Whedonesque : Comments on 7201 : (SPOILER) Herc at AICN loves tonight's "The Inside",

If tonight's episode is as good as those aired the last two Wednesdays, then I am going to be mightily sorry to see this series go the way of Wonderfalls, etc. The summer is likely a bad time to premiere a series for which people have to think, and then the show is superficially a procedural, among many others, and it was slow to resonate emotionally with viewers. And it is also on Fox. But I was beginning to like this show a great deal. Too bad for me, I guess.

Here's hoping TM lands on his feet. And AB, too. (Guess it's too bad that Peter Coyote left that other series for this.)

palehorse | July 13, 20:23 CET

I read somewhere that The 4400 were hoping to have Peter Coyote back as a guest star later in the season so maybe they'll be able to reintroduce him as a semi or even full regular.
I'm also starting to really get into The Inside, has taken a lot longer than with most of Tim's previous shows but of course I'm there just in time for Fox's annual pulling of the plug on a show I like/love.

Paul_Rocks | July 13, 20:34 CET

I started really appreciating the show with Jane Espenson's episode, and have looked forward to it since. If I like tonight's show, it will definitely be cancelled.

After all, we must watch the dancing meat packages and the people who insult them worse than I do, because dumbing the public down so we'll buy tap shoes and tutus is what it's all about.

Nebula1400 | July 13, 20:52 CET

well, they already shot the whole season, hopefully Fox, will give them a chance to burn off the remaining episodes.

Well, I can only that I'm looking forward for the dvd set.

Numfar PTB | July 13, 21:49 CET

Everything started to get into a groove with Jane’s episode. It’s bad enough when they don’t give a show a chance and make it disappear after three or four episodes, but this is over half way through and would it really hurt them to air the remaining ones? I’m sure they saw the ratings success of “Cheesy Ballroom Dancing with C-list Celebrities” (which from the promos, I actually thought was one of those misleading joke Geico car insurance commercials before I realized it was legit) and, in the grand tradition of greedy monkey see, monkey do programming execs, had to get their version on the air a soon as possible. America loves cheap crap! So much for Amber Benson’s appearance, I guess.

bloodflowers | July 13, 21:54 CET

I actually thought was one of those misleading joke Geico car insurance commercials

Oh, bloodflowers, I thought the same thing when I first saw it!! I couldn't believe it was a promo for a real show.

palehorse | July 13, 22:02 CET

There may not be any more "burning." Wonderfalls died after four eps, and if it weren't for the DVDs, the other nine would have been lost for the ages. (Just finished the last disk of WF, and the final five eps were spectacularly good. Stupid FOX.)

OTOH, FOX might deliberately hold back unaired eps for a DVD release. "The complete series! Including 6 never-before seen episodes!" God, Minear must be dreading the commentaries. How many times can the man smile through his pain and say, "Well, I'm just glad the public can finally see these episodes...."

cjl | July 13, 22:04 CET

Fox didn't finish airing the Point Pleasant or Tru Calling episodes that were shot, so I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't finish the run of The Inside. I guess it will have to wait for the DVD release. Plus, promoting it with "Six unaired episodes!" will help the DVD sales.

Everyone, go right now to TV Shows on DVD and vote for The Inside. Tell them you will buy the DVD when it's released. You have no obligation to buy, and registration is free. They will then email you alerts when there's news on the DVDs.

electricspacegirl | July 13, 22:20 CET

America loves cheap crap!

You're right. And I loved Dancing with the Stars, so sometimes I like the crap too, what can I say! I gave it up for The Inside, but was somewhat bummed about it. My mom was a professional ballroom dancer, so we got a kick out of watching and calling each other to pick apart routines, leg, toe, and arm placement, and talk about who was improving. As a summer show, as crap goes, if you're someone that enjoys ballroom dancing, it could be very entertaining.

I am hoping that The Inside gets a DVD release. I missed last week's two eps as I was at my mom's and she wasn't giving up the finale of Dances with the Stars. I'd like to see those two, plus whatever Fox isn't airing. It's the gorram summer, what the hell do they have to fill The Inside's slot with that's going to spike the ratings?! I just don't understand their triggerhappy cancellations. Give a show a few episodes to find it's rhythm - and then don't cancel it immediately after it's done so - it's not a difficult concept.

