going for a Fitz/Mac storyline, I really don't think it would be a major issue. ABC is very okay with gay characters (see: any Shonda Rhimes show).

[ edited by erendis on 2014-10-29 17:05 ]
@AndrewCrosset, I think he was definitely in line to say that to her because they're part of a team. He cares about Fitz, just like the others. Fitz wants them to stop treating him like he's useless, but he hates being treated like he's not any different, too. Mac's new to the team, but he's not going to hold back if another member of the team is having trouble. Saying he's just "the new guy" or "the mechanic" is like saying FitzSimmons is "just scientists." Everyone on the team has an opinion.

Fitz's physical problems aside, her leaving affected his mental state. And when she gets back, she's trying to help but her presence makes him worse because she's trying to pretend he's the same old Fitz when he's not. He's said things and done things that have changed him completely, and her efforts to make it look otherwise make him feel as if she's rejecting him again.

[ edited by the ninja report on 2014-10-29 17:14 ]
Mac is the new guy and only knows this rendition of Fitz. He likes him right now. He felt the need to defend him from language and behavior that he interpreted as undercutting his new friend. I don't necessarily agree with how he did it but I think he was correct and within his rights as a new friend.
If they *are* going for a Fitz/Mac storyline, I really don't think it would be a major issue. ABC is very okay with gay characters (see: any Shonda Rhimes show).

Yes, but this is very specifically not a Shonda Rhimes show. It's ABC's concerted attempt to bring in a mainstream young male audience. Disney/ABC is a gay friendly company, but they don't want to do anything to turn this show into a political football.

Even though it's a Disney/ABC show and a Whedon show, its target audience is not a very male-gay-friendly one. (The same audience would probably be perfectly OK with seeing Bobbi and Simmons getting caught together in the broom closet, though. Sad but true.)

Am I underestimating the tolerance and maturity of the overall AoS audience? Maybe, but considering that this show is already falling in the ratings (unjustly), I don't think Disney/ABC is going to want to test that.
If anything, Simmons should be seeking advice from Mac on how to better communicate with Fitz.
Mac is a mechanic who's been on the team for all of six weeks.


Do we know a timeline? Like, how long passed between seasons? I've been curious-- and I thought it was longer...

...and Wards of the State is gold! no thanks to that show, unless it's a wacky comedy, but hilarious anyway...
@NYPinTA - this is kinda what I'm feeling as well. Mac may be the "Mechanic", but I'm getting the feeling he is there to do more than just diagnose and fix problems with cars.

On another note, what the hell is Tripp doing there? Other than fly the Quinjett and act all wooden, he hasn't done anything of consequence this season. Maybe they will send him out to hunt Ward.

[ edited by Penthos on 2014-10-29 18:43 ]
All the MacFitz shipping, I was getting the MorseSimmons (MorSimmons?) vibe last week after Morse saved her. Let's just make the orientation of all the scientists vague. Oh the shipping wars that will lead to...
@aphasia I've got in my head that there were six months between seasons, but I can't remember where I read that.

Well, just as I was tired of the Ward-in-a-cage plot, he is now out of his cage. And I have no idea where he is going. He does seem sincere in wanting Skye to like him (perhaps the only thing he has been sincere about this season), so I can't see him going over to Hydra or going over to SkyeDaddy. My one thought is that maybe he will just be laying low for a while, but I have no idea where, and how long can he stay off the grid?

Solid episode this week. I am sad that we didn't get any follow up from Skye about it being a map. How does she know that? What is it a map for? WHY DID COULSON NOT BOTHER TO ASK THESE QUESTIONS? Hmph.

Also, Agent Carter preview and Avengers promos were very exciting. And I'm very ready for sweeps episodes. :)

And to whoever mentioned Skye going evil/alien and ending up the Big Bad...I wonder if Ward will be the Xander to her Willow, or the Buffy to her Angel. Hmm.
Okay, this episode was tight. The action scenes were spot on, though one Mocking-bird stick hit looked like it didn't make contact with the Hydra-Agent that went down hard. But I'm nitpicking.

Also, this whole MacFitz thing seems unlikely. FitzSimmons is going to be a tormented and tortuos affair for a time and then one of them has to die. It's a Whedon show. Also, Mac might die a hero's death. I think at least one of these main team characters has to be sacrifieced during this season. And Mac seems like a great guy, so his death would have a certain pathos.

