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October 27 2005

Slaying Straight To DVD? According to Marti Noxon, there are serious discussions for straight to video Buffyverse adventures (via Chud).

"There are serious discussions going on about bringing some of the characters back and making a few movies that will go straight to DVD"


Not exactly the confirmation I was hoping for.
I like the direct-to-DVD idea. Sure, I have to pay for these movies instead of them just airing on TV, but I imagine I would've bought them anyway if they turn out to be good. I like that there'll be more creative freedom and that all the extras will be there once I'm done watching. Really hope the continuation of the Buffyverse happens this way.

I'm way more of a fan of it continuing in direct-to-DVD movie format than I am of getting into another full length series. Second to DVD movies, a mini-series would be fine too (although I bet they'd air one of those instead of putting it out on DVD first).

It would've been cool if BtVS and Angel had gotten some in-between-the-episodes-or-seasons TV movies like Babylon 5 did, but after one's conclusion and the other's cancellation is a welcome time to do them too.
I wouldn't hestitate to pre-order a straight to DVD of any part of the Buffyverse (by which I include Ats). Even if the main character was Dawn, I would totally want to see it. Riley might give me pause, but I'd probably still have to get it.
I'll totally buy it. Why not? If you can't afford it then theres no worries cause a cable channel(TNT?) is most likely to buy cable rights for it. I've seen DTV movies aired on cable. Hell Sci-Fi channel does that all the time.
Heh, I completely agree with embers there.
I will take my Buffyverse any which way I can get it. You'll hear no complaining from me.
I've changed the link to the SciFi interview with Marti which gives more details.
Or you can always rent from Netflix or somewhere. I'm especially intrigued b/c it gives the fans a quantifiable way of voting with their money. TV ratings just feel so randomized, while buying a DVD is a definite way to get tell the studio you like their product. I just really hope they sell well.
I have to say thats the first time I've seen David Boreanaz mentioned in connection with a Buffyverse sequel. Does Marti know something we don't?
The last thing I read about David and the Angelverse was that he was only willing to re-visit Angel in a full length movie. I assume that means the big screen, unless he's willing to budge a little and spend his summer vacation filming with Tim or Joss...
I was thinking the same thing, Simon. At the end of "Angel", it seemed as though he was anxious to move on to something new.

In any case, I really hope that this pans out.
Me too, it's got me buzzing. And a mention of Drew as well? Lovely stuff.
Gasp! My heart couldn't take it if this isn't true! I beg of the PTB, please make it happen.
Direct-to-DVD may also give Joss/Tim/Drew (and whoever) the opportunity to tell those darker or more risque stories that are difficult to get onto TV screens due to censorship or even sponsor concerns.

Sad to see that Marti thinks Willow is unlikely to be one of the characters in the movies but glad to see Angel is a possibility (if Marti's correct, of course!) Not at all surprised that Buffy is unlikely, given SMG's very consistent comments about any continuation, but still sad. I still hold hope that one day .....
Well Joss has said that Willow is a possibility and Marti says she isn't. So that's still 50/50.

So Spike and Illyria. Maybe Giles? Possibly Faith? Xander? Andrew? Random newbie Slayers? Lorne?
My top choices: Xander, Spike, Faith, Illyria and Giles. I'm actually OK with the reality that Buffy and Willow are off the table for now -- they both have been the focus of many storylines, and I'd love to see the other characters shine for a while.

[ edited by dottikin on 2005-10-27 09:25 ]
Sign me up for a big woo-hoo! I'm definately in the "I'll take any 'verse-related shenanigans" camp. A hard-hitting documentary on how all that stake whittling is damaging the tree population? I'll take it! Graham fighting the good fight? Hmm. But preferably some Faith and Illyria.
What about some Devon-centric stuff? Never mind .....
I still hold with the idea that Sarah could be tempted back with the promise of a big screen adventure, assuming the script was good enough and the money offered was sufficient. Her post-Buffy career will go one of two ways. Either she will become the A-list movie star she deserves to be, in which case she will no longer need to fear being typecast and therefore be more willing to come back to Buffy if Joss asked her, or her career will go south, in which case she will absolutely need a Buffy movie to get her back into the spotlight. Personally i'm hoping for scenario one, because that works out well for everyone! Hey, i want to see a Buffy movie and i'm an optimist! Sue me! :)