Angela | July 13, 22:21 CET

"They will happen upon a man who battles demons."

So, this has secretly been the continuation of Angel all along? No wonder there have been so many references to the Whedonverse...
;-)

Niels | July 13, 22:33 CET

I was thinking about this very situation earlier about the cancellation of new television series and the question in my mind is where it will stop. I mean, 10-15 years ago, most series were given two or three seasons to gain their ratings legs. It took that long to gather an audience. Now, they're expected to do the same in six episodes? No wonder.

As for 'The Inside', I hope Fox uses the remaining episodes as fillers over the summer/fall period. Looking over their planned schedule, they should have plenty of room;)

Madhatter | July 13, 22:45 CET

You know, the show was very solidly produced. It was obvious there was a lot of talent behind it. But, at the end of the day, I don't think it was original enough to warrant lashing out at Fox about it. Yeah, they're notorious for not giving shows time to grow (including ones that actually deserved it, i.e. "Firefly"), but that's just the state of TV in general these days. Regardless, I just couldn't see "The Inside" running for 5+ years. I could go on, but I think I'll just shamelessly leave the link for my full review of the show.

rbt | July 14, 00:55 CET

I don't think that we can know what a show is capable of in the first 6 episodes. I think it takes a season to really see if a show is worth watching. But that said, The Inside was much more entertaining than Law & Order and CSI, and those shows are very popular. I lash out at Fox because it barely even tries. Some of the greatest shows in history would have been cancelled after the first 4 episodes if they were to air on Fox in this current climate.

[ edited by electricspacegirl on 2005-07-13 23:19 ]

electricspacegirl | July 14, 01:11 CET

A following has to be built over an extended period of time.

I heard that when Cheers first aired it bombed, nobdy watched it, and nobody cared. But the head of the network, whoever it was, said that he didn't want to live in a world where a show like Cheers wasn't on the air, or something to that effect. He let it air until it became one of the most watched shows in history.

I truly believe that Wonderfalls would have become an enormous hit if it had a full season, or even if the 13 episodes were aired. It's not like Arrested Development, which is an amazingly hilarious show, but in some ways asks to be cancelled since its jokes are so inside and so quick that only 1/250th of the population can grasp it. Firefly and The Inside are in the same field though, they demand a lot from the casual viewer. Which is a shame that intelligent shows can't make it, but since they're never given a chance, we'll never know.

The BIGGEST and most INFURIATING part about Fox though is that they CARE A ZERO AMOUNT about the doomed show's fanbase. They REFUSE to carry out the rest of the 13 episodes. Man, air them at 3:30 in the morning if it means they'll lose ad time if aired during primetime. We don't care. We have VCRs and TiVos and DVD recorders. We're capable viewers! But now we're just waiting fruitlessly for a DVD package for 6 more hours of TV.

It's more than a shame. For a show this good and emotionally eviscerating, it's a catastrophe.

TheZeppo | July 14, 01:48 CET

"I'm bigger than you, and I have a gun." I totaly fell in love with Rebecca after she said that line. How dare you cancel another excellent show by Tim Minear FOX. Let's look at the track record shall we...

1.Firefly
2.John Doe
3.Wonderfalls
4.Tru Calling

...and now The Inside. Thank god for DVDs.

SpikeBad | July 14, 02:01 CET

Regardless, I just couldn't see "The Inside" running for 5+ years.

I could. Very clearly. And perhaps once you've seen the 13, you would as well. I think you've made teh mistake of thinking the show is about cases, like Law and Order or CSI, but it's actually just about the people.

People adore House. Here's House: Gee, it's 8:45, here's where House figures out that the person who everyone thought was suffering from the bubonic plague really is just allergic to peas.

People watch because they like the character, he's interesting. Or something. People don't watch er to find out who shot the kid on the gurney in room 6.

The Inside is a drama that takes place in a unit that solves serial murder cases, much the same way that Angel was a drama that took place in a paranormal investigation unit.

We've seen the handful of episodes that introduce the characters and what they do, but I think tonight's episode begins telling us just who these characters are.

But then, if Out of Gas hadn't come along, I wouldn't have thought Firefly deserved a pickup, either.

