Okay, I'm afraid to even scan it but someone who does read it, could you fill us in on what this person thought?

Firefly Flanatic | December 17, 09:33 CET

Now that's the kind of review (as he says, from a MOVIE fan who hasn't seen any of Joss' work at all) that makes my heart sing. This movie really is mighty! The more I hear the more I start to believe this movie is going to get the recognition it deserves, will be well promoted and distributed etc etc etc.

In case you can't tell he loved it!

[ edited by catalyst2 on 2004-12-17 07:38 ]

[ edited by catalyst2 on 2004-12-17 07:38 ]

catalyst2 | December 17, 09:37 CET

It's not all that spoilerish (although I guess if you want to hear NOTHING than stay away.)

He said the movie might in fact be as good or better than Star Wars, that he loved the characters, the story, the villains. He thought it was fantastic basicly :).

Only complaint was that Mal was a bit too much like Han Solo.

rabid | December 17, 09:39 CET

Catalyst2, does the article have spoilers in it? And if it does could you just quote some of the positive stuff he said without giving anything away?

Firefly Flanatic | December 17, 09:39 CET

Thanks Rabid! Hmmm, I adored Hans Solo and the fact that Harrison Ford became a huge star hopefully means big things for Nathan Fillion if others see the same characteristics.

Firefly Flanatic | December 17, 09:41 CET

blwessels - Honestly not that spoilerish to be honest, not anything I haven't seen but then I am an utter spoiler slut so......

He loved River, loved the villain and the villain's backstory, the character driven plot etc. Compared it to Star wars this way - and this sums up the tone of the whole article really (sorry for the long quote):

I can’t and won’t say that Serenity was better than Star Wars, because they are way too different for me to compare them. But let me put it this way: All my life I’ve envied most adults for having had the experience of watching Star Wars in the theater before it was big. To have had that moment of “Oh my god, this is f**king amazing. Oh my god, this is gonna be huge!” Well, frankly I was jealous - until now. I now feel like I’ve had that kind of experience, and I’ll be able to tell my children that I was at the first public screening (after which they will shoot me confused expressions and whisper “daddy’s a geek” to each other).

catalyst2 | December 17, 09:53 CET

I don't think it is that spoliery - the closest it comes to that is talking about battle scenes as scenes (which you would expect anyway I would think) nothing given away as far as actual plot so I think it's safe for you to read it blwessels.

I hope Joss reads this person's perspectative take on the film and takes his suggestion to the marketing woman to heart and to her. As far as I'm concerned Joss has never made anything that wasn't character driven, with effects being the nice aside to it. If it was effects driven it wouldn't be Joss, cause if anything he has always been about the interaction of the dialouge of the characters not how well they looked in a fight.

RavenU | December 17, 09:58 CET

Wow, thanks Catalyst2. That's a great quote and I hope Joss comes back and reads that because he was a wee bit concerned that most of the audience was already fans and I think hearing that comment from a non fan will make his day.

But, again, wow! I'm thrilled that the guy was so blown away with it! If a non fan feels that way, are some of us going to be passing out with joy when we finally get to see it?!!

Firefly Flanatic | December 17, 09:58 CET

blwessels - I think it will be in ecstasy not just joy!

catalyst2 | December 17, 10:00 CET

Can't wait! I'll bring my smelling salts!

Firefly Flanatic | December 17, 10:02 CET

Okay, RavenU, because of your assurances, I was brave and read the review and I don't feel it was spoilerish at all and what was said could be said describing most episodes of the series, so I'm glad I took your advice and read that review because if that is how the average fan feels this movie is going to be more than huge! That guy is definitely the targeted audience (outside us already smug, knowledgeable fans that is) and if he feels it was as great as it is I can't wait for the stampede to the movie theater come September 30!

Edited to add: It just registered in my head that he said he'd already posted his review on another site!! I hope it was a Star Wars fan site (and he may have said that but I need some sleep). The brush fire is already starting and not a rain cloud in sight!!!

