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"grr... argh"
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September 21 2004

Wednesday is minus Angel but adds 2 series with Verse connections. Not only is David Fury's Lost with Daniel Dae Kim (Gavin) premiering at 8pm ET but over on NBC Eric Balfour (Jessie) stars in the new series "Hawaii" also on at 8pm.

Watch Lost! Its a great show, I just watched the pilot yesterday. I love it. I was cautious when watching it because it has so much positive hype around it, but the critics weren't wrong!
I'm watching Lost tomorrow. I'm excited. I think this will be my new show. I'm so happy right now because I found out I DON'T work tomorrow and I can stay home and watch it.
I don't think I've read any good reviews about "Hawaii". And if people want to discuss tonight's Lost in this thread, do feel free :). Though I did feel a tinge of unease when I read that ABC had split the two hour pilot over two weeks.
Yeah Simon, but they're also re-airing the pilot on Saturday, October 2nd as a "2 hour special event". Me thinks ABC has alot of faith in this show(at least more than WB had in Angel...grr.)
ABC's airing the Lost premiere in its 2-hour entirety on Saturday, October 2nd for those who miss the Wednesday split airings. That means it airs before the third hour of the show the following Wednesday, so people can catch up. ABC believes in this thing. It's pretty cool to see a new show treated this well by a network.
Ah no wonder they're showing it twice. The genre audience most likely will not be watching ABC as Smallville is on at the same time tonight.
I consider myself part of the genre audience and I will be watching Lost instead of Smallville.
Yup. I even marked it on my kitchen calendar! I'm "Lost" tonight.
Yeah, forget Smallville. I watched it a bit and generally enjoyed it during its first season, but it went downhill after that. Last year, i only occasionally flipped over to it as i was waiting for Angel to come on, and was SO fed up with all the Clark/Lana angsty scenes.
As for Lost, I can't wait. I haven't read a single negative thing about it yet. EW's TV critic, even after admitting he's most decidedly NOT a genre person, gave it an A and called it one of only two shows he's genuinely excited about this year. I like what J.J.Abrams can do, and i'm even more excited knowing that there's a stable of good Angel writers helping him out.
Simon - Maxim magazine gave "Hawaii" a good review. Of course, they also love UPN sitcoms. You don't read Maxim for respectable TV opinions.
I see Dominic Monaghan is also acting in Lost. Is he the Hobbit who directed "Souless" or was that another Hobbit? :-)
I'm mad and I'm happy... We're supposed to be gettin brand spankin new Angel tongiht and we would be if the damned WB hadn't cancelled it. On the other hand I'm ecstatic about Lost, can't wait to watch it tonight. Oh yeah, by the way did anyone know that the WB has put some show called The Mountain in Angel's timeslot. This show looks like total crap. Now this is one show I hope the WB does cancel :) Everybody watch Lost!!!
Dominic Monaghan did not direct Souless. Sean Astin or something did he was the hobbit named Sam who was with Frodo the whole movie. Dominic Monagahn was either Pippin or Merry I can't seem to remember which. Sorry.
Thanks. I'm afraid I'm just another Whedonsque-r looking for Buffyverse connections wherever possible.
Dominic M was Merry, the English hobbit. (Billy Boyd was Pippin, the Scottish one. Who knew hobbits were so regionally diverse?) And as ShotgunWes said, it was Sam (Sean Astin) who directed "Souless". And did a bang-up job, IMO.
WWBD are you trying to start Six degrees of Whedon :) - a much better game then Six degrees of Kevin Bacon.
I just watched Lost. Didn't realize they'd be airing the entire pilot on Saturday so a bit annoyed about that because I would've enjoyed seeing it all at once. That said, on to my thoughts. I really enjoyed it and that hour flew by. The couple of things that made me jump were a little predictable yet I still gasped and jumped out of my skin. The scenes for next week look even more intriguing and I can't wait to find out what happens next.

I usually watch Smallville but last season was kind of dull but the finale was good and the promo's look good for this season. No sign of Lana, thank God! My daughter watched that and taped it for me to watch later and I watched Lost and taped it for her to watch. I think after she see's it, we'll both be watching Lost every week and taping Smallville.
wow that was intense, and I found it very disconcerting and a bit frightening (and I'm hard to frighten.) My father decided to catch it with me, and I think it tramautized him (he fears plane crashes, had a fear when in the ari about landing in the jungle (the jungle book scares him) now I feel guilty about not warning him strongly :( )

Great show though, interesting characters (the musician seems to be a druggie anyone else agree. And even without the next week on hint, there has to be someone here, I mean the dog.)