Perhaps you just need to see the OoG episode of The Inside.

Allyson | July 14, 03:10 CET

See, "Firefly" hooked me pretty much immediately. By the time the fifth episode aired, I would have followed that show anywhere. With "The Inside," I just didn't think the creative vision, based on those first episodes, was all that marvelous. That doesn't mean that those saying "The Inside" could have gone on to great things are wrong. Who knows? It very well may have. Talented people were behind it. And it IS hard to determine a show's prospects after only a small handful of episodes. Still, I think the show, if it would have continued, would have been extremely limited by its procedural-show roots.

rbt | July 14, 03:28 CET

See, "Firefly" hooked me pretty much immediately.

It's all so very subjective, isn't it? Now that a few years have passed, I think there were only three genuinely good episodes of Firefly.

I don't think The Inside is any more limited by procedural roots than Buffy ever was. Was it ever really about the monsters of the week? The Inside was to evolve out from the case of the week and hit long character-developy arcs.

Allyson | July 14, 03:36 CET

I think that with Fox's reputation of quickly cancelling shows hinders a shows chance of even starting off good. A lot of people who have tuned in for shows that looked good on Fox only to see them quickly disappear probably see a new show that appeals to them and have a "why bother" attitude and don't tune in at all. I'll admit, I'm one of those. I will tune in to check out something or someone verse related because I care about these people but if it has nothing to do with actors, writers or producers that I am familiar with I don't bother.

We can argue all day about whether or not "The Inside" could've become a great show but the fact is Fox has made sure that we will never know the answer to that. "Firefly" was a rare show that developed a huge following regardless of how shabbily it was treated by Fox and bounced all over the schedule, shown out of order and pre-empted. But because of us devoted fans and word of mouth, the shows fan base grew and grew and we do now have the opportunity of seeing how great this show would've been. But "Firefly" is that very rare gem that you could see it's magic from the start. Most shows need a bit of time to let us know who the characters are and what the purpose of the show is. We never get that chance with Fox anymore. Talk of cancelling a show three episodes in is just plain ridiculous and is a big blow to the people who keep tuning into this network hoping that someday one of these shows will last longer than a handful of episodes.

And yes, it's true that "Cheers" started off to very mediocre ratings, as did "Seinfield", "Friends" and Fox's own "X-files" - which is the show that put their network on the map. Today, they'd cancel it in a heartbeat!

Firefly Flanatic | July 14, 03:44 CET

Allyson, I respect your opinion and your defense of "The Inside" but, and I don't think I'm alone in feeling this way, "Firefly" had more than a few good episodes. Maybe it's not a show you particularly cared for until you saw OoG but it had something right from the beginning with me starting with "The Train Job". I didn't think that was the greatest episode for a pilot but I knew the back story about the last minute change and that they had to write a new script for the pilot. I absolutely loved the rest of the episodes, with the exception of "Heart of Gold" which I only liked.

Firefly Flanatic | July 14, 03:51 CET

"Firefly" had more than a few good episodes.

Hence the words, "I think."

I was responding to the person's review, and used Firefly only because he wrote an essay about it. I'm specifically talking about subjectivity. Firefly was pretty much universally panned by critics (me being one of them) and then once the DVDs came out and it was seen as a whole, there was much of the "oh! how could this masterpiece have been canceled?!?!!" going around.

And really, Firefly had pretty much the same numbers as The Inside. Better numbers than Wonderfalls which was a critics darling (and I loved that right out of the gate).

Allyson | July 14, 04:06 CET

"Firefly" universally panned by critics when it aired? Oh, I don't think so. It didn't get a ton of attention as a whole from the mainstream press, but I certainly recall more favorable reviews than pans, including this one from USA Today and this one from Entertainment Weekly.

[ edited by bobtaylor on 2005-07-14 02:17 ]

rbt | July 14, 04:13 CET

The Inside was to evolve out from the case of the week and hit long character-developy arcs.

And that makes me cry. The Inside is dark and moody, and so ripe for big character arcs that have heart-pounding suspense and achy tragedy. I can feel the possibility. And that's what I love and look for on TV. It reminds me of dark, mythic heroes fighting evil and losing their loved ones in the process (Wesley). For The inside, the demons are internal demons, as opposed to vampires and monsters and evil senior partners. I get that, and I wish a show like that could remain on the air.