As for the straight to DVD movies, fine by me. I'd much rather pay out a little for them than not see them happen at all. Plus, as has already been said, this method may allow Joss a little more creative freedom with the stories he chooses to tell.
Bring back the Cheese Man!
Plus we never did get to the bottom of the Ben-is-Glory conundrum.
Straight to DVD sounds great, it's probably the best way to go for Buffyverse. Maybe, if it becomes a very big success, we might tempt them to get us a straight to DVD show aswell eventually.
Wait, Poster Boy, are you saying Ben is Glory?

Sorry ......
I love the idea, would buy it in a second. I really hope if it happens that it is Spike centered.

It would be an interesting and innovative way to continue a show. Ground breaking really.

I am surprised that Marti mentioned David as a possibility. Angel can't be considered a "minor character" in the slightest and I think he has been pretty clear about wanting to disassociate from Angel for a while at least.

There has already been Five Seasons focused on Angel. Hardly a minor character.
Bring back the Big Gulp Monster!
Continued fan interest in a big-budget Buffy film has led creator Joss Whedon to consider a series of movies that would focus on some of the secondary characters, she added.

And the logic is that this will lead to the big-budget Buffy film we are waiting for?

I am also wondering who those minor characters could be.

I do like the idea. In this way complex longer running arclines are possible and might be built up to a big budget movie.

[ edited by Koos on 2005-10-27 11:34 ]
Doing a series of Direct to DVD films is a business model that somebody needs to try out. The Whedonverse is probably the best vehicle from both the business and creative points of view that you could choose to do that.

By the time such a movie was made "Direct to Download" might also be a possibility, if someone figures out how to make the financial side work.
The whole ‘direct to DVD’ thinking in the industry is changing. Slowly this is no longer the kiss of death ‘direct to video’ used to be, but a serious business proposition which is looked at by all the major players. Two major trends worth noting:

1. Franchising:

With the DVD business now maturing, Hollywood studios are looking to the nontheatrical and direct-to-video arenas to boost the bottom line. Indeed, the latest studio estimates are that only 35% of the DVD business comes from new feature films, putting the onus on home video executives to feed their own kitty instead of just drafting off their theatrical divisions.

20th Century Fox Home Entertainment president Mike Dunn noted that one of Fox's biggest pushes is to create TV-DVD franchises like its enormously successful "Family Guy," which has just spun off a direct-to-video feature film, "Stewie Griffin: The Untold Story," with an initial shipment of 1.2 million units.

"There's a built-in fan base, and what we're trying to do is take a recognizable title and go after the core audience," said Kevin Kasha, senior vp acquisitions and programming at New Line. "Right now, there's a lot of competition in the marketplace for shelf space, and going after sequels and other franchise or branded programming is really the only way you can generate enough noise and use your marketing dollars to get the shelf space you need."

"Franchising always has been important, but it's more important now," Lions Gate Entertainment president Steve Beeks said.
(excerpts from Reuters article)

2. DVD Premiere (note, it is no longer called ‘direct to video’):

Underscoring the growing importance of DVD premiere releases, Paramount Home Entertainment has created a new department devoted to creating and releasing six to eight DVD movies a year, the company said Friday. […]

"We have seen first-hand the tremendous consumer response to original, quality home entertainment content and recognize the great growth potential of this business," said Paramount Pictures Worldwide Home Entertainment president Thomas Lesinski.


So the chances of something happening in the verse look pretty good to me. Nor should we consider this as a second rate solution, quite on the contrary. Personally, I start jumping for joy when we are not talking about one-off films but a whole series, but I take what I can in the meantime.
Heck, I'd watch Andrew: Slayer of Vampyres. Or Robin and Mr Gordo: the Untold Story. As long as Joss gives it to us, I'll buy!

