Would it be possible to have enough power to not have his heart ripped out? And since he rejoices in doing that to us, is this not some kind of poetic justice?
We were crushed alongside Joss when Firefly was cancelled then when Angel was struck its deathblow. But I'm willing to take that chance if Joss would only come back to TVland.
I've seen Serenity twice already and will see it at least 4 times more but it cannot replace the weekly experience.

Lioness | September 12, 16:17 CET

I agree with Lioness. I loved "Serenity," but Joss' powers are clearly at their fullest in a TV environment, where his stories have room to breathe and are richer for it. What's ironic is, Joss kind of bolted the small screen right at the time reality TV was taking over, so it seemed like a good move.

Now, however -- with the success of "Lost," "Desperate Housewives," etc. -- things have changed and complex dramatic storytelling with a genre bent is back in damand on TV. Just look at the fall schedule. The TV landscape is PERFECT for Joss' return, yet he's been busy with "Serenity" and now has "Wonder Woman" lined up (and, with any luck, a "Serenity" sequel), so it may not be reasonable to expect him to return to TV anytime soon. Too bad, really.

rbt | September 12, 16:29 CET

Unless he actually buys a network I can't see how he'll get any guarantees that his babies wont get cancelled.

Maybe if this movie does well and WW does well he'll have some clout to perhaps ensure a full season can play out, but that's long in the future and there's again no guarantees.

Maybe the networks were giving Joss what he needed, rather than what he wanted. Now where have I heard that before? ;0)

lynnie | September 12, 16:41 CET

There's always HBO, but that's my stock answer any time a writer I like starts to talk about a new TV series.

Quentin Tarantino wants to do a TV series? Get him to HBO.

Aaron Sorkin's got something new cooking? Get him to HBO.

Joss is planning a glorified return to episodic storytelling? By the powers that be, GET HIM TO HBO.

Hell, even "Carnivale," which took a year to find its voice and still never found much ratings success, lasted two seasons on the cable net. (Granted they were shortened, HBO-length seasons, but still...)

When somebody has a vision that HBO believes in, they certainly give enough time to make it work and find an audience. Unlike network TV, where it's not uncommon to see something vanish after four episodes.

rbt | September 12, 16:50 CET

But, but *sniff* I don't have HBO. It's a premium channel with a premium pricetag.

killinj | September 12, 17:07 CET

Fox is a free channel with shit for brains programming (now). Cable channels would probably support Joss shows.

Reality, though? I want him to do some movies for now. Sorry, I just do (and I know he’s going to, also).

gossi | September 12, 17:32 CET

I agree that Joss's talents shine more on the small screen than the big. I loved Serenity, but if I'm perfectly objective, I think there are many better films out there this year (*ducks*). Very few TV shows, though, have lived up to the greatness of Whedonverse television.
So many of the things Joss does extraordinarily well – fuse genres, seamlessly weave together humor, pathos, and drama, build characters slowly and consistently and allow them to change, show plot and character developments through small moments – need the space and time of television to really stand out. It's not that he doesn't do those things in movies as well (in the one movie I've seen of his, at least, which, granted, is his debut effort), but it all seemed a little more rushed. In TV shows, I like the side plots, the spaces in between, the unnecessary dialogue, as well as the big plots, and there isn't much room for those, or for the long-term character development, in a 2-hour film. Part of that with Serenity is complicated by the fact that there are so many characters, of course. And I'm sure Joss will do amazing things with Wonder Woman, and I'll eagerly see any other big-screen thing he does.

But selfishly, i'd really love to see him return to TV. Ideally on cable, as others have said, but I also agree with bobtaylor that the direction in which network TV is moving is much more hospitable for Joss's talents than it was a few years ago. In general, I'm much more of a movie person than a TV person. But whereas I feel like there are many bright lights in the movie business, Joss was the first one (and still the greatest) who showed me that TV could reach levels of genius as well.

Plus: it just lasts so much longer.... Something new every week to look forward to!

acp | September 12, 17:47 CET

Back on his own terms.
That's the best way to come back, and I don't think us fans, would want it any other way.