I hope Tim Minear gets to someday work on a series that doesn't get cancelled before it's time. Tim, have you thought about moving to cable?

On a side note, if you're interested in listening to an interview with Tim Minear where he discusses the cancellation of his shows, The Succubus Club has an mp3 of the show he was on right after Wonderfalls was cancelled last year. The date of it is April 7, 2004. It's a good interview, very funny, and Tim has interesting opinions on the networks, genre shows, and reality TV.

And if you like that interview, there are other VIP interviews on that site you can download. The writers give a lot of insight into their take on the shows and their characters, and I can never get enough of that stuff.

electricspacegirl | July 14, 04:17 CET

Oh gosh Bob, I'm sorry. I am obviously wrong. I must have been thinking about some other show.

I remember sending copies of Ariel out to critics who panned Firefly. But it was more even than I remembered, you're right.

Allyson | July 14, 04:20 CET

I think Firefly is a classic. Timeless. All of the episodes are important, regardless of their quality, and to be honest I feel that only one episode missed the transcendent quality of the other episodes.

To defend "The Inside" further, the cases are thematically parallel to one, some or all of the main characters. Always. On the surface it seems like a slightly more rock 'n' roll CSI, but I think most of us know it's not.

And House? Really? I don't get it.

[ edited by TheZeppo on 2005-07-14 02:22 ]

TheZeppo | July 14, 04:20 CET

I too think that Firefly had more than a few good episodes. In fact, IMO, the only less-than-good episodes were The Train Job, Bushwhacked, Safe, and Heart of Gold; and there were great moments in each of those.

I don't know The Inside, 'cos I don't watch current TV, so I have nothing to say about it. Even so, I don't see how criticizing Firefly achieves anything. Reading somewhat negative comments about Firefly doesn't incline me toward watching The Inside; rather, it tells me that the reviewer's tastes are very different from my own.

SoddingNancyTribe | July 14, 04:23 CET

Agree with you there Bobtaylor, I remember hearing many, many good things about the pilot episode for Firefly and then a bunch of critics complaining about Fox suddenly demanding a new pilot. I remember then reading how some of these same critics thought the new pilot was okay but the first one was perfect and introduced the characters so well.

Allyson, I hadn't read Herc's review because I didn't want to be spoiled but I just did because you mentioned that you were responding to his comments in an essay he did. I didn't see any mention of Firefly in that review.

Not wanting to get into a big debate with you over this, because frankly I agree that Fox isn't giving this show a chance, but it just seems like you feel the need to tear apart Firefly to build up The Inside. And I like The Inside. Granted I haven't seen all the episodes - missed the pilot and last weeks double header because of bad weather and a sensitive satellite dish. I just think you can make all your very valid points about The Inside without having to try to make Firefly sound like a subpar show in comparison.

Firefly Flanatic | July 14, 04:25 CET

Even so, I don't see how criticizing Firefly achieves anything. Reading somewhat negative comments about Firefly doesn't incline me toward watching The Inside; rather, it tells me that the reviewer's tastes are very different from my own.

Allyson, I hadn't read Herc's review because I didn't want to be spoiled but I just did because you mentioned that you were responding to his comments in an essay he did. I didn't see any mention of Firefly in that review.

No no, Bob Taylor linked to his article in his post above, reviewing The Inside.

And he's the one who wrote the essay for the Firefly book. So I was contrasting specifically for him, and what he had to say about The Inside not lasting more than a season based on what he'd seen.

I wouldn't have thought Firefly could have lasted more than a season based on the episodes shown before Out of Gas made me think the show was going to find its way and become interesting over time.

I think it only had three good eps out of thirteen. If it had gotten its full 22 order, I think there may have been the potential to get another three good eps, and then a kickass second season once it hit a stride.

But my main point is, if I had turned away from Firefly before Out of Gas, I may have missed that episode, one of the finest hours I've ever seen on my teevee. And that's what would have taken me through to things like Ariel and Objects in Space.

I'm not tearing down Firefly to build up The Inside, and I don't think I've been confusing about that.

