Whedonesque : Comments on 7701 : (SPOILER) New Clip

Also available at that mirrors link are single files with all available sessions run one after the other (tho some of the links haven't been updated yet because I'm still checkign to see who has updated to include Session 165).

theonetruebix | August 29, 22:43 CET

Creep. Pee. Makes me want to hug her, though.

bogu_salias | August 29, 22:46 CET

Oh.My.God. This one is the coolest ever, I can't believe what a great performance Summer is giving, and the writing is so perfect. I wish these were airing on TV, people would go nuts trying to find out what it is all about!

embers | August 29, 22:47 CET

This one was less creepy to me. More sad. Still, it had an ominous tone that unsettled me.

Willowy | August 29, 22:48 CET

These clips may be a bit too intense for even cable TV, but they really show what Summer can do...and they really freak you out!
But you're right...they'd make great promos. They should be played at random times on Sci-Fi

[ edited by impalergeneral on 2005-08-29 20:49 ]

[ edited by impalergeneral on 2005-08-29 20:50 ]

impalergeneral | August 29, 22:49 CET

ahhhhhhhhh. also, good acting.

MySerenity | August 29, 22:58 CET

FYI, I've kept hearing from a couple of the sites that have released these that they believe there are five clips in total. Over on the 'Versal boards, someone says that Joss himself said this at the Premier (the first time I've heard the "five" number tied directly to Joss).

If so, the presumption is that the only clip left is "Session 416, First Excerpt".

theonetruebix | August 29, 23:00 CET

she's crazy! :)
Five by Five... if there is one more, i cant wait for that one
she should win some kind of award ;)

Mr Universe | August 29, 23:05 CET

good observation. Anyone figure out who "Paul Probo" could be?

MySerenity | August 29, 23:06 CET

I posted before I watched it. Absolutely chilling!

brownishcoat | August 29, 23:07 CET

Anyone figure out who "Paul Probo" could be?

I have a theory, but my explanation is somewhat spoilery. Let me repeat that: The link I just gave includes spoilers.

theonetruebix | August 29, 23:12 CET

These are all really disturbing, and Summer's doing a fabulous job. I'm not totally sold on Joss's role as interogator, but it sounds like he had to step in quickly given all the time constraints.
Somehow, it's even sadder seeing some of them out of order, too – seeing River at her most disturbed and violent, and then back when she was all eager and excited and a lot more sane.
On this one, I'm with Willowy - more sad than creepy, but really well done.
Curious to see the first excerpt of 416!

acp | August 29, 23:14 CET

I'm not totally sold on Joss's role as interogator, but it sounds like he had to step in quickly given all the time constraints.

This is me, kind of. But part of my problem with him is just that... he sounds like himself. His "man in white coat" voice sounds to me just like that low voice he slips into in interviews and such, when he intentionally swallows his words... And so I'm like, "There is Joss. With River." An odd juxtaposition, because River and Summer are separate in my mind, but Joss and... that other guy... they seem the same to me.

Also possibly I am making too much of the messing-with-heads thing - Joss messes with our heads, that guy and his cronies are messing with River's head...

Kiba | August 29, 23:20 CET

I think it would have been cool to have Ron Glass be the interrogator guy. Then we would have known Shepherd Book's mysterious past.

Willowy | August 29, 23:24 CET

Willowy: Maybe he's the orderly wearing the mask.

brownishcoat | August 29, 23:28 CET

There's something wrong with the body politic.

Hahaha. I'm sorry, but that's just a little too ... something. :-)

chickenbird | August 29, 23:30 CET

This makes me think of something either Joss (or another one of the writers?) said about how they wouldn’t throw things at the actors unless they knew they could handle them. Summer is having everything thrown at her in these clips and she is 100% believable with everything. Wow!

To those who don't find Joss as convincing as the interrogator, I do know James Marsters has praised Joss's Hamlet when the various casts did Shakespeare readings at his house. Maybe it was hard for him to play a character that he wrote--and remember he is a writer and director before he's an actor.

bloodflowers | August 29, 23:31 CET

Thanks to theonetruebix for putting all four currently released clips in order on the mirrorsite...it really shows off the backwards progress River is making during her time at the school.