Ben and Glory? What is this?
If I could choose, I'd love to see an Illyria movie. Xander, Willow, Faith and Giles are also high on my "yes, please" list. Spike seems most likely to happen, but he wouldn't be on the top of my list. Don't get me wrong, JM rocks, but we've seen a LOT of Spike already. Time for someone else, I'd say. But that's just me. And besides, if there's a Spike direct-to-DVD movie I'm pretty much there anyway.
I've no problem with direct-to-DVD.

Hell, I own all three of the Tremors sequels, and I'm pretty damn sure that anything Buffyverse will be a lot better than any of those.
Sounds good to me. I'd buy all of it in a heartbeat.
Hell, I own all three of the Tremors sequels, and I'm pretty damn sure that anything Buffyverse will be a lot better than any of those.


Ah, yes, but with that logic, shouldn't you buy almost every DVD that hits stores? ;-)

(for the record - I have never seen Tremors, but I always thought the movies looked dreadfully lame :-p)
I'll buy it, just get on with it and make it, the wait is killing us!
Either she [SMG] will become the A-list movie star she deserves to be (...) or her career will go south (...)


Mmmh, it seems like it's the second case that is happening...

(ok, this one was easy ;) )
Sigh. Time to build another bookcase for my Whedonverse DVDs.
I'll join in the general rejoicing but there are people out there who can't afford to buy, and I'm sorry they will be losing out.
I actually wonder HOW much Marti knows. Every other day I get something about it's on, it's not on.

I'm at the point where I'll buy it when I see it (and I'll definitely buy it, especially if it's Spike)
Spike. Illyria. And, I hear, Wesley.

Confused? You bet ya.
It is a shame that there will be some fans who can't afford to buy the DVDs and will therefore either miss out on the movies or be forced to wait until they are finally broadcast on television at some point. However, the same argument could be made against series being broadcast on digital or cable channels.

For example, here in the UK Angel season five has, so far, only been shown on Sky One, a digital channel, and there are currently no plans, as far as i'm aware, for any of the free terrestrial channels to show it. Basically, if you don't pay for certain series then you don't see them, at least not any time soon.

This straight to DVD idea is very much the same thing, although in my opinion this is slightly fairer. In this case you pay a single price for the specific item you want, rather than having to pay for multiple channels just to watch one or two decent television series, which is the case with Sky. Again, it's not fair to those who simply cannot afford to pay for the DVDs but it's not a million miles away from what has been going on for years anyway.
Yeah, I'll pretty much subscribe to DVD Premiere. I can see Xander, Oz, and Riley, sitting around the bar in Willy's Place. Where everybody knows your name.

And as Spike once said, if you want fun, there's Ben, and there's Glory, and sod all else.
The only slightly confusing aspect I'd say is that The WB wanted to pick these up last year, from what I recall.

That said, 20th Century Fox will know they will get a LOT of fans who buy these.
This is one of those "I'll believe it when I see it" routines for me. I think that creative people in television are always talking about a million projects, keeping lots of possible lines of development open, but not knowing when or if any of them will ever come to fruition. While I would likely buy any DVD that comes out of this, I don't have a lot of interest in the Angelverse, since the show never had the resonance for me that Buffy did. And the one character I would love to see is not likely to be developed- Willow. Though I think that Alyson Hannigan would do such a movie is Joss asked her, since he always has said he loves her, and she feels that she owes him a lot. And if somehow Wesley could be involved, so that Alexis got to work with Aly, that would be a big selling point. I still think the likeliest movie would be Spike, though I also think that Faith and Ilyria are good culprits for development. If Andrew, I would not watch, since I really dislike the character.
Oh, Gossi, you actually heard Wesley mentioned? Because he is actually the one of whom I'm dreaming (I previously mentioned my least interesting characters, but Wesley is the one I want the most). The way I see it, Wesley's Father dabbled as a necromancer (that is where young Wes got the books for raising the bird from the dead) and decides to create Zombie Wesley to be the dutiful son he had always really wanted.
Then Illyria will come and kick his ass.
Hey....as long as it is Spike...I'll buy it. I have every other Spike DVD so whats another? I would have taped the movie and rewatched it until the DVD came out anyway...so no problem.
Devin is the first person to suggest direct to DVD to Joss? Our Master has forsaken us! I've seen fans mention it, I believe right here on Whedonesque, a number of times.