[ edited by Allyson on 2005-07-14 02:38 ]

Allyson | July 14, 04:35 CET

Man, whatever happened to "My Big Fat Obnoxious Boss?" Another Fox-cancelled travesty.

TheZeppo | July 14, 04:42 CET

I don't think I've been confusing about that.

Not at all. We clearly have very different opinions of Firefly. But if you post that FF had only three good eps out of thirteen on a site named Whedonesque, you're gonna get some responses, is all . . .

SoddingNancyTribe | July 14, 04:45 CET

Okay, I see where you are coming from now but yes, it does seem like you were tearing down Firefly (and obviously SNT kind of felt that too) but I get that that wasn't your intention.

And I can totally see what you are saying that it took OoG for you to see the potential of Firefly and that people may never get that chance with The Inside. And yeah, that really sucks.

But I do want to point out, and you can find reviews for Firefly on this site before it aired in the archives and what critics felt, that Firefly was getting good reviews and critics really liked the show. Maybe in your circle that wasn't the case but I had only read good things about the show.

Firefly Flanatic | July 14, 04:49 CET

But if you post that FF had only three good eps out of thirteen on a site named Whedonesque, you're gonna get some responses, is all . . .

Of course, and I expect that most everyone here would disagree with me, and the site is not Minearesque, I realize, in which a post directing readers to a review about why The Inside wouldn't last would be greeted with the same amount of "HEY! UNTRUE!"

I just wanted to be clear that I was responding to Bob Taylor's self-link and used Firefly as reference only because he wrote about it in the Firefly book. If he had written an essay on Angel, I would have used that show as a contrast.

Allyson | July 14, 04:49 CET

Maybe in your circle that wasn't the case but I had only read good things about the show

It wasn't just my circle. I don't have a circle. Part of our campaign at F:IA was sending out Ariel to critics who panned the show, and asking them to take a second look. But that was three years ago, and for the life of me, I can't remember who we sent them out to, now.

Allyson | July 14, 04:54 CET

Firefly Flanatic is correct. I certainly welcome and respect Allyson's viewpoint, and I don't think she said anything remotely close to being out of line ... at least until the remark about "Firefly" being "universally panned."

Now, I don't have hard data from every publication in the country, but based on my own admittedly occasionally faulty memory, that statement seemed WAY off base and made me suspect her entire argument.

Still, I have no problems with somebody coming on here and honestly critiquing "Firefly," or any other show, or, hell, even something I wrote. After all, there'd be nothing to talk about if we all loved every show equally. I certainly didn't dislike "The Inside." I just didn't love it either.

I will say this, it should NOT take until season two for a show to reach its stride. If you have a show that works, you should know it and the viewer should know it by midway through a full first season. Certainly no later than the end of the first season. Using my fave new show as an example, it took "Veronica Mars" about 10 or 12 episodes to find itself and start excelling on a weekly basis. "Buffy" was certainly at that point by the end of the shortened season one/beginning of season two (also 12 or so eps in).

Too bad Fox has a nasty habit of canceling shows while they're still in the single digits.

rbt | July 14, 05:02 CET

I will say this, it should NOT take until season two for a show to reach its stride.

It depends, I think, on whether you're talking about a 22 episode season, or a thirteen episode season as well. And by 13, I mean, "got canceled after four eps."

Now, I don't have hard data from every publication in the country, but based on my own admittedly occasionally faulty memory, that statement seemed WAY off base and made me suspect her entire argument.

Did you miss my post where I realized that?

I can't get into Veronica Mars, so I can't comment. It's not a show I can get at all interested in watching, though people I know and love adore it.

Allyson | July 14, 05:11 CET

It depends, I think, on whether you're talking about a 22 episode season, or a thirteen episode season as well. And by 13, I mean, "got canceled after four eps."

Now I've forgiven Allyson entirely because that made me laugh out loud.

And, Allyson, I did see your post. I just was showing that I thought it was that particular statement from you that got people a little riled up.

rbt | July 14, 05:16 CET

Saw tonight's episode and all I have to say is: wow. It also looked like Fox plans to air another one next week.

killinj | July 14, 06:03 CET

Hold off on the funeral. The Inside will be back on Wednesday, July 27 at its usual time slot. We might get the full 13 yet.

cjl | July 14, 06:03 CET

REALLY?!?!?!?!? Please don't kid. I've been mourning all morning!!