The Joss voice doesn't bother me so much, realizing it was he that conjured all the horrible stuff that happened to River in the first place, being the writer. Love the princess and the pea reference. Very ookey. Gives me the wiggs.

blutortu | August 29, 23:39 CET

Oh I think that Joss' performance is perfect, he is using his kind patient voice (which he sometimes uses in Q&As), showing that the Doctor believes in what he is doing, and is used to having the subject go crazy. He isn't surprised or upset, just patiently trying to get the data he needs.
It is chilling.

embers | August 29, 23:45 CET

These are really interesting! I am fascinated by this approach. Very heart-wrenching and powerful to get a peek at these moments in Rivers past.

I'm with Kiba and acp on Joss as interrogator. It is so distracting hearing his voice, I find it impossible to believe him as an actor. Probably because we are so used to his voice as a person from interviews and commentaries. I think great acting is when you can only see the character and the actor sort of disappears, like Summers' River in these clips. Joss sounds too much like himself and not just his voice, but the cadence and delivery too. There is one point where I think I can even hear him holding his breath waiting to read the next line.

All that said, it is marvelous fun knowing that it is him, feels a little bit like receiving a gift or knowing a (not so secret)secret. I am glad he chose to play the part and join the fun in that way.

SaltyGoodness | August 29, 23:49 CET

Agree that Joss is doing a good job as interogator. The best way to interogate a subject is to befriend them, be patient, supportive, believing, unperturbable. Spot on.

It also heightens the contrast with River.

MissKittysMom | August 29, 23:54 CET

I notice this is the first clip with a Spoiler warning. How spoilery is it really? Does it actually give away anything significant in the movie?

tehipite_tom | August 29, 23:54 CET

I decided to err on the side of caution.

brownishcoat | August 29, 23:57 CET

I didn't notice anything that seemed spoilery, even after going back and watching again (and I have seen the movie). But I may not be the best judge, what do others think? Some of it might make a little more sense once you have seen the movie but I don't think it gives anything away and I doubt they would put spoilers in a viral marketing clip...

SaltyGoodness | August 30, 00:12 CET

Wow, this one really showcases Summer's acting chops! Not that Firefly did not it's just that the focus was on the other 7 actors too; seeing her in one long scene really gives her a chance to shine. Like in her scene in Waiting in the Wings. Just heart-breaking! It's unbelieveable to me that River is her first big role. She gets to be such a complex character and totally pulls it off IMHO. "Playing crazy" is definitely not as "easy" as it seems. And in these clips you see her from "normal" to "serial killer crazy," which must have been interesting for her to play.

These clips are such great gifts from Joss! They would make me giddy... if they did not creep me out so much! ;-)

[ edited by Alanna_Wolff on 2005-08-29 22:18 ]

Alanna_Wolff | August 30, 00:16 CET

I agree that Joss as the interigator is perfect. His friendly tone now seems eerie and creepy in the context.

MySerenity | August 30, 00:18 CET

I agree with embers and MissKittysMom about Joss's performance - to me he is utterly believeable, even though I recognize his voice... it doesn't distract me at all.

I teared up a little at the ending of the clip.

m'cookies actual | August 30, 00:19 CET

One of the clips--not telling you which ;-)--has a few mentions of things in the movie but you'd only know that if you'd seen the movie and paid really really close attention to the dialog in the sessions.

lalaa | August 30, 00:21 CET

Wow, this one really showcases Summer's acting chops!

See, I think they all do. It isn't just "babbling psychotic" that requires acting chops. It's the range of all of these clips which actually demonstrate the talent here.

theonetruebix | August 30, 00:23 CET

Can an actor be nominated for an oscar for their performance in a viral marketing video? Because, WOW. This is the best one yet. Summer is so good in this role. Better than I ever imagined.

