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October 20 2015

(SPOILER) Discuss Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. 3x04 "Devils You Know". This week's episode was written by Paul Zbyszewski and directed by Ron Underwood.

Woke up this morning groaning because it was just Tuesday. Then I remember it's SHIELD day.
SHIELD is the reason I look forward to Tuesdays.
Wiggle the leg, lady.
Is that the ginger ninja?
Woo, more Inhumans.....
It's nice to see Ginger Ninja using words like a person.
Off Topic: Seeing the way Alicia uses her dupes, makes me wish Fox would try doing X-Factor Investigations instead, rather than those X-men related tv projects announced last week.

[ edited by Numfar PTB on 2015-10-21 02:05 ]
Guns with flashlights! Have we seen these before? Mulder and Scully would be jealous.
They got Simmons back, but with so many people spread out, the team does feel understaffed.
Rosalind and Coulson are gonna smooch.
But sadly we lost the Dubsmash war at the last minute.
Didn't Daisy already know that Coulson was working with Acronym I Can't Remember?

(Also - Hey, Squishy!)
Mulder and Scully will probably get more of those next year.

And Hi, Squishy.
JDL - We lost the dubsmash war? Links plz!
Shadow clone recon. Smart.
The team is kind of understaffed. Nobody seems to be holding down the fort, unless one of the Lanyard Brothers is secretly there.
Oh. So he made an agreement, but is keeping stuff secret. Good.
Yay, Daisy still pulling her hacker skills.
Reminds me of when Willow was allowed to be tech-y instead of magick-y.
Hi all! Checking in, I"m about 15 minutes behind but I'm here!
Numfar, I agree. Going back to magick-y, I'm waiting for the moment (could be in a future season) when someone puts their hands on a stack of books and sucks all the words out of them.
The team is kind of understaffed. Nobody seems to be holding down the fort, unless one of the Lanyard Brothers is secretly there.

It's like you summoned May back.
Ooh, surprise! Glad to see May back in house but ...
And awkward entrance stage right...

Coulson isn't really learning from Fury's mistakes by fracturing his allies.

Gemma are right now?
Blair Underwood was an excellent casting decision for May's ex. I'm happy he's recurring.
Dubsmash Wars Link.
LOL @Sunfire.

Does Jemma have a hitchhiker under her skin?
Aha, Ward DOES know who Hunter is.
So that's cleared. Ward knows Hunter's face.
Andrew is Hydra, or something else not SHIELD.
Yep, Sunfire, that solves last week's debate about whether Ward and Hunter have already met.
Ahhhhhhh, NYC breaking news, aaaaaaahhhh.

If there were any imminent danger to the public, it would be justified, but seriously?

What just happened?
Yep, Andrew screwed up.
Fitz and May both have crappy luck in the love department.

Daisy vs Dragon Lady. That should be fun.
Something like that happened to me during the season 2 finale, javelina. Very annoying.
Coulson has a Sith hand now. Dislike.
Be careful. It's got laser finger.
Bionic Hands FTW
This guy is like me! Ouch!
Breaking news again. I am SORRY a police officer was shot, but he is in the hospital and they have captured the shooter and this entire thing is clearly an excuse to use the freaking news helicopter and show a huge traffic jam on the FDR.


Someone please tell me that commercials are on.
They uh are now, javelina. :(
So he shrinks down. He's that commando guy.
That does not look like fun - the only worse way to have your heart ripped out would be the Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom method.
I wonder if Lash is someone we know.
Maybe if they would break in whenever a cop kills a civilian I might sympathize. This can easily wait until the 11:00 news.
Better than last week.
If he kills Inhumans why didn't he go for Daisy? He's clearly not a fan of Jiaying's people.
He's necessary.
@Dusk, Daisy is clearly wondering the same thing.
what if Lash is Rosalind?
Or Roslind.