So far it feels like Cast Away, Jurrasic parc, and 28 days later all mixed into one show.
It was definitely intense and I thought the same thing about the musician. I hope the dog isn't evil because I love dogs!
I really enjoyed Lost. I'm already sucked into the mystery of it....less over what that big scary thing is that eats people and more over the shuddery overall feeling I have that this is part of someone's or something's larger Grand Plan. It ain't no accident that this plane crashed on this island with these people.

I get the sense that these people are tied to each other in some way that they don't realize now. I think it was significant that the female lead asked Mr. Merry Hobbit Musician if they had met somewhere. Sure, it was explained that he is some big musician but I don't know. I think that was meant to be a hint of some kind. Definitely the Merry Hobbit musician was picking up his secret drug stash in the plane's bathroom. That was my impression, anyway. And did anyone think that John (the main character/Mr. Cute Doctor) was acting a little funny when the female lead (forgot her name) and Mr. Merry Musician found him after they had been separated briefly by the Big Scary No-See-'Em Beast?

To me it also feels like Cast Away/Jurassic Park/28 Days Later as well as very, very Island of Dr. Moreau'ish. With a dash also of Apocalypse Now. And maybe just the tiniest dollop of The Prisoner (the feeling I have that these people are here by design and that they are being tested in some way and that this Jungle Island is in some way a mirage or false reality or at least not what it appears to be).

Cool stuff. I'll definitely be watching next week. Whoops, better not tell anyone or it'll get canceled.
My only complaint, within the next 4 eps, they need to slow down and focus a little more on the characters and building a life here. Cause for an intro, the exploration and monster was great, but if the show just became RUN FROM THE INVISIBLE MONSTER every week, with the cast slowly dying, I'll get bored.

Still all the pieces are in place, there are a ton of plot threads to contemplate, can't wait for the second half of the pilot.

Ton of mystery, lots of style, but I can't help thinking that it's a bit too odd or intense for the general public, PLEASE DONT CANCEL IT.

I know on IMDB etc, although the critics are praising it, a lot of people think that the supernaturalishness is dumb.

Which is too bad, since it's all part of the tapestry that's being painted here.
After bingeing on Angel the last few weeks It's a little bit shocking to watch a show with a big network budget. Don't get me wrong, angel's a beautiful show to look at, But at times there limited budget shows, whether it's a special effect, or a set Or whatever. But when you work for ABC you get big ass explosions and full size plane wrecks, It looked like a movie to me. ( That said Firefly is still the most beautiful looking T.V. Show I've ever seen, If you paused parts of that show it was like looking at a painting. Whedon can direct circles around Abrams.) The show was good, maybe a little predictable at times but still spooked me once in awhile and kept me entertained. That David Fury sure can land great jobs. I'll be tuning in next week and you have to give ABC props for not only making something like this but also promoting the hell ot of it. But after watching some of there commercials I can see that they don't have much else to be proud of, just my opinion.

[ edited by adventures in spelling on 2004-09-23 05:06 ]
"I can't help thinking that it's a bit too odd or intense for the general public.."

Oy, rabid, I agree. I love the oddness and intensity. Ack. I do think the characters will be fleshed out. I say that as someone who's not an Alias fan or a J.J. Abrams fan. Despite my non-fan'ishness towards Mr. Abrams, I recognize his abilities and I think he understands that rich characters and backstory are key.
I am positive they will be fleshed out, I'm not saying I don't expect them to be, just that for the show to work for me that's the kinds of things I would like to see.

With a cast that size you always have the possibility that the characters will become charicatures, he's the durggy ex-rocker, he and she are the people who can't talk English, she's the pregnant woman, and she is the one who can't accept the situation.

I for instance loved the scene where the main character discusses how he faces his fear, and his story about that.
Well, just watched Lost. Not sure it grabbed me. Hubby and I decided to give it another epi chance, but I get too much of a Jurassic Park feeling with it. And some of the writing was predictable. I knew the pilot would get yanked out. I knew the gal would count to 5 when she got scared. The long glances between Jack and Kate....I'm already dreading that budding romance.
And I guess I didn't get the 'imminent danger' feeling of when Charlie fell in the mud when we(nor he) never see what they're running from. I know, part of the mystery. But really, you can't do a "Hurry, I have to get out, it's right behind me" very convincingly without actually knowing your proximity to the chaser. Just a few quick flashes to the woods and urgent music won't do it. I need more to be concerned. BTW, the music was a bit overdone as a whole. I tend to like less synthetic sounds in settings like this. The trees shaking and the big thumping isn't enough? We have to have music to tell us to be scared?