[ edited by blwessels on 2004-12-17 08:36 ]

Firefly Flanatic | December 17, 10:33 CET

I'm sitting here smiling, when suddenly I realise, it's about 9 months away :(.

I was ok with waiting a long time when it was announced for April, but now with the delay followed by such enthusiastic test-screenings...

Gotta find something to occupy myself, I think I might rewatch Angel season 4 (not my favorite year, but I have this great desire to rewatch it)

Ugh I feel odd, almost like I'm trying to fill up the spare time of my life so that the wait for a movie seems shorter... I don't think that's healthy lol.

rabid | December 17, 10:55 CET

Shiny. This is very encouraging (not that I've read the review being a big spoilerphobe, but all the comments make it sound extremely positive which makes my heart sing)

I'm sitting here smiling, when suddenly I realise, it's about 9 months away :(.

Totally with you on that one rabid.

EDIT: I also cracked and have now read the article and it's even better than I thought. Excellent.

[ edited by Paul_Rocks on 2004-12-17 09:54 ]

Paul_Rocks | December 17, 11:47 CET

It's pretty cool, but because I'm a worrier, one thing jumped out at me: I hope the focus group doesn't have any real impact on changing the huge shocking thing that's supposed to happen. I mean, not spoiled here, but I like it when Joss does something that makes you hate him because he's evil and he took your breath away -- Buffy killing Angel, Wesley's death, etc. I'm really curious as to what this shocking/OMIGOD--NOOOOO! moment in the movie is, but I'm remaining unspoiled so's I could see it in the theater. I like unpleasant shocks to my system.

On the other hand, it just occured to me, but Joss has got mad props for taking a failed movie and turning it into a relatively successful but massively influential TV show. How much would he rock if he took a short-lived TV series and made it into a freakishly beloved science fiction movie phenomenon? He would seriously rock.

dottikin | December 17, 12:06 CET

That's amazing! This person has never viewed Angel, BtVS, or Firefly. Yet, in watching this movie, he picked up the fact that it's character driven and he loved it. Yep, that's our man Joss winning over another fan. I'm going to be on pins and needles waiting for this movie.

Madhatter | December 17, 13:33 CET

Wow! Ive been left smiling after that review! Also Catalyst2 in response to a question you aked in a previous post but that i was too slow and missed, im in Brisbane at the moment, but will be travelling to Sydney tommorow, and then Adelaide in a few days.

Apocalypse | December 17, 13:38 CET

I couldn't read it all so I wouldn't be to spoiled, so I just read first 2 paragraphs.

I'm so excited about this movie I can't stand it. I can't wait for the previews to start. Anyone know when they will start? Has there been a post? I'll check the archives but if not let me know.

Spikecam21 | December 17, 14:40 CET

For somebody who is not a Buffy/Angel/Firefly fan he now sounds just like one (LOL). It's amazing the effect Joss has on people.

Zoic_Fan | December 17, 14:53 CET

Spikecam21, surely watching the previews will spoil you more than reading, in this case at least a very unspecific review?
They were original meant to start before Electra, so next month, but that was before the Serenity release date was put back so I'm assuming we'll have to wait a bit longer now....

EDIT to make it clear I was answering Spikecam21

[ edited by Paul_Rocks on 2004-12-17 12:54 ]

Paul_Rocks | December 17, 14:53 CET

I know they (trailers) might spoil me a little but I'm just so excited. I really want to see the look of the movie. I still don't have a clear picture in my head as to what it looks like.

Spikecam21 | December 17, 15:00 CET

He's a Star Wars fan, and remained one after those two horrible prequels. That doesn't fill me with confidence.

Quit | December 17, 15:34 CET

Ignoring views on whether the Star Wars prequels are good or not (I don't mind them, though don't think they're a patch on the originals), surely the people who like them are exactly the kind of people we want to become big Serenity fans, since they're likely to go back again and again and give us huge box office.