[ edited by Nebula1400 on 2015-10-21 02:48 ]
Or Rosalind's right hand guy?
Oh snap, Fitz.
Oooh, Nebula, that WOULD be a twist. Except Jemma hadn't been retrieved yet when Lash first showed up. [ETA - that's obvs in response to your Jemma theory.]


[ edited by javelina on 2015-10-21 02:50 ]
Was kinda hoing Andrew would be able to take care of himself.
Well, that was ... upsetting.
That Von Strucker kid is dead meat.
They are trying to make us THINK Lash is Rosalind?
Oooo... Andrew is Lash.

That's why he spared Daisy.
Wait is Dr. Garner definitely dead?
We didn't see a body so maybe not...

It was pretty clever of Ward from an evil POV. May is going to break him and Hunter.
If not body, he's DEFINITELY not dead.
I think Lash Rosalind's right-hand gun thug. He's always letting it be known he hates Daisy.
Andrew is Lash? Ooh!
Now???! Now she's going to tell him?? I can't wait a week!
Ahhhh, we're ending in these two notes? Cliffhanger much...
Kind of annoying they left us with the exact same cliffhanger as last week.
I cannot wait until next week.
I forgot who Andrew is.
Someone hit the fast forward button!
Next week does look pretty awesome.
But at least next week, we get some insight into what happened, Squishy. So I think we'll have some answers.
Great episode this week.I like how fast paced the season is episode to episode.
Yeah, I think Andrew transformed into Lash, killed the Hydra goons except for Strucker, who ran in terror. Would explain why Lash walked away from killing Daisy at the truck, and why Andrew is so interested in Inhumans.
Finally some answers on Jemma next week.
Makes a lot of sense, Andrew.
OOh back story next week!

Andrew interesting guess about...Andrew. It would explain why he bailed on May and won't let Coulson/Daisy form any Secret Warriors. And would be another reason for him to be mad he didn't know about the Ginger Ninja.

Or Banks for running off so fast. doubt it's Rosalind as Lash is almost certainly male and I doubt the show would make someone who directly works with the President a bad guy.

Kind of impressed they aren't dragging out Ward having an eye on Garner or Hunter's undercover mission. And now we'll get the planet story.

[ edited by Dusk on 2015-10-21 03:05 ]
Would explain why he left May all of sudden on vacation.
Pro: New cable box works great
Con: That episode ripped out my soul and sat on it.

Also, Lash is Glory.
AndrewCrossett, I'm hoping you're right. I'm afraid, however, that "Mr. May" is a goner.
Hey, does Coulson have the axe that cut off his hand hanging in his office? I just caught that.
So you're saying Andrew and Lash know each other, Grack21?
AndrewCrossett, I'm hoping you're right. I'm afraid, however, that "Mr. May" is a goner.

But the situation at the convenience store was clearly out of Hydra's control for some reason. The gasoline was just lying there tipped on the floor instead of splashed around, and something had clearly terrified Strucker. That wouldn't happen if they killed Andrew as planned, nor would Strucker be so afraid if Andrew just displayed some previously unseen ninja skills and got away or fought his way out.
And yes, Coulson has the axe triumphantly hanging on the wall. But I think Mack kinda wants it back.
No body, not dead. That rule is inviolate. Dr. Garner lives.
Hi everyone! I didn't pick up on Coulson's "Andrew is replaceable" foreshadowing until the show was over.
That Strucker kid was freaked out about something for sure, but at this point I wouldn't put it past them to have ANYTHING happen.
Time will tell. Right now it feels like the showrunners just threw an entire deck of cards up into the air.

Which is cool.
I couldn't catch up. I had to keep rewinding to try and catch dialogue here and there. Some of the dialogue was fast. But I loved the episode again. What a solid start to S3.

@AndrewCrossett - that's a really solid theory and it makes a lot of sense. I like it and want it to be true because it's so fun and hey more Blair Underwood! I couldn't figure out why Strucker Jr was so upset. But this theory would explain his spasms. And we don't know who died as we didn't see important faces.