I would totally buy Buffyverse DVDs!!!

Wait, Glory is Ben?
Heh, embers, I'd watch that movie ;-).

But yes, I agree, a Wesley movie would be great to have!

This Glory/Ben thing is getting old. All of us know they are two completely seperate people.
I'd preorder any Whedonverse straight-to-DVD with a giant smile on my face. Bring 'em on, please!
I just hope they don't bring back Angel. I liked the ending of the show, and so I hope at least Mr. Broodypants stays... unknown. I would love to see Illyria back, though, and Spike wouldn't be too bad either. I'd personally like to see Illyria, Xander, and Wesley team up.
I have only one thing to say to misskittysmom...that one was painful. (groan and LOL)

Straight to DVD is fine. Straight to TV is fine. Straight to a movie theater is fine. The important thing is straight into production. C'mon Joss, WW and Goners sound like great projects and we will all watch them, but let's get the slayerverse cooking again!

Hey, did anyone ever notice that Ben and Glory actually do look a lot alike? However silly some of the rumors may seem, there really could be a connection.
I still hold with the idea that Sarah could be tempted back with the promise of a big screen adventure, assuming the script was good enough and the money offered was sufficient.

Well, I read in a recent interview Mr. Gellar said she was not interested at all in returning to the role in movie form, since the first movie did poorly. His rationale didn't really hold water, but he's married to her and not me, so I figure he knows better where she's headed or not.

And Marti says that a movie around DB would do very well, she doesn't say that there's any possibility of it!(Then again, I think DB said he was only interested in movies when he thought that's where his career was headed. Now that he's back on tv, he may be more open to an Angel small-screen visit) And also, I think Joss is closer to Aly than Marti, so he'd probably know better if she'd be willing. However, Joss never said she'd be a shoe-in, he just said he'd use her if he could. I think the only actor we know is on-board is James. And well, Amy, but I think her involvement is less in stone. Or quite possibly, just less publicized than James'.

Well, whatever happens, I hope it happens fast and involves James, because I know he's got an expiration date!
... there are people out there who can't afford to buy, and I'm sorry they will be losing out.

Well, there's Netflix or the public library. I'm not sure if the Whedonverse Project will still be around to help libraries get them.
Haha, thank you whedonesquers. You guys always have the ability to make me laugh out loud in public and embarrass myself in a good way. :)
Apart from the first two seasons of Buffy, my whole Joss Whedon experience has been from DVD. I agree with Vampire With A Gun, genre shows (especially) do not benefit from TV distribution channels of today wich are expensive and inflexible.

With the DVD format I can watch as many times as I like, I can lend them out, or give them away, or arrange group viewings. I get commentaries, which I am now addicted to, and other extra material. Not to mention looking with satisfaction at my special bookshelves full of "pretty friends".

( Please do not judge me, I live deep in the woods, with bad reception, and far from theaters. I could be a lot weirder.)
I would totally buy a straight to DVD movie.
Yeah, i read that interview with FPJr as well, Rogue Slayer. I tend to not take anything he says about Sarah's career choices too seriously. He has been known to speak for her before and state things that Sarah herself may not necessarily agree with.

Besides, i tend to think Sarah is bright emough to realise that comparing how the original Buffy movie did to how a new one featuring herself and the rest of the cast of the very successful television series would do is a little pointless. The first movie was not only dreadful but a totally unknown commodity when it was released. A new one would benefit from not only having Joss firmly behind the wheel but also from a fanbase that, i would imagine, would double, if not triple that which was there to support Serenity. I certainly know a hell of a lot more people who would rush to see Buffy the Movie than i do those who wanted to go see a movie based on Firefly, simply because Buffy is a much more recognisable series.

I don't know, maybe i'm just being too hopeful here but i honestly do think that a Buffy movie will happen.
Concerns about those folks who can't afford the DVD...really not an issue. If they're unable to rent it from the video store (c'mon, rent...nearly everyone has $3 to $5 laying around for a rental during one week of the month or another), the fandom is a friendly enough place that people will provide DVDs for eachother (either as a gift or with a pay-back-when-you-can understanding). Or the DVD will be burned for people who can't afford...which I'm not usually a big fan of, especially when direct-to-DVD sequels would be put at risk with that sorta thing going on a lot...but it'll happen. And I'd put my money where my mouth is and buy a copy for as many people in need as I could (although I could be the one in need of renting/begging for a copy, who knows how stable finances'll be by the time this thing makes it out), or at least lend my one copy out.