When the video cut out and then cut back in to her screaming I jumped in my seat! Yikes! And the Alliance interrogator or doctor whoever Joss is playing is all calm and creepy-friendly. I don't have a problem with Joss' performance. I think he does a good job. I recognize his voice, but that doesn't take anything away from the performance for me.

The princess and the pea. Nice reference. I hope they put these on the Serenity DVD!

Bix, I like your theory. It makes a lot of sense.

[ edited by electricspacegirl on 2005-08-29 23:04 ]

electricspacegirl | August 30, 00:38 CET

I think if I hadn't heard him in a million interviews and in person, I'd be right there with Joss-as-that-guy. It's just that every time he talks there's a little "Eee! Joss!" going on in my head.

Kiba | August 30, 00:55 CET

One of the clips--not telling you which ;-)--has a few mentions of things in the movie but you'd only know that if you'd seen the movie and paid really really close attention to the dialog in the sessions.

Thanks! That's actually really helpful.

tehipite_tom | August 30, 01:05 CET

One of the clips--not telling you which ;-)--has a few mentions of things in the movie but you'd only know that if you'd seen the movie and paid really really close attention to the dialog in the sessions.

I've seen the movie but can't figure out what guys are talking about. Can you post it with invis-text to hide the spoilers?

Matt_Fabb | August 30, 01:16 CET

I've seen the movie but can't figure out what guys are talking about. Can you post it with invis-text to hide the spoilers?

It's Session 22. See the transcript.

theonetruebix | August 30, 01:22 CET

Incredibly moving, as well as scary...Summer is a fine actress with far more range than I had realized. And Joss, of course, is Joss...never taking the expected line, and always interesting! Thanks for sharing these, theonetruebix, and for putting everything in order so even technodopes like myself can see them! ;-)

sandyg | August 30, 01:46 CET

See, I think they all do. It isn't just "babbling psychotic" that requires acting chops. It's the range of all of these clips which actually demonstrate the talent here.

Oh I totally agree, onetruebix! I was really moved by session #1, of River as a "normal" girl. And scared to death of crazy-serial-killer-River. But this one totally "brought" it home for me, if that makes sense. Not the "crazy babbling" part but the vulnerability part. You can see that she has zero self-consciousness and completely inhabits the character (or is inhabited by her!!) ;-) Joss and her must have had so much fun rehearsing these scenes and Summer to build River's "backstory."

[ edited by Alanna_Wolff on 2005-08-30 00:17 ]

Alanna_Wolff | August 30, 02:16 CET

Joss and her must have had so much fun rehearsing these scenes and Summer to build River's "backstory."

Well, I can certainly see now why Summer, in the Empire Online chat, described the process of making these as a "whirlwind."

theonetruebix | August 30, 02:25 CET

I've seen the film, and have paid close attention to the clips, and really haven't seen anything I would consider 'spoilery'. It seems to me that since these are prequel to the TV show (much less the movie) that the foreshadowing in them can't really be a 'spoiler', can it?
At any rate I would like to raise my hand with theonetruebix and Matt_Fabb and ask for a text-hidden explanation, because I got nothing. Even reading the transcripts, I don't see it.

embers | August 30, 02:30 CET

embers, maybe not a spoiler, but maybe River says something that comes up again at a later time.

MySerenity | August 30, 02:43 CET

I believe folks are referring to River's reference to Pax in Session 22(?), which, if memory serves, plays a fairly significant role in the movie. Or am I wrong? Still, if you haven't seen the film, one word alone can't possibly be considered a spoiler, without any other context. Can it? :)

SoddingNancyTribe | August 30, 02:49 CET

These are so bizarre and creepy that they would definitely peak (pique?) the interest of the uninitiated. I find Summer's acting superb. Joss as the "white coat" doesn't bother me. After my initial reaction to the second clip, "Ohmigod, that's Joss!" I can let it go and just enjoy the performance for what it is. Plus, it's kinda like an inside joke just for us fans. We are the only ones that would be able to pick that voice out of a crowd. Can't wait for the next clip!

Rank Amateur | August 30, 03:17 CET

That's it, SNT. Agree with you that it isn't a real spoiler in the true sense of the term.

