Ah that tricky-slippery-bastard Levin, he's probably been browsing Buffy/Angel websites on his computer, almost buried in an office filled with hate mail and threats to cancel their subscription to the WB come 5 weeks time, in his browsing he discovers a cancelled show that Buffy/Angel fans seemed to take a liking to, and figures this might be the show that could stop people cancelling their subscriptions....Prick!

As I've said many a time, living in the UK I can't watch the WB, and I'm glad my downloading of Smallville doesn't give them another viewer, the same will apply to Wonderfalls should the WB pick it up, I advise all you Americans to go to the internet for the guilty pleasure of watching the 1, possibly 2 shows come this fall that are on the WB, yet don't suck! Just have to hope that the ratings from the non-Angel watching people, that keep the WB, are enough to ensure future seasons.

That said, this is 2 bits of promising news, and I hope any potential Angel movie gets such good ratings that they consider bringing it back for a 6th season, same as I'm hoping Serenity could get Firefly back on our screens.

[ edited by Ghost Spike on 2004-04-16 23:49 ]

Ghost Spike | April 17, 01:47 CET

Usually I would say please check the archives and delete the post but there's a lot of people who like to be unspoiled and this is an important piece of info so this can stand for the time being.

Simon | April 17, 01:54 CET

Simon, I always temporarily change my profile so that I can see spoilery links in the archives before I post anything; the way I worded the "more" section might not have made that clear.

keever | April 17, 02:05 CET

Well Wendy should be happy now she was looking for a unspoilery summary.

SN : Can anyone think of the last time a TV show was remade from an old series with the same characters, that has actually succeeded. I'm racking my brain and I cannot think of one, I thought perhaps Battlestar Gallatica except they changed the character sex and that was a movie that is becoming a TV show but no guarentee it will survive past 13 episodes. The other shows I did think of were the Twilight Zone and Outer Limits but they cannot really count cause there cast of characters changed everyweek. So can anyone think of a remade show that did make past a season???

[ edited by RavenU on 2004-04-17 01:51 ]

RavenU | April 17, 03:17 CET

I hear ya Ghost Spike! I was THOROUGHLY planning on never flicking on the WB again in my lifetime after their crap treatment of all things Joss. If they pick up Wonderfalls, I may have to reneg on that. Although, given Levin's idiocy, Wonderfalls will probably only survive as long as it takes to go into syndication so Levin can pocket more money his lame a$$ doesn't deserve...

Downloading is not an option for me - - don't have a fast connection. *Sigh*

cubiclesatan | April 17, 04:13 CET

You don't need a fast connection to download an episode. Just download KaZaA and pick an episode to download and just leave you're computer on all night while your sleeping and while you're away at work or at school. It takes a few days but eventually you'll have a whole episode downloaded. And the best part is that KaZaA automatically saves your downloads so you can puase it to turn your computer off, or if the power goes out everything that you have downloaded will automatically be saved. I do that and so far I have about over ten episodes of Buffy and Angel. Good thing I'm patient, huh?

SpikeBad | April 17, 04:28 CET

I, too, planned on boycotting TheWB once ANGEL ended. There is absolutely nothing else on that channel that I would miss. If they do happen to pick up Wonderfalls, that would be the one exception to the boycott. Otherwise, they have lost me as a viewer forever.

kdeweb | April 17, 04:31 CET

Yes, I do appreciate the link to a non-spoiler version of the news!

Wendy | April 17, 04:42 CET

As do I. I hadn't heard that about Wonderfalls being considered at The WB before. Or that quote from James Marsters.

forcorreo | April 17, 04:51 CET

SpikeBad: I downloaded four seasons of Angel and two of Buffy (only not finding 3 or 4 episodes) last year like that. Took a while, and watching the tiny image is pretty tiresome, but it was worth it.

Cabus | April 17, 05:06 CET

I've downloaded the whole of seasons 5, 6 and 7 from klite. They make pretty good quality VCDs.

redruIvI | April 17, 05:16 CET

Presumably we would hear officially about the Angel TV movies in May? Isn't that when the networks do their announcements for the Fall season.

Oh and speaking of WB episodes online. A glimpse of the future?

Simon | April 17, 05:44 CET

Simon, thanks for the link at WB. Guess Angel doesn't rate as "ground-breaking" in WB's eyes according to their comments (but we already knew that from their lack of strong promotion of it). Guess they wouldn't bother to mention it anyhow since they cancelled it. This is just another reason why I am skeptical about their offer of TV movies. I still worry that this is just a ploy to shut us up. I just have a hard time trusting them at this point.

spikeangellover | April 17, 06:08 CET

Actually I hope TV movies get made and NOT SHOWN ON THE WB. ME is under no contract obligation to show any TV movie or mini-series on the WB. The show is pretty popular on TNT. So if I were JW and ME that is where I would take my TV movie if it gets made.

They slapped JW in the face with Buffy then Angel. So I would stick it back to them and take my TV movie elsewhere.

DarenG | April 17, 08:09 CET

Don't think that TNT would be a better place. Cable means less budget.