I'm in the camp that hopes the Boreanaz possibility is a strong one. If I could pick my ideal choice for a TV movie, I want Angel Season 6, even if Joss has to cut away all the trimmings and stuff the meat of the story into a two hour film (although it'd be cool if Joss took a risk and banked on the first DVD selling well enough that we'd get more. Then he could stretch the Season 6 storyline over two or three DVD films and it wouldn't have to be as compressed). I hope whichever actors whose characters he was planning on featuring in the final season are able/willing to return.

Unless Wesley was definitely supposed to come back in Season 6 (after Angel had been cancelled but there was still the slim hope, maybe even in Joss' mind, of it being saved), I don't want him resurrected. The Buffyverse has used up its chances in that regard, I hope. Yeah, I know his death date was moved up, that Joss had planned to kill him off but not until some time in Season 6 apparently...but still, it's done, he had a good end. Since Joss was planning to have him dead by the end anyway, what's he gonna do, kill Wes again at the end of the movie(s) ?
I have largely avoided giving any real thought to the various rumours over the last couple of years about possible big-budget films, TV films, straight-to-DVD films, etc. As soon as one thing has been said it seems to be contradicted by another statement. However, the news starting to emerge now would appear to be a lot more hopeful, although I don't think there is anything here to say that it is definitely guaranteed. When the funding has been made available, the contracts have been signed and the scripts have been written - maybe then... Mind you, I never thought I'd see a new Kate Bush album, so what do I know?

As to the chances of a full-blown Buffy movie, I can't see it ever happening, at least not in the foreseeble future with the existing cast.

As a side point, Le Comite, I'm not sure I would agree that Gellar's career is going south, although I do agree she isn't (and probably never will be) part of the so-called 'A-List' (whatever that actually is). I'm not being funny or trying to start a row. I'm just not convinced the evidence supports this contention. It seems to be quite a common assumption that her career is floundering and I've always been curious to find out where that comes from.

(ETA: Ignore this last paragraph. All has been explained to me further down... I really do need to work on that sense of humour. Actually, I think I need to buy myself a brain first. I wonder if my local supermarket stocks them?)

(Edited again to correct a spelling fiasco. Yep, definitely need to get that brain...

[ edited by dashboardprophet on 2005-10-27 17:42 ]

[ edited by dashboardprophet on 2005-10-27 17:44 ]
Haha, thank you whedonesquers. You guys always have the ability to make me laugh out loud in public and embarrass myself in a good way. :)


You said it, Mort! You guys are always getting me into trouble! What's this whole Ben & Glory thing?
Dashboardprophet, i could be wrong but i had assumed that Le Comite was referencing the fact that Sarah's latest movie is Southland Tales, rather than commenting on the actual state of her career. At least that was the way i had taken it anyway.
dbp, I think Le Com was enaging in a jeu des mots what with "going south" and Southland Tales, and the winking grinning emoticon-thingy. And the fact that SMG is clearly doing pretty well for herself in lining up interesting roles.

Not that I'm trying to end a row or anything . . . ;)

(ETA: Ah, beaten to the punch. Reflexes not what they were. Time to hang up the gun and find greener pastures methinks.)
Vampire With A Gun and SNT: Thank you both. I am sure you are right. I think I need to work on that sense of humour... I seem to be lacking one at the moment. Sorry guys!
Hehe, sorry about that, SNT. Looks like we were both thinking along the same lines with regard to ending a misunderstanding before it began. :)
Direct to DVD has already been used by Disney to extend their blockbuster kids' titles and since they keep doing it, I'm pretty sure Disney has found it profitable. Don't know any figures, but it stands to reason -- it's a niche market with a proven core fanbase (kids and/or their desperate parents). Your kids loved The Lion King? Great, the parents will snap up all the direct-to-dvd titles in that line without a moment's hesitation. Disney saves money on promotion, etc., and keeps the *kaff* lion's share of the profits.

