Interesting. But are they talking about Buffy as a character? Or Sarah as an actress? Because the way she's been going........oy. What does she way now, 50 lbs? Overly skinny hollywood actresses may not be the way to tell teens how to be in terms of weight.

Just a thought.

EdDantes | March 25, 11:53 CET

Ouch! Harsh. But yeah, Sarah is tiny and kind of an unrealistic goal for overweight teens. But I think the writer is basically suggesting away to get these kids to listen. I think Buffy is more popular over there than in America, and using their interests to convey a message about obesity is a good idea. But yeah, don't use Sarah...

[ edited by kaivaal on 2004-03-26 04:27 ]

kaivaal | March 25, 12:23 CET

The writer must have missed the "cookie dough" speech.

Simon | March 25, 12:57 CET

LOL, Simon.

electricspacegirl | March 25, 14:11 CET

Yikes. This article does concern me a bit. I get their point about using role models the kids/teens want to identify with, but I still hate the idea of super-skinny SMG being offered up as a role model. Besides, Buffy and everyone around her have never been shown to have a very nutritional diet. How many times did they eat pizza and doughnuts?

Joss' bitch | March 25, 17:17 CET

I can see the Daily Mail's headlines already:

"Report tells young people to stay up all night and kill just to be like their role model.
Parents outraged.
"I'm shocked" says Tory M.P.
Buffy star unavailable for comment
Will house prices collapse? "

Simon | March 25, 17:38 CET

I see they're panicking about ending up like the awful Americans again. Can't seem to get away from that.

weds | March 25, 18:01 CET

I'll admit, I found Gellar most attractive when she still had a little bit of baby fat on her, back in Season One. She also started getting more towards a normal weight in Season Seven. She was thin enough that she looked harsh.

Admittedly, she is a small-boned person. Didn't Ms. Calendar say, "She's so little!"

Ocular | March 25, 18:38 CET

I also thought SMG had the best figure in season 1, but she was still maturing. She is little, she's like 5'5 or so. From my viewpoint as a girl who stands 5'11, that is little to me. But I did think she got way too skinny toward the end.

electricspacegirl | March 25, 19:09 CET

electricspacegirl, I wish I were 5'11. You're lucky. SMG is even littler than you think -- 5'3 at the most. I heard SMG say that she was 5'3 in some interview or other and I remembered it because it's my height, too. But never mind the height factor, SMG didn't have to get scrawny. And alas, she did get scrawny after the first two years of Buffy. The Hollywood pressure to be as thin as possible took its toll. I feel bad for her, truth be told.

phlebotinin | March 25, 19:20 CET

Someone explain to me how SMG gets so much attention for being "too thin" yet nothing is ever said about Amy Acker, who is way thinner. Also, Alyson Hannigan, Emma Caulfield and Michelle Trachtenburg are all as equally thin, they just have bigger boobs.

And I honestly don't think SMG felt pressured by Hollywood to be as thin as possible. Some of her weight loss was due to the fact that she matured and lost the "baby fat" in her face and was on a show that required her to be very physical. You try doing martial arts moves and running all the time and see what your figure would look like after seven years of doing it. And I'm not saying she looks too thin but more lean and more toned which is expected for the type of stuff she was doing.

And as a comparison, James Marsters looks totally different from his earlier Spike days too. His face also was more fuller than it is now, and at times I think he looks too thin in the face. His part and SMG's part were very physical roles and it makes sense that after years of doing it, it would show up in their appearances.

Okay, I know people will then say that DB looks like he's put on weight but here's a thought, on Buffy, Buffy's character is always doing physical stuff and usually when Spike was in scenes so was he but most of the other characters weren't involved all the time. On Angel, all the main characters are constantly shown in major fight scenes so they, as individuals aren't carrying the load.

There's one scene in Buffy where she's punching a bag (not the scene from the musical, which in slow motion made her look fragile) but another one, shown in real time where she's supposed to look focused and she's hitting the bag hard. Her muscle tone looked great.

Firefly Flanatic | March 25, 20:05 CET

blwessels--I appreciate that you continually defend SMG against the frequent focus on her weight, but surely you must agree that whether it is natural or not, her body is not the norm and not one that should reasonably be held up as a goal for overweight teens? SMG may not have an eating disorder but being pressed to look like her would certainly create quite a lot of them in others.

This article is suggesting using the popular character of Buffy for PR, not SMG as a goal, I know, but people are just exploring the ramifications of that and I think it is a valid concern.