Paul_Rocks | December 17, 15:46 CET

I suppose I should clarify. He is not your typical Star Wars fan. He calls himself "Frosty Skywalker", and is described as "as big a “Star Wars” booster as you’ll hope to find". He is not your Average Joe.

If people like him go and see it again and again, great. But there aren't that many people like him. The review gives no indication of what the average movie-goer will think of the film. And that's really the most crucial element to Serenity's success.

Quit | December 17, 16:06 CET

Stupendous to read such a great review. Is he an Average Joe? Who exactly is an Average Joe? At least he wasn't a Firefly fan before he saw Serenity and he "got" Serenity. Got it in a big way, apparently.

What the review tells me is that a non-Firefly fan fell in love with the characters in two hours. The cool plot developments and space/action stuff were the icing on the cake. If the characters are great, people - average and non-average Joes and Janes alike - will love the movie. That's assuming it's marketed in the proper way.

phlebotinin | December 17, 17:56 CET

I dunno, I think this bodes well for "average viewers." True, he's a guy with a particular interest in sci-fi movies - Star Wars, Matrix - but those are films whose appeal started in the sci-fi/geek community and spread by word of mouth to "average joes." When the geek community gets behind a film 110% (The Matrix, LOTR) the rest of the country follows. When the geek community shrugs and nods (Sky Captain) the film disappears. Reviews like this make me more and more hopeful for big box office bank.

wren | December 17, 18:07 CET

Is he an Average Joe? Who exactly is an Average Joe? At least he wasn't a Firefly fan before he saw Serenity and he "got" Serenity.

Yeah, I figured that fact was enough to give him the "average" label.

I don't think the fact that he (Is it a "he"? If not, my apologies) seems big into the sci-fi detracts from his representation of the mainstream too much. Because I'd imagine that the main audience the film will want to target, at least initially, will be people who would actually pay to see a sci-fi movie. Just as you wouldn't spend too much time selling a romantic-comedy to horror fans...first, you target the audience that is most going to make the film seem like A Hit. And then advertise as such.

Or not. It's not like I really know.

VampiresSuckLOLOLGetIt | December 17, 20:13 CET

No one should be afraid to read this review. It won't spoil you at all. It's so gratifying to read that a person who knew nothing of "Firefly" loved this as much as we did.

kdavid323 | December 17, 20:15 CET

I think this guy is the perfect "average Joe" that the studio wants to target. He represents the people who go out and watch movies on a regular basis. He also will talk about a movie he likes and get others to want to see it which is the buzz they are hoping to generate. They already know they can count on Joss Whedon fans to turn out but here's someone who wasn't a fan who was blown away by the movie and is posting his thoughts on it in message boards and review sites. That's free wonderful advertising and he's promoting the film to others who think like him.

Firefly Flanatic | December 17, 20:20 CET

RE: "Average Joe-ness"

This guy may not be a wallpaper hanger from Sheboygan or a chartered accountant from Pittsburgh, but he's a member of a core audience (sci-fi geek) who must "get" this movie if it's going to succeed at the box office. Browncoats and Whedon geeks alone won't do it. If the general sci-fi audience embraces Serenity, then it has a chance to generate industry buzz, and once that happens, the REAL Average Joes--the people who usually have little interest in science fiction--will be drawn in. And if THAT happens, fellow Whedonequers, Joss might have another phenomenon on his hands.

cjl | December 17, 20:31 CET

More on "Average Joe-ness:"

I agree that this reviewer is the perfect Average Joe for the core sci-fi audience that Universal probably wants to target. (Hence the applicability of VampiresSuckLOLGetIt's post headline.) That the reviewer's into Star Wars doesn't matter a whit to me. He's a sci-fi (and movie) fan who hadn't seen Firefly and loved Serenity anyway. This bodes extremely well for Serenity's box office, in my opinion.