Love that Summer Glau!!!!

SaltyGoodness | August 30, 03:23 CET

Only Joss could make something that's simultaneously so creepy and so sad.

Something about this reminded me of "The Body". I'm not sure what it was. I'll have to go back and watch it another thousand times before I understand.

ETA: I just watched it a second time, and I noticed something. Listen a little harder to what River is repeating at the end there. Refer back to what Simon found out in "Ariel" when he did that brain scan thingy, and put it together.

She knows.

She knows exactly what they did to her.

This is creepy as hell.

[ edited by binkaboo on 2005-08-30 02:21 ]

binkaboo | August 30, 04:08 CET

Yeah, binkaboo. I noticed that, too. But you just mentioning it makes me realize that's an error in the transcript I have posted, and I need to change it. Heh.

theonetruebix | August 30, 04:35 CET

She knows exactly what they did to her.

Oh, yeah. Even on first viewing, I picked up on it.

Over in alt.tv.buffy-v-slayer, we kinda coined a term for things like this, "sledgehammer subtlety." While you're getting hammered with the big stuff, there are all kinds of layers going on underneath, and it's the stuff you barely notice that is most important.

Joss is so good with this!

MissKittysMom | August 30, 04:41 CET

Well I guess I took the little bus to class today.

Seriously, though, I know what you mean. I spend a lot of time looking for the subtext in any kind of art or literature (thank you college for that lovely little anal-retentive quality), but sometimes I miss the big stuff when it just seems too obvious. That's why I've made a habit of watching these clips several times before I even think about commenting on them. However, in my defense I do want to say that I think I had to hear the end again because I'd turned the volume down in anticipation of any sudden movements. River does have the tendency to go wild with the dynamics.

And Bix, I just wanted to say great work on the Session 416 site. All the sections are very complete and the transcripts are really excellent.

binkaboo | August 30, 04:50 CET

and the transcripts are really excellent

Thank the so-called Polter-Cow for those. I kept dreading having to make some, and procrastinating, and then one day, P-C sent some via email out of nowhere.

theonetruebix | August 30, 04:54 CET

I did watch it again, binkaboo, and now I'm even more freaked out. Watching River lose it like that...oh god. Whew! Get me a drink.

Over in alt.tv.buffy-v-slayer, we kinda coined a term for things like this, "sledgehammer subtlety." While you're getting hammered with the big stuff, there are all kinds of layers going on underneath, and it's the stuff you barely notice that is most important.

Joss is so good with this!

Damn straight. It's why I love him so. I've watched the complete series of Buffy so many times (my wildest guess would be eight times, but it could be more), and each time I see something new beneath the layers. Not many shows are like that.

[ edited by electricspacegirl on 2005-08-30 03:13 ]

electricspacegirl | August 30, 05:01 CET

*nix blushes*
Thanx for deleting my double link.

nixygirl | August 30, 05:11 CET

squee...

Craig Oxbrow | August 30, 05:19 CET

"Can an actor be nominated for an oscar for their performance in a viral marketing video? Because, WOW. This is the best one yet. Summer is so good in this role. Better than I ever imagined."

I WAS GOING TO TYPE THE EXACT SAME THING!

START THE 'SUMMER GLAU FOR BEST ACTRESS' CAMPAIGN TODAY!

TheZeppo | August 30, 07:22 CET

ok, but...yeesh. Loud, much?

Willowy | August 30, 08:24 CET

Willowy, me? or River?

TheZeppo | August 30, 09:34 CET

Those emotions seeping out of River were, at times, pathetic and, at times, tragic. Summer's, well, WOW!

I'm with you ESG and TheZeppo.

Drifter | August 30, 11:07 CET

That was entirely creepy and alarming.

Ugh.

(But well done Summer and Joss!)

Apocalypse | August 30, 13:04 CET

Yup, originality. Joss does it again. And I love Summer/River all the more. You guys rock my world. Over and over.

As for Joss as interogaor, it is creepy! But only because we know that voice pretty much from interviews. He sets the right tone.

April | August 30, 16:15 CET

August 29 2005