[ edited by stakeholder on 2004-03-25 18:56 ]

marmoset | March 25, 20:15 CET

Wait wait wait... what I'm concerned about in this article is the mention of The Darkness. The Darkness? The band, or that thing that vampires disappear into? Because... the lead singer of that band is deathly skinny.

Also, on the Buffy side... I think Buffy is a great physical role model, and I dont think it's really about in what season she looked like what. It's about the fact that when you watch Buffy, you start doing things like... walking everywhere you go, clutching a stake. And jumping around on your furnature, pretending to fight invisable vampires. And you seriously start considering kickboxing classes, or ice skating lessons... or cheerleading, or even skateboarding.

Buffy promotes MOVING. And yes, they still eat junk food, but, for the love of pete, thank *pete* you can still do both. I am so sick of everyone acting like eating is the devil, lately.

Promoting physical activity with jelly donuts and library research afterward? Best role models ever.

Cole Searr | March 25, 20:18 CET

One thing I have noticed about Buffy is that the characters seem to walk a lot. I don't think that Buffy ever had a drivers license. I think that is a good example for kids. Just recently a friend was telling me how her teen daughter was mad because instead of driving the car to the next store in the mall her mother wanted to walk. Perhaps needless to say the teen who wanted to be driven this short distance has a bit of a weight problem.

pesoto74 | March 25, 20:33 CET

I always appreciated that they walked a lot as well. In the 15 years since I got my drivers' license I have almost never had a car and I've been really blown away by the very short distances my family used to drive without a second thought. I was very happy that they made it clear that Buffy didn't get a license, I wish their had been a character around like that when I was a teenager.

marmoset | March 25, 20:52 CET

i do have to say that i am too guilty of fighting invisible vampires in my living room, and when i watch buffy thats generally when i do part of my workout, it does motivate me more to exercise. i am not saying that SMGs weight is ideal, for most it would be very unhealthy, but i do agree with it encouraging you to move, because it does me.

AngelicSlayer | March 25, 21:31 CET

Stakeholder, my point was that yes she's thin but she certainly isn't anorexic and the rest of my point was she isn't any thinner than the other actresses on the show yet everyone focuses on her weight and I never hear anyone comment about Amy Acker who is much thinner than SMG.

They never showed Buffy or her friends talking about dieting or wanting to lose weight. Buffy has always been just real physical and people in real life who are physical are usually trim and lean. And yes they showed her at the library with her friends eating donuts but they also showed her having many a meal with her mother and they were sit down and eat meals. There were many scenes between Joyce and Buffy sitting in the kitchen having breakfast or a snack.

If Buffy was thin and always talking about dieting and never doing any sort of exercise and never wanting to eat because she was trying to lose weight, yeah, I'd think that would be a problem to be using her character as a role model. But Buffy showed a girl who got plenty of exercise, ate healthy meals and junk food but wasn't overweight. To me that is a good role model.

And as for things pressuring girls to look a certain way, blame runway models and models in magazines. I was shocked when I was leafing through my daughter's Seventeen magazine. They had one girl in there that was so thin she looked like she belonged in a concentration camp. There were other girls just as thin as this girl and they made SMG look overweight.

Firefly Flanatic | March 26, 00:06 CET

Blwessels, I'm sorry but I don't understand what you're defending SMG against. Nobody attacked her. No one says she CAUSED the current 'girls must look like skeletons' thing. If anything, the point is she's another victim of it.

And yes, Amy Acker and the others are just the same (except Amy Acker pretty much IS this skinny. She's a ballerina and has always looked this way. Sarah we saw slowly get skinnier and skinnier and if she wasn't an actress I can pretty much guarantee you she'd be small and petite but certainly heavier than this.) But this article didn't talk about them. They talked about Buffy. If it had mentioned Amy or Alyson or whatever I would've said the same thing.

And yeah Buffy as a character is a good role model and exercised a lot, but kids look at movies and TV and will basically think "I want to look like that". And I'm worried that even the most repsonsible use of her and others like her as a rolemodel about weightloss would possibly push that into 'I SHOULD look like that'. And there's enough of that going around already.

Also, I'm glad you're so certain Sarah isn't annorexic. I myself am not so sure. I remember one of those Spice girls getting skinnier and skinnier and getting mad whenever anyone dared suggest she could have annorexia. Now she's writing a book about her eating disorders. I've just been worried for a while now that Sarah might come with similar news. I certainly hope I'm wrong but she really started looking annorexic to me. Her bones really started sticking out in S6 and S7. And she looked a lot cuter with some more 'padding'.