I can't wait for this film to come out. I also can't wait for the DVD to come out so I can watch it anytime I wish and delve obsessively into its Whedony depths o' brilliance. That I will love Serenity is as certain as death and taxes.

phlebotinin | December 17, 20:48 CET

As kdavid323 says, this review really doesn't contain spoilers, although affixing a warning can't hurt. Fortunately, we had RavenU, blwessels and paul_rocks pre-screen it for the rest of us spoiler-phobes - hey, I like this system.

Can anyone identify the woman who said the movie was "effects-driven"? I find it hard to believe anyone with the vaguest smattering of knowledge of Joss's work would say such a thing.

SoddingNancyTribe | December 17, 21:02 CET

I am probably Mr Average Joe when it comes to these things, since I have little or no interest in modern sci-fi films (anything from 'Star Wars' onwards) and I have never seen 'Firefly'. Admittedly, largely because of BtVS, I have an interest in the work of Joss Whedon.

I will be going to see 'Serenity' when the film hits the UK. In fact, I have just today ordered the DVD of 'Firefly', inspired to do so by the enthusiasm of many WHEDONesque regulars, and encouraged by their advice to me to stop sitting on the fence and jump right in.

I have no idea how to gage the audience for a film such as this. If the reviews are good that will surely help. However, bad reviews don't necessarily mean a film will not be a box office hit. 'The Grudge' is proof of that. Mind you, it is a much better film than many of the reviews suggest, not that I am in any way biased!

(I am not suggesting, by the way, that 'Serenity' will get bad reviews.)

Oh, and SNT, congratulations!

alien lanes | December 17, 21:08 CET

dashboardprophet, you post on Whedonesque. You are not average. You are better than everyone you know. Joss said so.
I don't know what the desired demographics for a movie like this are, but the reviewer is still in highschool. With disposible income and text messaging. ;-) Sounds pretty ideal to me.

Lioness | December 18, 00:17 CET

Lioness, thank you. And I am proud to call myself a fan of the great man.

alien lanes | December 18, 00:21 CET

Don't thank me, thank Joss. If he says so, it must be true. Except when he is lying to mislead the spoilers.

Lioness | December 18, 01:22 CET

Congrats on your assention SNT, as long as it doesn't come with a need to eat live spiders, bad principles, or anything like that I'm happy for you. :)

RavenU | December 18, 04:59 CET

Yay! I am so happy! Everyone loves it! Joy!

Why is SNT blue?

pezwitch | December 18, 05:14 CET

Hi,
I'm the guy that wrote the "firefly virgin" review that's been spread around. I wanted to respond to a couple of your comments...so here it is:

"He said the movie might in fact be as good or better than Star Wars"

If you read my review, I said that I cannot compare the two...but I certainly have an equal love for them.

"It just registered in my head that he said he'd already posted his review on another site!! I hope it was a Star Wars fan site"

I posted it on firefly fan sites, but didn't even think to post on star wars sites...GOOD IDEA. Unfortunetely, as much of a star wars fan as I am, I don't know of any good message boards on star wars. If you know of any, please feel free to link them to my review.

“He's a Star Wars fan, and remained one after those two horrible prequels. That doesn't fill me with confidence.”

Let me ask you something. If there was a really bad Firefly episode…would you hate the whole series? As bad as the prequals were…it still doesn’t change the fact that the original trilogy was amazing. So I believe I have every right to be a fan of star wars as a whole even though 2 of the 5 movies stunk.

“I suppose I should clarify. He is not your typical Star Wars fan. He calls himself "Frosty Skywalker", and is described as "as big a “Star Wars” booster as you’ll hope to find". He is not your Average Joe.”

The Aintitcool.com staff member “Hercules” posted my review (I’m magicdgk)…Hercules was talking about a friend of HIS named “Frosty Skywalker”, a completely separate person from I. I would also like to point out that as much as I LOVE star wars, I am not an all encompassing sci-fi fan. I do not like Star Trek, nor have I ever watched the sci-fi channel or Farscape. So for me to like Firefly was a big surprise to me.