I have yet to see the episode since I'm on that PACIFIC side of the country.

TheZeppo | July 14, 06:05 CET

I hope so. I watched tonight's episode and thought it was very good. Now, I missed the pilot and I missed that last two episodes as I mentioned earlier, but I did not find it at all hard following what was going on (got filled in on the last two episodes over on Flickr). My husband, who normally is at work when The Inside is on was home tonight because he's on vacation and this was his first viewing. He really liked the show a lot. Now, it won't be on next week because of that stupid looking dance reality show but hopefully Fox will show it the next week like they are currently saying. They showed promo's for the "next" week of Wonderfalls that we never ever got to see so I'm not trusting them yet. I'm hoping that stupid looking dance show gets low ratings because I'm afraid if the ratings are good that will be the end of The Inside.

I think it would be normal for it to take most people at least a half of season to really start getting the feel of most shows. Some shows that happens faster but I honestly think that The Inside has accomplished that and I've missed three episodes so far. I can't say I felt that for Point Pleasant and I didn't feel that Point Pleasant was improving much episode after episode but The Inside's character development has been going along quite smoothly imo and the plot has been getting more and more intriguing.

I hope Fox gives this show another look and a chance to find it's audience. They still seem to be promoting it and I've been seeing it pop up on news shows as a good show to tune into so maybe that will help get it all 13 episodes shown and, even better, a full season. But I hate Fox for good reason so I really doubt they'll come through for us.

Firefly Flanatic | July 14, 06:19 CET

I thought tonight's episode of 'The Inside' was very good, and I was very happy to see that Fox is planning to air another new episode on July 27th (as cjl just said). I'm starting to get into the show, it is definitely one of the only things I'm watching this Summer.

embers | July 14, 06:21 CET

I agree that by the end of a first season, a show should hit it's stride and show the viewer the depths it's capable of. Just for fun, I'll give my opinion on when this happened for me in my four favorite shows.

BUFFY: Prophecy Girl. Although I watched the series out of order, it wasn't until the last episode of the first season that it started hitting it's stride.
ANGEL: To Shanshu in L.A. All the episodes before it were stand-alone, and although there were some good ones, and good moments, It didn't have the emotional resonance it was capable of until the last first season episode.
FIREFLY: Seriously, I think Firefly hit it's stride in the mid-way point of the first episode. Everything seemed to gell from the beginning. Weak episodes to me are The Train Job and Bushwacked, but by Our Mrs. Reynolds, I was deliciously hooked.
VERONICA MARS: I thought the pilot showed the viewer what this show was capable of, but 7 or 8 episodes in, when the most daring plot point I've ever encountered on primetime TV was introduced, that's what really showed me that this show was something very special. But I already sensed that magic in the pilot.

And on this same note, one series that took way too long in getting it's footing was Babylon 5. I don't think it hit its stride until the end of season 2, or even the middle of season 3, and that was very difficult for me to get through. It took me a year to watch the 5 seasons on DVD.

I just thought I'd post this because I'm bored and I have another hour to wait for The Inside.

[ edited by electricspacegirl on 2005-07-14 05:43 ]

electricspacegirl | July 14, 06:57 CET

Star Trek: the Next Generation didn't truly click until about six episodes into Season Three. The first two seasons were, in fact, pretty darn awful. But since it was a ratings winner in syndication, Paramount give it time to find its footing (which it did).

Buffy and VM had supporters at their respective networks who loved the show, and pushed for renewal. Timmah's shows haven't been so lucky.

cjl | July 14, 07:08 CET

This is fun, when did the shows we love click.

Buffy - Prophecy Girl was the first episode to show the full potential of the series, but I think Innocence was the first episode to hit every note.

Angel - Had me from City of, totally grabbed me with Hero.

Firefly - Basicly about 15 minutes into the pilot, seriously that was a great pilot.

Veronica Mars - Episode 1... nuff said :)

Star Trek: The Next Generation - Year 3, there was some really good ones early int he first two years, but the show didn't click until year 3.

Star Trek Deep Space 9 - The pilot, but yah, most likely hit all cylinders sometime in season 2.