Ward taking out the guards at the end of the episode :D
In order for MacFitz to be a thing, they'd have to have Fitz -- who has been in love with Simmons -- switch his orientation. I know this is theoretically possible, e.g., Willow did it after Oz, but it doesn't really seem to make sense here. In fact, it seems to me like Fitz is STILL in love with Simmons, or at least that he's still heartbroken from her departure. So I'm skeptical that they'll go the MacFitz route.
Fitz could be bi. As could Simmons. No switching required.
Caught up now. end_of_the_world_optimist is right; tattoo guy is Brian Van Holt, not a Bruno, (and definitely not younger than Brett or able to pass as such).
Yes, he could be bi, that is a good point. Strangely, I can think of very few, if any, truly bisexual characters on network TV. They seem very rare, even compared to gay or transgender characters.

Maybe Jim Gordon's fiancé on Gotham is an example?

Prince Oberyn Martell in Game of Thrones and maybe Piper in Orange is the New Black are examples from non-network TV.

[ edited by Squishy on 2014-10-29 22:21 ]
Yes, they're very rare on tv. It's a problem. I was happy to see Gotham prove an exception early on.
Callie on Greys Anatomy on ABC is bi.
There's also Kalinda (The Good Wife) and Bo (Lost Girl).
Several unrelated thoughts.

1. I'd sort of like to get to see Mac get some more character moments that don't deal with his relationship with Fitz. I really do like the two of them onscreen together, but it feels like most of what we know about Mac is in relationship to his friendship with Fitz.

2. I sort of miss the feeling of closeness that the characters had last season before things blew up. We don't get to see the original team onscreen together much, even ignoring Ward. I miss the jet set and the feeling that they all live on it together. I miss Lola. Not that I'd go back--the show has to move forward, develop and such, and I understand that.

3. My how the team is getting large. Coulson, Skye, May, Fitz, Simmons, Tripp, Mockingbird, Lance, and Mac. That's nine people, as many as we had on Firefly. It's a bit tricky to service all those characters in a single episode and advance the overarching story, which is likely why we get episodes where some of them don't figure heavily into the plot. There's also certain interactions that we haven't seen much of yet. I don't know how you'd get an excuse for it, but I'd like to see an episode with all of them around a table in a bit more casual of a setting, even for a little bit. The size of the cast also makes me wonder if they're going to cull the cast soon, one way or another...

Also on that note, we've got quite a few antagonists on the prowl. Skye's dad, Hydra, Raina, at least one of the Brothers Ward, and up until recently, Talbot. All of these seem to be working slightly different angles as well. Keeps things interesting.

4. Oh, and let's not forget Quinn. It's been ages since we've heard from him. Is the actor wrapped up at the moment, or are they intentionally saving him for later? The end of last season made it sound like he was going to factor into the plot of this season more.

5. I also hope we get to see more of Mike Peterson this season, though I doubt we'll see him until much later, the plot just seems to busy at the moment.
Bi men, in particular, are a rare breed on TV, it seems. Outside of Game of Thrones, the only one that jumps to mind would be Kieren from In the Flesh (and that's only based on creator interviews - in the context of the show, you'd assume he's gay).

ETA: Totally forgot about Jack Harkness - I've never seen the show, but I believe he's bi?

[ edited by Knuckleball on 2014-10-30 05:03 ]
It's a little strange that the show actually feels bigger just when SHIELD has gotten a whole lot smaller, but I like the energy of the larger cast and the characters they've added. I was one of the few(er) who enjoyed S1 all the way through, but I think S2 has upped the game in just about every way so far. The show's firing on all cylinders.
Jack Harkness is indeed bi. I honestly can't think of another bi guy either.

Reaching out a bit to try to think of any other bi characters that haven't been mentioned, Delphine and Cosima from Orphan Black are bi, though Cosima's also a character that you would assume is gay if it weren't for an interview.

There's actually a cartoon example. Marceline from Adventure Time is a bi character as she was shown to have a boyfriend at one point in the past, and it has been heavily implied that she and Princess Bubblegum dated in the past, though it would seem that executive meddling has forced the writers to deny it. There's been two instances where someone from the show has stated that the two did in fact date, but then the information has been pulled (a behind the scenes video in one case, a tweet in the other), and they've then stated that they were mistaken. I'm certain that some exec at Cartoon Network is getting in the way of the writer's intention. But I've gotten quite off topic.

What I guess I was trying to say was there are a few more bi characters than had been stated, but not bi males.
I'm loving the show this season.

But I have to say, has there ever in the history of television been a successful prisoner transfer?
Found a very interesting article on inadequate bisexual representation in the media, excerpted below.