And, as Babylon 5 fans know, TNT doesn't have a great track record, either. They cancelled B5: Crusade before it even hit the air ...

jgsugden | April 17, 09:52 CET

In no way am I a sheep. But I gotta be honest- all this campaigning and endless "drives" there are for the show, I LOVE EM, but Im just not the person thats good at running all that kinda stuff. so maybe we should try something new.

The "TV Movies" I too, am extremely sceptical about those bastard suits at WB, giving us any kind of bone. Buffy was one of the first shows on their fledgling little network and since then we have given them eight years and US THE BuffyVerse Fanbase have no doubt helped their tired- ass network become what it is today....which isnt much, oh except for that rare gem know as "Charmed"...ugh

I really hope we can get TV Movies. but we need to know if this is a real potential or just another asshole suit at WB trying to shut us fans up. So like I said, whoever is good at all this campaign ball rolling stuff, maybe we should start looking at this as a "glass half full" and let it be known that we want these movies and we want the truth

Puppet Cancer | April 17, 09:55 CET

So maybe not TNT. Maybe Sci-fi. Point being is that the WB doesn't deserve any TV movies or future projects from ME. Those shows helped build the WB audience and then the WB turned it's back on that very audience.

At least Sci-fi has a history of going balls out for most of its shows. Anything and I mean anything is better then the WB.

DarenG | April 17, 10:00 CET

Lets see... 6 T.V. movies at 2 hours each,thats 12 hours of TV or 12 epis,which is more then half a regular season.Well..??..Then why not just renew it as a series?
I'm not buying it!It's the WB's version of the carrot and the stick.Throw us a bone to keep us quiet.
Plus what are the odds of getting all the actors back at the same time once they move on to other things?...Not very good.

A8 | April 17, 10:39 CET

Lighten up, guys. If WB wants to spend their money making Angel movies, I say great. The cancellation sucks, but we don't have to take it personally.

Son Of Shadow | April 17, 11:17 CET

I welcome the prospect of six angel tv movies, length of 12 episodes of a season, plus with a likely bigger budget, Joss could get some real hammer stories done.

I do think this is general interest by WB, I trust James Marster's opinions, and the save angel campaigns must of effected the decision of tv movies, something they suggested earlier on, but now I think they'll take it seriously.

SeanValen | April 17, 13:54 CET

Ok let's do the math people how many times has Levin said one thing but done another when it comes to Angel. Hmmm, what's that saying about past actions predicting future ones, I think you see where I'm going.
Look I would love to see Angel comeback in any form but right now like at the beginning of this season my pessimistic sences are tingling and reminding me how many times I've heard this movie line before and from Network broadcasters that tract record is usually slim to none with them following the course.
No offence either but you know what I don't buy Kristin's WB sources, since wasn't it a WB source that told her the Monday before the cancelation that they had no intention of cancelling the show, so you know I'll take what she says with a pound of salt at this time. I would feel more hopeful if it was sources from FOX, since they have the rights to the series more than anyone else at the table talking about Angel movies or better yet Angel getting a 6th season straight to DVD market.
Let's remind everyone of a couple of items as well - last year the WB lost 10% of it's revenue (not a good of a health stable network), most of the productions that are staying or coming are from inhouse WB produced which means they can probably work a defered payment deal which makes the shows look cheaper on the books. Angel coming from outside the fold they can't do that too. I doubt if they'll do any tv movie deal outside of the house. The WB is in trouble finanically in a big way and every penny they have is being watched closely, they will not spend the money unless they have too. So don't count on Angel reappearing on the WB after May. As for cable, heck TNT made a profit last year and this year they are making a few new series and a couple of TV movies, so I can see them as a possibility but since they have the same parent that might be a little prickly to do. As for Sci-Fi who knows one week they are singing the poor channel song the next they are buy orignal series episodes and talking about new sci-fi exclusive movies, again they talk from both sides of the same mouth and you never are sure what to believe. I'm just glad the campaigns soften the blow for the cast and crew as James and Amy said it did. I'm glad they know that there are masses of people they never met willing to fight to keep them employed in quality entertainment.

RavenU | April 17, 15:18 CET

I agree with all the scepticism over the motives and honesty of the WB with regard to these tv movies but c'mon guys, this may be the only chance we have to keep the slayerverse alive.

If Joss or anyone involved either at ME or the WB were to read these forums at the moment they would presume that half the fanbase didn't even want the movies to happen. What chance then of Joss, Sarah, David and everyone else going out of their way to arrange their schedules to fit these movies in?

I don't think anyone now really thinks that season six is happening, admit it! So the movies are a hell of a lot better than nothing. We have to make sure that the WB stick to their word and get these movies made or we probably lose the best chance we have of seeing a new weekly show for the 2005/06 season.

Let's stop complaining that we didn't get what we wanted and make the best of what we still could get. If we let this movie thing fall through by a lack of fan interest then the WB get exactly what they wanted. Let both Joss and Levin know that we want this, and soon!!!