Numfar PTB | September 12, 17:57 CET

Cabel or not. I would really dig to see his work back on TV. I also thionk that the time is right for the type of television! Think about it, when Firefly came out, the whole country was stuck in the reality-TV swamp. Quite scary...now that I think about it THAT way Angel lasted VERY long :-)

Jonas | September 12, 18:16 CET

I totally agree, Joss' magic is better nurtured in the TV format. I'll wait as long as it takes for him to come back (as long as he has total artistic control), to hell with network/bigwig bureaucracies!

Sunnycide | September 12, 18:37 CET

One of the things that Joss does so well, and that is a continuing theme with him, is extended family. For Serenity, he already had that in place. Newbies have to catch up to it, but the connections are already there both between characters and between actors.

Wonder Woman will be an acid test. Will Joss want an extended family for her? If he does, how is he going to build that in a 2-hour film, in addition to telling a story? How will it change his work if he doesn't?

MissKittysMom | September 12, 18:54 CET

She's a witch, burn the witch! j/k :) I would love to see Joss-ness back on the tube. The things that I love the most about Joss are things that play out over extended periods. Much as I love Joss on the silver screen there's just more room for the things I love about his work to shine in a space where it can breathe, which television affords.

zeitgeist | September 12, 19:33 CET

He said tonight that if he gets to make all his sequels that he will go back and do another show NOT Firefly but perhaps with a few members from the original show, but make it a spin off TV show. I sppose like Angel was to Buffy.

He also asked the crowd what they would have prefered more...
A full complete long running series of Firefly or a 3 movie run of Serenity. To which the crowd gave a resounding TV!!!
He said eh knew the answer would be that anyways!

nixygirl | September 12, 20:11 CET

Thanks for the info nixygirl, nothing like hearing it from upon high. :)

Very envious for all you Browncoats in Oz, first beer and now the word of Joss.

The Do That Girl | September 12, 20:16 CET

I'm glad it is being discussed, anyway. Personally? I'm still waiting for the novel I'm hoping he will write some day. All those things we most love in Joss written goodness would be awesome in a book. And I could read it over and over and over and discover more with every re-reading.

Lioness | September 12, 20:17 CET

He could return briefly to tv for a Spike movie - did that come up at all?

killinj | September 12, 20:18 CET

I agree with all who wish Joss would return to TV. I've Serenity twice and loved it dearly, but in no way would I trade a full season of Firefly for a Serenity trilogy as much as I yearn for the latter to happen. Joss showed me that TV can be brilliant beyond words and so very, very satisfying. The depths that can be plumbed....the subtleties that can be explored....yowza. Film is big and glorious and magnificent, true. I've always been a film devotee, but if forced to make a choice, I'd go with Jossian TV over a fabulous film any day.

phlebotinin | September 12, 20:50 CET

I'd still like to know what 'Brothers' was all about.

Simon | September 12, 21:29 CET

In terms of TV. HBO/Showtime/FX/Sci-Fi or even the BBC (go "Ripper"!) really makes the most sense for Joss. HBO and the Beeb are especially cool because hour long shows are just under an hour, rather than 42 minutes, even if they only do twelve (six in the BBC)12 a year -- which is really enough, anyhow. (It's six movies, for God's sake!)

However, I'm not so sure this needs to be an either/or situation. We're in the middle of a huge media transition phase right now where just about everything is unclear, esp. the dividing line between home entertaining and theatrical. Who knows what kind of hybrids might be coming? Certainly, if someone like Tarentino wants to make television, it shows that a more fluid situation may be developing where creators move back and forth freely between movies and TV.

In the meantime, I'm happy to see Joss doing his part to try and reclaim the idea of that you can make an mass-market big screen action picture where the emphasis is on actual stories, characters and dialogue. It didn't used to be such a big deal, but it is now.

[ edited by bobster on 2005-09-12 19:34 ]

bobster | September 12, 21:33 CET

Simon - I believe joss has mentioned a procedual (they're not gonna see that comin').

gossi | September 12, 21:35 CET

If he comes back to television, it's true that there is no way he can guarantee that his shows won't be cancelled. However, if he continues to become a big name in Hollywood, Joss is more likely going to get the support of whatever network he goes with. The networks execs aren't going to interfer and ask for changes and the show would be properly promoted as the next big Joss Whedon show.

Matt_Fabb | September 12, 21:42 CET

Dark Angel. James Cameron at the height of his career. Fox.