"Indeed, according to GLAAD's latest media reports, on television, out of the "66 regular or recurring LGBT characters on scripted cable television, 35 are gay men, while only 4 are bisexual males." Meanwhile, of the 102 LGBT-inclusive films released in 2013 (note that's not all films, just the ones that had LGBT characters), there was only one bisexual male character. That means that less than 6% of LGBT representation on television was of bisexual men, and less than 1% in films in 2013.
. . . .
Asking for media representation isn't asking diversity for diversity's sake — it's for the sake of accuracy.

According to a 2011 Williams Institute report, researchers found that about half of the LGBT community identifies as bisexual. Yet, as mentioned above, there are only a few bisexual characters portrayed in media."
I don't know about anyone else, but I had a real problem with Ward's "escape". Theoretically, SHIELD is the world's most elite security force, and they are transporting someone who is demonstrably a brutal killer. Someone who has helped create an existential threat to SHIELD's existence and the safety of the entire world.

Yet they use less precautions transporting this prisoner than your local jail uses when transporting a drunk who assaulted a cop.

We have already seen May kick butt when put in handcuffs and Ward gave her a tough time before she nailed him. So if this was a real escape, it is several orders of magnitude dumber than anything we have ever seen Phil Coulson do.

I am hoping several weeks from now we are going to see a private moment between May and Coulson where May says, "You know Phil, releasing this thing back into the wild is a hellavu big risk. It's already cost us six life model decoys. I hope you know what you're doing." Coulson: "So do I."

For even more bonus points, have a later scene with Ward saying, "I know Coulson let me go. I just don't know why. But if he's going to give me the chance to kill half a dozen SHIELD agents, I'm going to take it."

Layers within layers within layers.

[ edited by RobynH on 2014-10-30 08:04 ]
It wasn't SHIELD doing the transport. I thought that was made perfectly clear in the ep.
@JDL Correct, the last we see of Ward in the SHIELD base they put a bag over his head which is right after Simmons says she'll kill him if she sees him again. Next time we see Ward he no longer has the bag on his head and they are in a parking garage or something where it's clear they are turning him over to the "Authorities"(Army?). That's when Coulson says "don't give him an inch" as they are putting ward in the back of a transport vehicle. So at the time of the escape, he is no longer in SHIELD custody.

This gives Coulson cover because he can say "we turned Ward over to your men and he escaped, that's not on us". Did Coulson expect him to escape? Perhaps ... I certainly would not be surprised if that was the case.
I agree that putting Ward in nothing but cuffs was silly. But I also took it that it wasn't SHIELD that had him in the van. And we've seen that the general military underestimates SHIELD level villains. (See also: transmutation guy.) But I also wondered if Coulson didn't plan his escape either, figuring he'd lead them to... stuff and things...

I do hope that they start spreading the plot more evenly among the characters. And when I say that I really mean, "Give Tripp more screen time. I love that guy."

Just wanted to point out: On Torchwood Ianto was bi as well. He started out on the show with a girlfriend he was trying to save and then later he fell in love with Jack. Owen might have been too, but they only hinted at it.
On Lost Girl, three characters are bi. Bo, Tamsin, and Evony. All are women. (I'm hoping in Season 5 they add a few more characters, as they have space for them, and adding at least one male gay or bi character would be good, IMO.)
I don't think Coulson would have planned for Ward's escape, knowing that he would certainly kill innocent soldiers in doing so.

I wondered why they would put a bag over Ward's head and then take it off, but I guess it's to make sure he doesn't figure out the location of the secret HQ.

(Is Tamsin bi on Lost Girl? It seems I heard something of the sort, but I haven't seen any evidence of it beyond that one time she kissed Bo during her Dawning.)
Y'know, I think Fitz really deserves his own little face in the site banner. He's been amazing so far this season.
So the world didn't know about SHIELD until the Battle of New York? And I predict Talbot will be leading SHIELD next season.
Sorry to keep going OT... but AndrewCrossett it's on the Lost Girl website that Tamsin is, plus there's Season 4 stuff. I'll say no more, because spoilers. But Lost Girl is a different kind of show where relationships are the focus, unlike AoS, which so far is more focused on saving the world and stuff. The ships born in the fandom seem to be fandom only so far. But if they add more relationship stuff in the show my only hope is that it is compelling and feels true, I don't care who it's between. As long as they keep up the May/Tripp snark fest at Lance's expense. Because that will never get old.
And I predict Talbot will be leading SHIELD next season
@Simon ... so then, what of Coulson?
I suspect Talbot will be the one running interference and keeping the government off S.H.I.E.L.D.'s back (or trail, depending on how things go with the Wards.)

I hope to see him and Coulson keeping each other in line and driving each other crazy for a long time to come.
so then, what of Coulson?


He'll be back in the field.

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