I just hate it how all those girls feel they should look like skeletons because of the media. It's just gotten worse and worse and the number of eating disorders just rises. The Friends actresses have it in their contract to stay below a certain weight. And it's not a healthy weight either. And I don't understand it. They all start looking like they're sick or something. It's just not attractive.

And yeah, the 'heroin chic' thing with fashion models is where this started. Btw if there was ever a disgusting term......

Well at least Eliza Dushku is slim but not bony. Maybe she has more muscle tissue but she's always kept a firmness to her that's quite refreshing.

EdDantes | March 26, 01:35 CET

blwessels--I understood your point and did not need it reiterated.

*My* point is that it is a reasonable concern that in using a beloved role model to promote health when that role model is portrayed by a woman who is noticeably thinner than the norm, regardless of whether this is her natural state or not, could pose negative consequences. I agree that Buffy is probably a good example and I wrote this: This article is suggesting using the popular character of Buffy for PR, not SMG as a goal, I know, but people are just exploring the ramifications of that... in order to avoid a response that focused on all the ways that Buffy is a good role model. The concern is neither that Buffy is a bad example nor that SMG is unnaturally thin (I never once said that), the concern is that it could have serious consequences if young girls conflate Buffy's on-screen behavior with SMG's sveltness. The problem is not whether it is the natural state of SMG's body, I have no idea nor do I care about that, the problem is that it would not be a natural state for most women's bodies and it worries me that some young women might confuse just who it is, the concept of Buffy or the look of SMG, they are pressed to emulate.

Also, I agree that there are many other examples of extremely thin women out there which create pressure on the general population. I think it is problematic to blame them for this and not the industry that demands and promotes it. I would certainly like to see women who go into the business just refusing to go along with it but I feel that unless there is dialogue out there about the issue that isn't going to happen. Whether SMG is the way nature made her or not, she is nonetheless very thin and she represented a character that became an international icon and therefore serves as an example for people to discuss. I think it is healthy and constructive for people to point out the problems with an industry that coerces women into feeling bad about themselves and of course they are going to use the thin women in the industry to highlight discussions.

I don't want to get into a big back and forth over this. When people get very harsh over SMG on a very personal level you are good about defending her and, as I wrote in the earlier post, I appreciate that. I myself was not doing that however and I don't feel as though you accorded my post with the same consideration. I hope that this lengthier post clears up any part of my position that was not evident initially.

marmoset | March 26, 01:53 CET

Stakeholder: "I myself was not doing that however and I don't feel as though you accorded my post with the same consideration."

Okay, I don't know why you seem to think I didn't show you the same consideration. I explained my views in response to you expressing your opinion. I don't feel anything I said was insulting or attacking you or inconsiderate. I thought my post was more speculating on why people seem so focused on SMGs weight but never seem to comment on the other actresses who are equally as skinny. Wasn't saying anywhere that she should be a poster girl for good health. And the article never said use SMG or Buffy as a role model. It said that "we need to use the culture of the pupils by enlisting the support of their teen idols in the OB crusade - Buffy the Vampire Slayer avoiding junk food - as an example". Now because Buffy is no longer on the air that would be hard to do but I think what they were getting at is that television shows with huge followings amongst the youth should make a point of showing the characters living a healthy lifestyle. My comments to the rest of my post said that I felt BtVS did a good job of that by showing them eating regular meals and sitting down to dinner with her family and all the physical activity of walking around (and the slayage of course too). I'm sorry if you took my comments as me being condescending, that certainly was not my intent at all.

And EdDantes, any chance you can get in a dig about SMGs weight you do it, hence your "what is she 50 pounds" comment. This isn't the first thread you've done that in, one recently back you suggested "she eat something". And really Ed, she's at least 75 pounds :^)

And I wasn't defending SMG, I was commenting on why I just don't get her getting all this attention because she's thin but no one else seems to on Joss's shows. Yes, she's gotten thinner and it is perfectly believable that a lot of that is because she lost some baby fat and had the most physical role of all her female co-stars. Since Buffy ended she actually looks to have put on some weight. And time will tell, if she gets skinnier then it wasn't because of her physical role on Buffy, hopefully it was. And Amy Acker may have used to be a ballerina but she isn't anymore and unless she is still constantly training like she is one, she really should've put on a bit of weight. Out of all athletes, ballerinas, unfortunately are encouraged to be severly underweight. As for the girls from Friends, they got skinnier every season and I doubt it's because their jobs are really physical. I'm not disagreeing with anyone that our society has a problem with girls and role models.