“Can anyone identify the woman who said the movie was "effects-driven"? I find it hard to believe anyone with the vaguest smattering of knowledge of Joss's work would say such a thing.”

I don’t know her name, but she was the Nielsen rep who ran the focus group afterward.

magicdgk | December 18, 05:14 CET

Thanks Magicdgk - Glad you enjoyed the movie and thank you so much for your wonderful review. I highly recommend you renting or buying the Firefly DVD set and if you like that you may want to check out Buffy and Angel as well.

Firefly Flanatic | December 18, 05:23 CET

magicdgk: Your review was excellent, and thanks for joining this site to follow-up in our discussion!

I agree that the Star Wars prequels do not taint in any way the magic of the originals - I was one of those "original audience members" of which you spoke. My mum gave my brothers and me the day off school and took us to the Dominion Theatre on Tottenham Court Road to see Star Wars in 1977. I was enchanted and transported. I firmly believe that I will be again, in my slightly older incarnation today, upon seeing Serenity. Thanks again!

And for those who are asking: no, no bugs were ingested. At least, not during my recent "ascension" . . . I find Weetabix gives me all the fibre I need. Like Giles, however, I prefer it without blood.

SoddingNancyTribe | December 18, 05:45 CET

"Thanks Magicdgk - Glad you enjoyed the movie and thank you so much for your wonderful review. I highly recommend you renting or buying the Firefly DVD set and if you like that you may want to check out Buffy and Angel as well."

WAY ahead of you...the first thing I did when I got home after the Serenity screening was order the dvd set off Amazon.com So good advice ;)

magicdgk | December 18, 06:10 CET

Okay, just to warn you - you'll most likely hate Fox TV after you see it all - but maybe not since you've seen the movie and won't have that feeling like you only finished half a book and were just getting to the best part!! Welcome to the Flan Club!!

Firefly Flanatic | December 18, 06:15 CET

Why are we calling ourselves "flans"? I've been seeing people use it all week but don't know why.

eddy | December 18, 06:24 CET

In the interview with Nathan Fillion awhile ago (in an earlier thread) he started talking about the Firefly fans and slipped up and said "Firefly Flans" and then he just went with it and it was quite funny!

Edited to add: Just changed my username from Blwessels to Firefly Flanatic because I've been planning on doing that and this looked like a good time to do it!!

[ edited by Firefly Flanatic on 2004-12-18 04:30 ]

Firefly Flanatic | December 18, 06:27 CET

Hey bl - I mean Firefly Flanatic, it suits you! Quite fetching. ;)

Willowy | December 18, 06:36 CET

Thanks Willowy!! I'll miss you calling me bl though!

Firefly Flanatic | December 18, 06:38 CET

Heh, maybe once in a while I'll slip up, eh?

Willowy | December 18, 07:58 CET

Maybe you can be called fl once in a while too? I did wonder who this new person was! Welcome under your new name.

Lioness | December 18, 08:16 CET

"Heh, maybe once in a while I'll slip up, eh?"

And everyone else who didn't know me as "blwessels" will wonder who the heck you're talking to. :)

[ edited by Firefly Flanatic on 2004-12-18 06:18 ]

Firefly Flanatic | December 18, 08:17 CET

Thanks Lioness!

Firefly Flanatic | December 18, 08:19 CET

I too was wondering about the "Flans" thing...

And since I have managed to miss Firefly completly up till now that I'm watching my shiney DVD boxset I keep seeing the odd thing that makes me go "Oh, THAT'S what that's all about!" For example, I just saw "Captin Tightpants"

zz9 | December 18, 23:48 CET

zz9, did you see the "big damn heroes" scene yet?

eddy | December 19, 05:24 CET

I've only watched them once so far...where is the "Big Damn heros" scene?

newcj | December 19, 21:05 CET

If I'm not mistaken its said in the pilot.

eddy | December 19, 22:41 CET

The big damn heros scene is at the end of "Safe".

lalaa | December 20, 00:32 CET