The Arcane | April 17, 16:23 CET

Of course we all want the movies, I don't know of anyone who wouldn't support it, but the issue is whether WB is being honest. If the carrot and the stick are there to shut us up and we wait and we wait and we wait for a movie (on their say-so) without making more noise they'll figure we've forgotten about it and conveniently pull the plug (if they ever put the plug in to begin with). Some are thrilled (and so will I be) if six movies actually happen because that's like half a season, but nobody has mentioned the fact that it says two "up to six", which probably means two to the WB which will probably never get made. I hate to be such a pessimist where WB is concerned but I really don't have any reason to believe them now. I just want to reemphasize that we need to still make noise (in a nice way) to insure that something does get done and not suspend our efforts just because they "might" make two to six movies. Until something's definite I say keep pushing all avenues.

spikeangellover | April 17, 18:48 CET

The WB claims the very reason they are canceling the show is due to cost. Doing a TV movie would be expensive. First off between the FX, the cost to bring the actors back, the adverstising they would have to do (especially if people boycott the WB), it won't be cheap.

Now, for one second, let us assume the WB is being honest. Yes, I know, that’s a big leap. IF they could get the cast back together, IF they spent the money on FX, IF the spent enough money on advertising that a TV Movie is coming, What do you think will happen after the ratings results come in for the first TV movie?

Lets face facts, Buffy and Angel are genre TV. Ratings were never through the roof with either show. They just had good results for the targeted demographics. So there are allot of WHAT IF's just to get a TV movie made. If it happens the WB has to spend allot of money to make it happen. There won't be a big return in revenue. So even IF you believe they can over come everything to make one TV movie there won't be a second.

Word is JW would rather do a spin-off after Firefly. I think that is the most realistic scenario. Like I said before, if by some miracle they can get a TV movie made, why bother with the WB.

DarenG | April 17, 18:51 CET

arguing? is that what u think is going on?

we're hashing out where we stand. something is better than nothing, we all know that.

movies would be better than another season. let another quarter turn for the wb and they could be in a diff financial spot.

and if anyone at the network cares a dam for any of our prattle, it's likely they've noticed the outcry at the dark-shadows carrot...

that series returning to air would b enough to make me a download only viewer, just to avoid the insipid commericals pushing DS...

there is very little likelihood that the suit who thinks dark shadows is a more profitable investment than angel is gonna like wonderfalls very much.

but it is my most sincere hope that we get both...angel/buffyverse movies, 2 or 3 at the LEAST...and the full run of wonderfalls from the beginning come fall, with another 10 new ones to round out a full first season run.

juan_good_day | April 17, 18:56 CET

WB, FOX, UPN? I don't care as long as I get to watch. Is TheWB being sort of shifty about the whole thing, sure. but they also brought me 10 years of 'Whedonesque' programming. The UPN only had two. FOX had 1/2 a season and was much much worse to fans and ME. If one wants to quibble about which network is worse I say FOX.

I watch good tv. If it's on theWB so be it. If I get to see Wonderfalls viewer-ship again, I'd be delighted, whoever brings it back deserves my viewer-ship. Even without Angel, TheWB shows more things I watch on regular basis than any other network. Of course without Angel I won't watch as much.

Let the market decide. Sure too often 'show business politics' get in the way, and crappy ratings system doesn't help, but don't complain about theWB wanting to make what they believe are sound business decisions. Write a letter or a postcard and show them they are wrong, that Angel is worth it's big budget, and Wonderfalls would also be worth it.

ascii_102_117 | April 17, 19:01 CET

I don't think we'll see a Buffy movie for quite some time. There are a lot of "IFs" as DarenG pointed out. One big IF is that Sarah Michelle Gellar would do a Buffy movie so soon after the end of the series. I think she wants to build her movie career and leave her Buffy character for awhile. This may also be the case for David Boreanaz after Angel concludes.

I am DEVASTATED by the end of the buffyverse. But, a spinoff would be really exciting when and if it happened. I read some really brilliant thoughts on spinoff ideas on this website. My hope is to see that develop!

Also, I'd be thrilled to see a full run of Wonderfalls as well... fingers are crossed! There has a got be a niche somewhere for genre TV and a way for it to make enough money to support the bottom line that the networks need. I just don't know what it is yet!

fate's bitch | April 17, 19:07 CET

TNT has a history of making TV movies of series that they air in syndication, ie. "Babylon 5" and "The Pretender."

Since TNT shows "Angel" in syndication, it would make sense (to me, at least) that they do any TV movie(s).

barbara | April 17, 19:36 CET

I just want to mention that Wonderfalls is back up for voting at TVShowsOnDVD.com. Here are the current stats:

Unreleased Rank: 16th
Overall Rank: 25th
Season Set: 1517 (100%)
Best of: 357 (23%)
Individual Episodes: 406 (27%)
Total Number of Voters: 1520

Click here to vote.


Also, good point barbara. I think "The Pretender" was produced by Twentieth Century Fox, too.

Invisible Green | April 17, 21:23 CET

Fingers Crossed for Wonderfalls! Cool about Angel/Buffy or whatever it will turn out to be! :)

JamieCOTC | April 18, 00:46 CET

Agreed. TNT has a track record for TV movies for other canceled shows. Come on ME and TNT.

I just hope the fans don't have to wait for too long after Angel is done.

DarenG | April 18, 02:09 CET