I just don't see how one line in an article "Secondly, we need to use the culture of the pupils by enlisting the support of their teen idols in the OB crusade - Buffy the Vampire Slayer avoiding junk food - as an example", is the same as saying this article said to use her, or SMG as a role model. The article was suggesting that society should show it's teen role models eating in a healthy manner and living a healthy lifestyle. And everyone started saying that the article said SMG should be used as a role model and it clearly did not say that at all.

[ edited by blwessels on 2004-03-26 01:06 ]

Firefly Flanatic | March 26, 03:06 CET

I don't feel anything I said was insulting or attacking you or inconsiderate.

I didn't suggest that you did, what I meant was that rather than respond to my post you chose to explain why Buffy would be a great role model, which is never something that I was contesting. I feel that you didn't actually "consider" what I was saying.

And the article never said use SMG or Buffy as a role model.

And, hence, my comment: This article is suggesting using the popular character of Buffy for PR[public relations], not SMG as a goal, I know, but people are just exploring the ramifications of that...; which I stated in my original post and copied in the second. I hope the third time's the charm.

I just don't see how one line in an article "Secondly, we need to use the culture of the pupils by enlisting the support of their teen idols in the OB crusade - Buffy the Vampire Slayer avoiding junk food - as an example", is the same as saying this article said to use her, or SMG as a role model. The article was suggesting that society should show it's teen role models eating in a healthy manner and living a healthy lifestyle. And everyone started saying that the article said SMG should be used as a role model and it clearly did not say that at all.

Well, see, that's my whole point, I don't think people were doing that. I think people were expressing that it could potentially creat a difficult and dangerous situation if, in using Buffy, these teens got the impression that they should look like the actor who played Buffy, regardless of the reason that the actor is very slender. I find it strange that you think that it would be very easy for every young person to be able to separate the two (Buffy & SMG). Some might, but what people here are concerned about is that some might not.

I'm sorry if you took my comments as me being condescending, that certainly was not my intent at all.

No, I didn't feel that it was, I just felt that you weren't really responding to the points in my post. You seemed instead to use it as a springboard for explaining why Buffy is a good choice and why SMG isn't anorexic.

marmoset | March 26, 03:31 CET

Yes, SMG is too skinny. Yes, she needs to eat more than sushi. No, she should never be a role model for body image.
It's not slamming, it's fact. I would wager she is under the 'ideal body weight'.

Pretty OT, but I always thought Tara was a good ideal body size, until I saw Amber Benson in person and saw how teeeeeeny she was. I probably couldn't even SEE SMG in real life!

Rogue Slayer | March 26, 03:53 CET

Okay, SMG looks pretty good in my book. I was once a 5'2'', small boned, Oriental woman who didn't weigh over one hundred pounds until I was 28 years old, happily married, and pregnant. I have never had an eating disorder or any health problems. By body analysis and ideal body weight calculations there was nothing wrong with my stats. I am a health care professional by trade. Yet, I had difficulty getting medical insurance without lying about my, then 90lb, weight due to the silliness of North American demographics. It was rather irksome. Not to mention the fact that a first generation automobile airbag deployed on my petite frame will probably kill me. lol

SMG has a reputation for eating sushi, veggie burgers, and also liking meat. She works out five days a week. She does yoga and pilates on a regular basis. SMG has had a blue belt in Tae Kwon Do as a teenager. Buffy taught her a lot about martial arts and she has done a lot of training in this field. Has anyone having this discussion now seen her December,2002 pap pics from her Hawian vacation? She's got some pretty good looking abs. If you watched her Christina Aguilera spoof on SNL 2002, its not hard to see that she is pretty fit. If anyone looks hard at the Harsh Light of Days pictures, you will realize that that skinny abdomen is that of a body double. SMG has had a belly button ring since before Buffy. Pretty much every person who has seen her in real life in the last three years have commented on how fit and healthy she looks. Yet, time and time again, most people discussing her on the internet seem to ignore this.

I agree using Hollywood standards for the definition of a woman's physical form is a bad thing. I don't have a problem with using either Buffy or Sarah Michelle Gellar as role model. The weight loss of S1 to S4 is gradual. For S5, S6, and S7 most of the time she appeared quite stable. There are variations near the end of S5 and S7 based on both role and workload. S5 has SMG playing a tired and physically worn out Slayer, as well as an actress flying back and forth between LA and Australia doing SD. Since leaving Buffy, SMG has apparently increased slightly in weight.

[ edited by Anne 5_by_5 on 2004-03-26 07:31 ]

[ edited by Anne 5_by_5 on 2004-03-26 12:00 ]

Anne 5_by_5 | March 26, 09:02 CET