And next week the Survivor: Dusty Planet episode. I so want to see Jemma in the wild. This is going to be very cool.

Is there a reason why Daisy is always in sleeveless outfits? Is that a comic book thing? I just find it odd.

Finally, when Mac is scared, I am scared. I was really feeling the Lash fear at the start.

Well done Shield!

[ edited by hann23 on 2015-10-21 03:18 ]

[ edited by hann23 on 2015-10-21 03:22 ]
@hann23 - "Survivor: Dusty Planet" - good one!

I couldn't keep because of "breaking news" that was neither breaking nor news, so am going to have to rewatch at some point.

Is Strucker Jr. good casting or what? So completely callow and hate-worthy.
What is Simmons is some sort of female Lash equivalent but doesn't know it yet? It would explain the lethal thing and in the show we don't actually know if Lash got his powers through the fish oil like Joey or if he's something else.
Spencer Treat Clark is like the reincarnation of 1980's James Spader. So snotty and punchable. (His characters, I mean...)
Thanks! I tend to enjoy survivalist shows but I bet I'll be hurting watching Jemma try to eek out her time on Dusty Planet.

Strucker Jr is good casting and I like him, but he reminds me so much of Owen Wilson. I keep expecting him to deliver a droll soliloquy.
YES! He does like like Owen Wilson! I knew he looked like SOMEONE.
Blair is shown as a Guest Star in E6, so not dead.
Lends credence to Andrew's Andrew theory.
i hope the planet thing is a lot more than just jemma surviving. I want to see some weird, cool shit on that planet.
I'm sure it will be, Squishy, otherwise the episode could be covered entirely in the previews.
I think Andrew's right too.
Yes, I think it will be too. I'm looking forward to some genre stuff.
Cast watch: Chad Lindberg, who played Dwight Frye, also played Dave in "I Robot, You Jane." So he has a history of playing computer geeks who get killed in Whedon shows.
"So you're saying Andrew and Lash know each other, Grack21?" ~Sunfire


Now I want it to be Andrew.
I don't believe Andrew is Lash. I DO believe that he became an Inhuman himself. That's why he ditched May in Hawaii. He changed, ran off, and is now trying to come to terms with his powers and secretly protect his Inhuman brethren, by keeping them off Daisy's team and out of harm's way. And that's why the ambush seems to have gone sideways and the Strucker kid is freaked out, because Andrew unleashed on them.

Actually, I think it might be possible he's some kind of anti-Lash. So there could be a connection yet. Like the whole "nature creates a balance" concept, where a predator evolves, but a defense against that predator also evolves simultaneously. I admit, that's complete wild speculation, but it would be a cool concept.

But no, it doesn't make sense that he's Lash. If he were Lash, he wouldn't have SHIELD keep all their previous potential recruits (Joey, and any Inhumans from the Illiad and Afterlife) under observation and protective custody. He'd authorize them for active duty and then take them out in the field. And Andrew has never displayed any overt animosity to the Inhumans. It doesn't really fit his character.

Of course, as always, I could totally be wrong, Andrew is Lash, and the writers are just going to overlook that glaring character inconsistency.

[ edited by Batman1016 on 2015-10-21 10:08 ]
@Batman1016 I agree. The only way I can see that working would be two distinct personalities and memories.

[ edited by JDL on 2015-10-21 19:01 ]
The logistics of the theory work so well that I might now be disappointed if it turns out to be false. And the episode is called "Devils You Know" after all.

[ edited by Huschel on 2015-10-21 10:17 ]
So many new faces, wish to hug all.

Back to the subject...
Andrew could see, in some twisted way, that he's protecting May by taking out the Inhumans. We don't really have a lot of good info on Andrew. He could have a vendetta or self imposed mission. It could even be part of Lash - the necessity to kill threats?

This would be ironic because the real threat to May and her family has been a very human Ward. Does Andrew know about Ward?