Also, I didn't like the camera work. Too unsteady and jiggly. I know it's supposed to give more of a 'there' feeling, but it's just hard to follow the action sometimes.

I don't know. Nothing I saw intrigued me greatly. A dog. Some handcuffs. Weird rain. But like I said, I'll give it another shot. Nothing else to watch on Wednesdays anymore.

Joss...why have you forsaken us???
I think I've seen too many episodes of Survivor. When it started raining (all of a sudden!), all I could think about was that I hoped someone was collecting that rainwater to drink later. Also asking myself why weren't they tilting their heads back and drinking? They had just come through this big hike!

It's already giving me a huge "Lord of the Flies" vibe. And why was Gavin so controlling with that woman? Being protective? Or something more ominous?

And what Hobbit Merry Possible Druggy said about the weather and day turning into night so quickly? Methinks it wasn't a throwaway line.

I hope it's not something Jules Verne-y like a big underground control center. And yeah, they need to show us the mutant elephant or whatever the hell that thing is pretty quick or I'm just going to get annoyed with it.

Still, am looking forward to next week! OhpleaseOhplease don't be disappointing!
Wow. This show knocked my socks off. I'm very impressed. It felt too real, like I was right there in it. The characters are interesting and the acting is wonderful. I also think Charlie is a druggie. That was expected but other things like the guy being pulled into the engine and the pilot being eaten (and later strung up in the trees) was not. I like the dialogue, especially when you can't quite understand everything they're saying. I know that's frustrating but it's realistic and speaking realistically (mumbling, stumbling over words, not finishing sentences) is something I like to see in TV shows, but sparingly. I still want to know, what was Kate saying when she was crying in the forest? That was completely unintelligable.

Great show! I'll be a loyal fan this season. Oh, and who wants to place bets on how long before Jack and Kate hook up? I'm going for midseason. Unless they surprise us.

EDIT: Oh, Kate was counting to five? Mmmkay. Couldn't understand her at all.
I watched 'Lost' while the mister was out teaching his watercolor class and thoroughly enjoyed it. I'll agree that while many of the scares were telegraphed miles ahead of time, I still found myself starting to care for some of the characters. The old, balding and strangely silent man was intriguing to me -- whether he was sitting on the beach, ecstatically soaking up the rain (which I sense has some connection to whatever else is inhabiting the island's interior), or giving Kate his weird orange-rind smile when she looked up at him after laying claim to the dead man's boots, he seemed quite at peace with the whole affair, somehow unmoved and unbothered by it all. I feel sure he's tied in with why the plane came down on the island in the first place... The whole show is beautiful to look at, well acted so far, and I'm curious to see how long, or if, they can maintain both the mystery and the intense pacing.

Did anyone else think that the guy getting sucked into the plane engine was a sly little nod to Firefly? That was one surprise I wasn't ready for, and when the engine actually blew, I was like 'wow, they took the coolest little moment in 'The Train Job' and jacked it up another notch!'
I actually hope we DONT see the monster for the rest of the season, the show should be about the characters and the drama of their situation, not the creature in the woods.

And I am 100% behind the camerawork, very 28 days later style, I love the you are there feeling to it.

[ edited by rabid on 2004-09-23 07:22 ]
I thought the little boy was asking about the dog when he was talking to his dad.
Ha! Wiseblood I was right there in the moment! As soon as I saw that guy heading over there I was like "Watch ou- oh, too late!" I KNEW he was gonna get sucked in. But if I'd never seen TTJ, I never would have been so cautious about it. Or picked up on it that way.

Looks like somebody "took the sky from them!"

I agree, rabid. Let the mystery be.

I also think Charley is a drug addict, but ('Cause why else go into the bathroom of a wrecked plane? Unless he was taking the last roll of t.p....) I guess I'll have to be more careful from now on if I want to do my part to stay in the dark.
and what about that guy running from the stewardess' on the plane, that's got to be important.
All together now: "Hmmmmmmmm..." ;)

"Standard issue black." Eww. And yet funny. Good job, J.J. and David Fury. I hope fortune smiles so this plane can, uh ... keep it up in the ... umm. Okay, bad analogy. How about, "I hope ABC doesn't stomp Lost as flat as the muddy ground underneath the pilot-tree"?

*Sigh* And yet, it's not Whedon -- but I suppose for now it will just have to do.

[ edited by Wiseblood on 2004-09-23 08:53 ]
Well in all honesty I can't make a call yet. One episode is not enough for me to judge a show. And yes it should have been the full pilot. Doesn't anyone do those anymore? Ya know? 2 hours?