Babylon 5 - Thank god someone else thought the first year and a half or so wasn't up to par, the first season was pretty painful overall for me to watch. Once it clicked thought it did work really well, and I like the early stuff a lot more in retrospect.

Farscape - Sometime halfway through year 1.

I think The Inside got it right as of Everthing Nice, and before that it was very entertaining.

And I do agree with Allyson on one point, The Inside isn't just another CSI show, it's about the characters. Every case has managed to focus on who these people are, and that's why the show is better than most CSI type procedurals.

[ edited by rabid on 2005-07-14 05:37 ]

rabid | July 14, 07:28 CET

Buffy - From the first episode
Angel - Liked it in the beginning loved it after watching Hero.
Firefly - I didn't have the luxury of seeing the real pilot and had to settle for "The Train Job" but I could see glimmers of the greatness to come so I'd say by the third episode definitely. If I had been able to see the real pilot first I would've loved it immediately because everything would've been set up as Joss had meant it to be.
Veronica Mars - about halfway through. I hadn't watched it when it started and only started watching it about 6 episodes in so it took awhile for me to really fall for it.
Farscape - also about halfway through season 1. Could see that it had glimmers of greatness and was glad I kept watching because it was a fantastic show.
Battlestar Galactica - First episode
Stargate Sg-1 - the movie hooked me first but loved it from the first episode.
Stargate Atlantis - first episode
Lost - about four episodes in I guess.
Desperate Housewives - liked it in the beginning but actually lost interest and stopped watchin towards the middle.

Firefly Flanatic | July 14, 07:37 CET

Tonight, the words "demon" and "slay" came up more often than on your average cop show.

Anyway, like many, it wasn't until last week's two episodes that I felt THE INSIDE had started to find its footing. And I thought tonight's ep was continuing that trend until the wrap-up. And since no one has yet discussed their reaction I won't say anything more about it.

It looks like we will get the episode we saw the previews for on the 27th but I think that's it. We'll have to get the DVD's for the other six.

And Allyson, I take it the three were "Out of Gas", "Ariel", and "Objects in Space". But "Jaynestown"? C'mon, ya gotta give us "Jaynestown"! I mean, there was a song and everything!

batmarlowe | July 14, 07:51 CET

Hold off on the funeral. The Inside will be back on Wednesday, July 27 at its usual time slot. We might get the full 13 yet.

FOX showed the coming attractions to an episode of "Wonderfalls" that never aired, because they decided to pull the plug 3 or 4 days before it was supposed to air, so don't be too sure about this.

Buffy, Angel, Firefly, Veronica Mars, and Star Trek:TNG had me from episode 1 of Season 1. Star Trek:DS9 didn't grab me until a few episodes into season 3, but I watched it religiously before that, because it was Star Trek, and Avery Brooks was a professor at my college (and a fellow Livingston College alumni) and I remember seeing him on campus (though I didn't know he was an actor at the time).

The Inside was growing on me, and I am someone who will be loyal to writers I truly admire. I'm all for giving them a chance to show what they're really up to. Unfortunately, there are morons in charge of FOX. It took small brains to put FOX in last place.

And Jaynestown was absolutely my favorite episode of Firefly.

[ edited by Nebula1400 on 2005-07-14 06:03 ]

Nebula1400 | July 14, 08:00 CET

I don't know what you mean about the wrap-up, batmarlowe, but I have to say, the last shot of Webb staring out the window in the final moment was one of the creepiest things I've ever seen. Wow, I loved tonight's show! Melody had some fantastic and funny lines, but I didn't write them down otherwise I'd quote them.

I do have a great quote from tonight though:

Prostitute coming on to Web: "Is that a gun in your pocket or are you just happy to see me?"
Webb: "That's a gun in my pocket."

Great stuff! I can't wait for the next episode, it looks good. I hope it's the first of a 2 or 3 episode story arc.

[ edited by electricspacegirl on 2005-07-14 07:46 ]

electricspacegirl | July 14, 09:19 CET

Laughed at the line too!! And yeah, uber creepy when Webb was staring out the window and we could see his reflection! At least we know he's not a vampire!

And c'mon, the best episode of Firefly has to be Trash - you know, the one with the naked Mal!!