It may never be as prestigious as a theatrical run, but direct to dvd has already become a more efficient way for studios to make money. 20th Century Fox might want to blow off the WB (and who would blame them?) and use Joss to spearhead a fresh campaign into this market. I say, go Joss go!
Why couldn't a direct-to-DVD film (or series of films) land on regular old TV eventually? I find it hard to believe that anything Buffy related could be kept off television.
Good news! I am VERY surprised to see DB mentined but having Willow ruled out?
Isn't she the godmother of Whedon Jr??

Oh, well. Any new Buffy/Angel movies is cool with me. I guess that since Firefly did well on DVD it would be a good selling point.
OMFG, is there a new Kate Bush album? I have not heard this, but she is a major, major love of mine, as OT as this comment is. Please, let me know if this is so- Dana5140@aol.com
As long as Spike is in the lead i'd buy it ,whichever medium it comes on.
My heart really can't take much more of this. There will probably be constant speculation for years and years, but whenever someone from Mutant Enemy or one of the actors dangles the proverbial carrot in front of us, it get my hopes up so much.

I hope there is truth in it, of course, and I will watch any continuation of the Buffyverse in any format, whether it's a movie, straight to DVD movie, TV series, mini-series, even a radio show, if it's being made then I'm there.

Really, I'm sure that even if Sarah and David don't want to do it right now, but there are a wealth of other actors who have been involved in the verse who would willingly reprise their roles, and even others who could be involved and don't know it yet, like slayers from the past who could do a Tales of the Slayers miniseries or something (this is one of the things I would love to see).

And there is also so much writing talent apart from Joss, any of the long time Buffy or Angel writers could do a great job, so all we need is some sort of definitive form of distribution and interest from some TV exec in the idea and we should get something.
"I'm not sure if the Whedonverse Project will still be around to help libraries get them."
WHAT?! :(

And on to the news:
*small voice* Maybe the direct-to-DVD thing could work for future adventures with our favorite space cowboys?
And I'd take anything new from the Buffy/Angelverse...
There's no telling if this'll turn out to be anything real, but direct to DVD seems like it could work pretty well. There'd be less censorhip to worry about, so creativly they could do a lot with it... Personally I'd be happiest with an entirely new Mutant Enemy series with a new cast and premise. It could feature certain characters from the first shows sometimes if they decided to to go that way. To be honest I care more about the creators than I do most of the characters, so I'd just like to see them make something together again.

[ edited by NekoDono on 2005-10-27 20:32 ]
I prefer Direct To DVD more than Tv Movies.
With DVDs we can get a better budget, I think.

My choices:
A really dark Illyria, Ripper and Faith story.
Just them.

[ edited by Angel TheVampire on 2005-10-27 20:41 ]
Anything!!! I'll buy anything!!
Dashboardprophet, i could be wrong but i had assumed that Le Comite was referencing the fact that Sarah's latest movie is Southland Tales, rather than commenting on the actual state of her career. At least that was the way i had taken it anyway.


Yes, I was, of course.

Besides, going from scooby doo to a movie by richard kelly, this is heading way north... no doubt about that! ;)
Thanks, Le Comite, and once again my apologies for my previous (rather ludicrous) misinterpretaion of your meaning.
"I'm not sure if the Whedonverse Project will still be around to help libraries get them."
WHAT?! :(

The Project has 8 libraries on its waiting list, but it is no longer accepting new requests due to fundraising shortfalls. While it plans to stick around long enough to fulfill those requests, its uncertain at this point if it will continue once the donations to those libraries are completed.
No apologies to be given since no offence was taken, dhb.

In fact, I was being a bit provocative, playing upon words this way (since I know that SMG's career is sometimes a "touchy" subject).

As a matter of fact, I have never truly appreciated SMG in Buffy (I have always be way more interested by all the other characters of the show - I even used to say that BTVS is the only show that is interesting because of its "other" characters and not the hero/heroin of the show). And when I saw that she was heading to the big screen with movies like Scooby doo (or even The Grudge - a remake of a kind of movies I really don't like much), I must admit that my idea of her qualities was not very gentle.