I wish I could be as impressed as most of you, (I was really really wishing to be lovin' this since I'd love to have a new show to go nuts over) but it was all a just a bit on the bland side to me. The doctor was a bit too much of a 'look at the wholesome handsome hero' type which I never really care for much. I just tend to like ambivalent characters more than the boy scouts with the chiseled jaws. I am intrigued about the old guy who doesn't speak and Mohanagan was likeable and funny, but the rest felt a bit like the standard disaster film stereotypes. (the hero type who instantly leads, the obligatory pregnant lady, the annoying whiner/complainer, the scary looking guy who might blow any second, etc.) But then it was only one ep, I said, can't really make a fair judgement yet. I hope they deliberatedly start with the stereotypes, only to go into new directions then.

As for the mystery, about who they are and that maybe they were supposed to be there, well it wasn't there yet. I've read about it, but I didn't see a thing of that. There was only the invisible beasties that kinda made me fear it would turn into a cheaper TV version of Jurassic Park. I kept expecting a CGI T-Rex would come running. I know that's probably not what they'll do, but not seeing a thing for an entire season as some suggest is not what I'm hoping either. Don't want to watch people sit on the beach, talk about their feelings and look scared at moving trees for 22 episodes!

As for the camera work, it was solid overall, but a bit heavy on the 'shaky' side. If that's done too much, I don't feel I'm there so much as I just can't see what's going on anymore.

I'm sorry, I feel like an annoying 'nayasayer' and I hate it. I really wanted to like it, and I don't DISlike it, but it didn't really hook me yet. If I forget what I read and just sum up what I saw then it's basically: Bunch of people crashed on an island and there's some big beasties in the forest. That's pretty much all I saw so far and it didn't blow me away. I'll definitely keep watching though, since I have a feeling they'll start going in surprising directions and not just do a 'scripted Survivor'.
Wiseblood and Willowy, I too was thinking of "The Train Job" when the person got sucked in. I'm not sure what to think of it so far. It's intriguing enough for me to stick with it for a bit. The shaky camera work, the production value, I wish Firefly was still on. I'm pretty much done with TV. I've been Netflixing and my cable company is getting my pink slip next month.
I enjoyed the episode, anticipate watching it again ('cause there's little else to watch on Wednesdays anymore), but I also thought there was a little too much Jurassic Park shaking of trees and predictability. The first time I saw the turbine running, I thought 'who's goin' to get sucked in' -- so it was like watching the original Star Trek the first time around (yes, I am old enough to remember) -- which of the extras is REALLY an extra and going to die? I wasn't as troubled by the music and the shaky-cam as some of you, and wasn't sure if the Merry Hobbit musician was a druggie, or whether he had something to do with the plane crash. Wondered when the pregnant woman fell so hard dodging the falling wing whether that was it for the baby (but did anyone else have flashbacks to pregnant Darla when they first saw the pregnant woman in profile?). I'm sorry they divided the pilot in two, because I think it would have been stronger and would have pulled more viewers in. But, hey, a two-hour reality show ep (isn't that what I saw advertised to follow? I switched channels) is so much more important (yech) than a show that is trying to be innovative, even if it must have some predictable elements to pull in the masses.
I had already seen the two-part pilot a few months ago but seeing it again on TV was still enjoyable. Let me first assure everyone that next week will be A LOT better. You get to meet more of the characters and many move out of their stereotypes. Don't want to say too much so I'll stop there, but let me just add that many people involved with the show have assured viewers the series wont just be characters running away from invisible monsters every week. It is indeed about the characters and how they deal with the situation (expect a few flashbacks).

Still somewhat miffed that they're splitting up the pilot episodes but at least they're showing them back-to-back on October 2nd. Ah well.

With the Buffyverse gone, Lost is my last hope for some quality TV this year. Don't screw it up ABC.
I'm still boycotting the Wb, so it was nice to see 'Veronica Mars' and 'Lost'. I didn't expect 'Lost' be as good as it was. I do agree it seems to have a little 'Jurassic Park' feel, but it was really good. I'm hooked! Of course, if anything Joss comes along, that's different!
The first part had a little too much of a Jurassic Park feel to it, but if they go towards character development I think it should be all right. I wasn’t as dazzled as I hoped to be but it held my interest for the full hour and I want to know what happens to these people. I loved how Jack emerged from the gorgeous bamboo forest into the horror of the plane wreckage. Very dreamlike.
Just a tiny bit of nit-picking: Would the engine the man was sucked into still have been running? It creates tension and foreshadowing, I know. Also, why show there’s something big enough to stomp on trees right away? It’s more suspenseful just to hint that something is out there and then be shocked at what it did to the pilot. Being squeamish, I appreciate that bloody, horrible things were dealt with more naturally or left to the imagination rather than used as a gross out factor. I am cautiously optimistic.