Firefly Flanatic | July 14, 09:24 CET

Naked Mal is hard to beat, but come on, give it up for Objects in Space! For me, it's all about the artsy episodes (i.e. Restless), and River's my favorite FF character. I do love the Saffron episodes though. I'm one of the few that does not have Out of Gas as a favorite episode, and I'm not sure why. I guess when it comes to FF, my favorites are the episodes with the most emotional resonance for me, and that would have to be the ones with with lots of Simon/River angst.

Webb is still a vampire, but only metaphorically. I dig your line of thinking though, Blwessels. Wouldn't it be great if The Inside was in the same universe as the Angelverse? Little girl in 3rd episode: "Where's Angel?" Indeed.

ETA: I forgot to mention: concerning the gun in his pocket, I knew right after she asked that, that he was going to say "It's a gun in my pocket." But still, great line! Funny stuff. I especially got a kick out of the bit where the evil director (the one trying to get rid of Webb) walked in the fielding room and nobody was there!

[ edited by electricspacegirl on 2005-07-14 07:44 ]

electricspacegirl | July 14, 09:38 CET

People (like me) watch House because of Hugh Laurie. The surrounding cast is nice and entertaining, the medical drama all well-thought out and intricately plotted, but the show is all Laurie's. It's one of those roles filled with one of those actors that literally just dominate a middling show -- he's electric. There's talk of him getting nominated for an Emmy, which would be huge b/c even though the show does well ratings-wise, it's not very critically well received, and nothing else about the show -- the directing or writing -- is especially interesting. It's all about Laurie's star turn.

The Inside: I tried again to watch it tonight, and didn't really enjoy it. I turned it off after about ten minutes because it got too gory for me. There's something about human misery and pain -- it's hard to spin that into entertainment, you know?

dottikin | July 14, 10:02 CET

Well, I must confess OoG and OiS are my favorite Firefly episodes but naked Mal is right up there!!! There should've been a naked Mal in every episode! River & Mal are tied for my favorite characters (unless Mal is naked and he then wins hands down)! Next would have to be War Stories. Mal & Wash bonding over being tortured - those silly guys!

My all time favorite Firefly scene is River balanced on the railings "listening" to everyone in Objects in Space.

Firefly Flanatic | July 14, 10:09 CET

Just saw on the main page that Point Pleasant is being released on DVD. I guess even if they do go through with cancelling The Inside we'll most likely get a chance to see everything on DVD eventually if they are releasing Point Pleasant they most likely will release this too.

Firefly Flanatic | July 14, 10:12 CET

There should've been a naked Mal in every episode!

My all time favorite Firefly scene is River balanced on the railings "listening" to everyone in Objects in Space.

I agree on both counts. Especially the naked part. Mmmm Mal...

electricspacegirl | July 14, 10:16 CET

There's something about human misery and pain -- it's hard to spin that into entertainment, you know?

Wait. Wait. So every week on House, some person is dying from like, some weird monkey flesh eating genital disease that could be the Haunta virus or could be a reaction to sushi, while House limps around popping pills and verbally abusing his staff, but that's not about misery and pain? It's just more entertaining misery and pain?

When I watch House, I just think, "Oh, look, the gimp drug addict is being condescending. Must be Tuesday. It's 8:50. Someone must have learned a valuable lesson about jumping to conclusions about herpes symptoms."

I'm not trying to be mean, I just find it all so incredible.

Allyson | July 14, 10:42 CET

Wait. Wait. So every week on House, some person is dying from like, some weird monkey flesh eating genital disease that could be the Haunta virus or could be a reaction to sushi, while House limps around popping pills and verbally abusing his staff, but that's not about misery and pain? It's just more entertaining misery and pain?

When I watch House, I just think, "Oh, look, the gimp drug addict is being condescending. Must be Tuesday. It's 8:50. Someone must have learned a valuable lesson about jumping to conclusions about herpes symptoms."

Allyson, I just fell in love with you.

[ edited by TheZeppo on 2005-07-14 08:48 ]

TheZeppo | July 14, 10:48 CET

I thought it was Tuesday when Dawn needed rescuing?

catalyst2 | July 14, 16:22 CET

July 13 2005