Canceled. Arguably to make way for... Firefly.

gossi | September 12, 21:45 CET

DA was cancelled with no relation to FF.

zeitgeist | September 12, 21:46 CET

Dark Angel still ran ... what? ... two seasons. That's a lot of support for a show that was never any good, all thanks to Cameron's clout.

rbt | September 12, 21:51 CET

Simon, if I remember correctly, Brothers was a racy sitcom on Showtime about a bunch of brothers who owned a bar. One was gay, one was kind of dumb, one was type A...

It was funny and well-written.

Willowy | September 12, 21:55 CET

If I said it once, I've said it a thousand times. Any TV show that is merely under the guidance off, overseen by or even given the stamp of approval of Joss would be better than half of what is on TV already. I understand Joss likes to immerse himself in his projects but I don't see why he can't have a limited involvement in a TV series. I seven course meal would be nice but I can deal with some appetizers and a beer.

IMMORTAL | September 12, 23:12 CET

I thought Dark Angel had been renewed for a third season and then was cancelled a few days after being renewed by Berman, who was a producer on Firefly anyway, so Firefly could air. Fox could only afford one expensive sci fi show or something like that.

Jackal | September 13, 00:01 CET

Dark Angel's ratings were not good enough to justify its cost, plain and simple. It wasn't specifically to pick up Firefly, it was that they could fund two or three other shows with its budget.

"Dark Angel was a very tough one," Berman said. "It was a show that we liked and (whose) creators we admire. We felt in the end that we would go with some new programming there ... but I must say it was a tough decision."

zeitgeist | September 13, 00:21 CET

Wait, I think you're on to something here. Just think of it: The Joss Network.

AnotherFireflyfan | September 13, 00:51 CET

The Joss Network? I'd watch it.

Unfortunately I haven't seen Serenity yet, so i'll offer my opinions on whether Joss' work transtlates better on TV then film when I have. But regardless on whether his work in films is better, he was still a bloody amazing TV writer/director/producer, whose work will probably stay with me for the rest of my life.

Apocalypse | September 13, 01:01 CET

Dear world: give this man enough power to work on his own terms. Thank you.

Craig Oxbrow | September 13, 01:42 CET

The Joss Network. All Joss All The Time. Hmm...I like it!

Hey wait a minute...isn't that what we all are? ;)

Willowy | September 13, 02:07 CET

The New York Times had an article today about how Showtime hopes to rival HBO with original programming to boost their subscriptions, which made me think that Showtime and a Joss Whedon show would be a perfect match right now. Showtime would probably give Joss enough independence and a guarantee of a certain amount of shows and launching a Whedon show would certainly bring a respectable amount of new subscribers to Showtime. I wish, I wish, I wish...

Wendy | September 13, 03:18 CET

A spin off of Firefly? Kick Ass! Saffron? Badger? More kids the Allicance fXXXed up? I like it.

So, getting off the subject...I was in church on Sunday, and rather than listening to the sermon, I was writing in my head some special movies made for TV/DVD: Spike, Giles, Faith, Willow. They were good movies with lots of drama and humor. This is my dream that I think about all the time. I want these movies to happen...real bad, and if God exists then she obviously wants these movies to happen too.

Harmalicious | September 13, 03:40 CET

I think that he means what he says about not coming back unless on his own terms, but given the reality of Hollywood (where since the product costs so much to produce, artistic merits are subservient to the commercial interests) this'll never happen. I also think that if lightning and inspiration strike him just right someday, he'll be back with a TV series. I've always seen him as something of a creator who was driven by his vision -- and if he gets the perfect idea for a TV show, he'll be forced to pursue it.

Just like a movie off of a cancelled TV show wouldn't be the smartest first movie to make, and still he couldn't let Firefly go. In terms of his career and just practicality, he should have mourned the show and moved on. He probably could have taken X3 if not for Serenity, but it's like he needed to get the rest of the story out, and couldn't let it rest until he found closure for the story. I trust in his sense of the story.

I'm quite curious about his next creative movies, be they movie or comic. I think he does fabulously on TV, but his movies could be utterly perfect. Just like some of his TV episodes are utterly perfect -- like "The Body" relies on character continuity and such, but it in itself is a perfectly contained work of art.

dottikin | September 13, 10:26 CET