“I hope the dog isn't evil because I love dogs!”--blwessels

Don’t hurt the dog, either! Hmmm….maybe it’s not really a dog…
I was fairly impressed with Lost as well. Although there were a few Whedon rips (pilot "coming alive" like Wood in Chosen, then getting pulled thru the window like the parent with Snyder in School Hard), but overall a very entertaining start. I agree with the Prisoner vibe, that they were "brought" to the island for some reason. And since I'm not assuming the dog was on the plane, then he has to have some human master on the island, ie. Dr. Moreau.

Also think Hobbitboy is on drugs, but I think it's medical. There was a scene early where he's just walking around and his hand is shaking in a very palsy like way. I couldn't understand Kate either when she was apparently counting. What I swore I made out was "Chewie" and "the force". Thought she was having some kind of Lucas breakdown.

The camera work did start to get on my nerves when they were climbing up to the cockpit, but overall it was okay. I do hope they give this a chance to develop before they pull the plug. It would be nice to have something to watch with some quality.
Although there were a few Whedon rips (pilot "coming alive" like Wood in Chosen, then getting pulled thru the window like the parent with Snyder in School Hard)...

Those are pretty basic dramatic cliches. Whedon didn't invent them.
For some reason I think that the dog belonged to the father and son. I didn't catch their names but the father also played Link in the the last two Matrix movies. When the mystery monster first made it's presence known the little boy shot up said something to his father and he replied, "I don't think that's Roscoe(?).." I don't know I could be wrong.

I am also in agreement with Charlie being a druggie. He was the one that the flight attendants were chasing down the aisle just before the crash. He seemed really out of it when the beach was in chaos some part of the plane crashed right next to him and he didn't even seem to take notice.

Also, the older, quiet guy? I can't wait to find out more about him. I wonder if he talks at all. The scene when he is giving the orange wedge smile to Kate at first seemed sort of sweet but her reaction to him made the whole thing really creepy.

I loved it, can't wait for next week.
I thought the pilot looked more crushed than eaten. He was all bloody but I didn't see parts missing. Did I miss something?
I understood Kate counting to ten, but only because i was just waiting for her to start. You could see that coming a mile away. Other than every "surprise" - the guy getting sucked into the fuselage, the captain getting pulled out by the creature, Kate counting to five - being incredibly predictable, I enjoyed the show. I didn't love it, but i feel like i'd need to see more episodes to really fall in love with it. For me, the key to any show is characters and dialogue, so while i appreciated the big-budget, creepy feel, this was all a bit too much intro and scene-setting, without enough character development, to really grab me yet. I've never felt like J.J. Abrams writes dialogue as well as Joss, and he tends to have more predictable plots, but I am confident he knows that the value of any show lies in character interaction and emotions, not the big action scenes or plot twists.
So, while i agree with everyone that this first installment felt very jurassic park-like - and i hated jurassic park - i'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt that we'll start seeing more character development soon.
As for whether this can be sustained as a TV show... I can easily see finding enough material for one, even two seasons. The sheer number of characters, and the many twists/mysteries that i'm sure the writers have in store, can sustain a lot of arcs. I don't know if it can go much beyond that, though. Interestingly, that's one of the main problems i've had with Alias, too. The first and second season were great, but i felt like it had sort of played itself out after that. Once it lost the double agent setting, and Sid's friends who didn't know who she was, it lost a lot of what kept it interesting and grounded. I wonder if this will be similar - once the big, underlying mystery of what the island is and why they've all been brought there begins to take shape and be answered, will there still be reason to continue it? Call it the Twin Peaks conundrum - shows with great, but not particularly sustainable, premises...
I wa so deeply dissapointed in ABC from the very first shot. It was obvious that the thing had been shot in widescreen, and even though it was the pilot episode, the one that's really supposed to draw people in, they didn't even bother to broadcast it that way... At least not where I am (???).

Other than that, nothing I thought hasn't already been said; Jurrasic Park, Prisoner, etc.

And Rogue Slayer, right there with you on dreading the romance. No something I want the show to be focused on.

I think the show is broadcasted in wide-screen in HDTV, just like Alias is.

[ edited by eddy on 2004-09-24 05:03 ]

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