I love evil Ward.

[ edited by hann23 on 2015-10-21 13:16 ]
Remember... a character who never acts "out of character" is a boring character. We don't really know enough about Andrew to judge what's going on in his head.

It is possible this is a deliberate misdirect, and the writers *want* us to think Andrew is Lash. Writers can be tricksy that way. Good ones, anyway.
I think they definitely intended a mislead but I think they were trying to mislead us into thinking Lash is Rosalind, not Andrew. I seem to recall there was some very deliberate editing suggesting that she is Lash. Daisy said something like maybe it's someone we know, and then they cut to Rosalind pulling back a curtain.

The Andrew theory makes some sense. So much so that now I kinda don't want it to be him because I want to be surprised. But it has to be someone we know, I think... And I'm not sure who would be a better candidate.
Think of the scene where ACTU enters with Rosalind and Coulson and then they fan out to search the building and Rosalind goes stage right. All the sudden there is something behind Mack and Daisy that seems to be Lash. Rosalind couldn't have been there that fast. So not her. I don't think it is Andrew either nor do I think Andrew is dead. No body = not dead.
I don't think it can be Rosalind or Banks. They were both in the subway with Coulson when Lash was smashing up the hospital.
If it's not Andrew, perhaps it's someone we haven't yet met. This could be a further excursion into Inhuman lore.

It could also be someone we have met in a previous season. Or it could be Powers Boothe's character.

[ edited by Nebula1400 on 2015-10-21 21:07 ]
I think it could be that Lash is someone no one knows, but Daisy and Mack are going to suspect it is someone at the ACTU because both already don't trust them and it'll fuel arguments and mistrust on both sides.

And I have to say, although I understand Hunter's mission and for the most part support it (because Ward is totally evil) I am pretty angry at him for going in anyhow, knowing that Andrew was in danger. Bad Hunter, bad!
I love evil Ward.

He's the best! At being the worst. He's so much more fun now.
1) Andrew is not dead, we didn't see a body.
2) If he's not Lash, he's definitely Inhuman.
I don't think Andrew is dead, and I also think it would be weird if he was Lash. I can see where the theory's coming from, but I think the tension between him and May is a lot more interesting if he is who he seems to be .... if he's an evil Inhuman working against Shield, a lot of what's interesting there goes away, IMO.
Holy cow. There's totally a Ben is Glory thing going on here. Totally on board with the Andrew=Lash thing.
if he's an evil Inhuman working against Shield,

I don't think he considers himself evil, and I don't think he considers himself to be working against SHIELD... more like they're working against him, occasionally.

I think Andrew is working with SHIELD now mainly in an attempt to understand the new Inhumans and judge which ones are worthy of survival. In the comics, Lash doesn't kill ALL Inhumans... only those he judges unworthy. I suspect TV Lash is the same.
Which would also play in to why he (Lash, specifically -- not sure if he'll turn out to be Andrew, am 50/50 on that theory) didn't kill Skye -- her power is awesome/great/unique and perhaps he's applying survival-of-the-fittest criteria to how he susses out who lives and who gets a hole in their chest. The guy that was a part of the couple in the condo that Alicia/ginger-ninja visited only had floating as a power, so I can see why an Apocalypse-style villain might deem him unfit to live (although the Inhuman guy's girlfriend seemed to have some sort of energy-shooting powers that looked like they could've been a threat if Lash hadn't killed her so quickly).

I wonder if next week's entire ep will be flashback/Jemma-on-planet, or if we'll get some present day scenes.

And yes, as Daisy suspected and as a few people have mentioned here, I'm also pretty sure that Coulson and Rosalind are gonna bone (not just a kiss -- poor Phil's waited almost two and a quarter seasons for any action and I doubt Amy Acker's gonna be brought back in to the story). Maybe there'll finally be time if they resolve most threats by mid-season (Ward & Lash).

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