But, having heard about this movie from Kelly (who made Donnie Darko !!!), I must say that my overall opinion of SMG could change.

Anyhow, my post was only a play upon words (which was too easy, you helped me too much with your first post, dhb ;) ).
I have never truly appreciated SMG in Buffy


Well, now you're using fightin' words . . . No, I have no intention of revisiting this debate, one which periodically consumes many hours of our time here. (But to take up just one point: how is it that the less-than-glowing movie choices of other BtVS/AtS cast members don't factor into the equation?) Just wanted to throw down my marker indicating that my opinion is the exact opposite of yours here. :)
I don't think Valentine is exactly critically acclaimed. Nor Winding Roads or House On Haunted Hill. And how about that Pinanta Island. Did I mention Darkness Falls? :)

I think SMG gets called on her choices more because she's higher up on the hollywood totem pole and seems the most unwilling to reprise Buffy.

[ edited by eddy on 2005-10-27 22:27 ]
Just wanted to throw down my marker indicating that my opinion is the exact opposite of yours here. :)


But I am fully respecting other's points of view on this subject (and, as a matter of fact, on as many subjects as possible).

And just to add another little rock in the pond (anyhow, I am leaving tomorrow for two days, so I won't be able to see the riddles ;) ): I have always considered that the real strenghts of BTVS and AtS were behind the camera, not before. This doesn't mean that there was no strenght before the camera, but that these strenght were able to express thanks to the strenght behind.

(I have always liked to play with water...)


EDIT: besides, as I said, I am always ready to be proved wrong, and Kelly's movie might be such a proof.

[ edited by Le Comité on 2005-10-27 23:09 ]
I think "DVD Premier", as opposed to "Direct To Video", could be great. No network censorship, no advertisers sensibilities to worry about (Bring back the Doublemeat Palace!), no 'edit stuff out to get it to exactly forty one minutes thirty seconds' crap and so on. Plus a worldwide DVD launch would be far easier to defeat the pirates as I'm sure many people now buy fake DVDs not to save a couple of dollars but to avoid waiting six months for the real thing.

The only downside is the DTV image. Someone mentioned Disney, and they're the worst! Most of their DTV sequels are far inferior rip offs of the original.

But if a studio is looking for a franchise to launch DVD Premier as a high quality product then the Buffyverse could be the ideal candidate. As long as The Man himself is in charge and has the money and freedom to do what he wants then the result could be fantastic.
while this has been said many many times, i would buy any Buffyverse DVD movie, for sure. I am in the non "main" character camp though. I would love to see some of the supporting characters more than Buffy, Willow, Angel, and Spike. They all had tons to do over the years, and i think that other characters deserve a chance in the spotlight (though that doesn't mean that i wouldn't want mentions of the main 4 there, just to see what they are up to)
Xander, Giles, Illyria, Andrew, Dawn, Lorne, and perhaps Connor, those are the ones that come to mind. Yes, Dawn is there. Throughout all of S7 of BtVS i think that Dawnn became a good character, and it has been years since we saw her last. Who knows what has happened and what could have happened. Wesley sure changed a lot in the 3 years from S3 of BtVS to S3 of Angel, so who knows, Dawn could be some kickass not-quite-slayer by now, she would also be nearly 20. That is one thing i wonder about the DVD movies, i wonder when they would take place.
Would there be a BtVS movie that takes place while S5 of Angel was going on, that would be cool, or would it just pick up a few years after we saw the Scoobies last, cause A LOT can happen in a few years.
I would like to see a movie that takes place post-Not Fade Away that involves BtVS characters moreso than Angel ones, as it has been so long since we saw them, though Lorne can make an appearance:)
There is really so much that they could do and anything would do. The one thing i would LOVE right now is an official announcement that it will happen. They don't have to give specifics about all the characters in it, or who is going to write and direct, just some announcement from Joss saying "Yes, we are going to do one in the next 1-2years, for sure" that would be lovely.
I think you're absolutely right, eddy. And, frankly, every single working actor has good, sometimes great roles, and roles taken for other, perfectly acceptable, reasons.

Le Comite, well said. I've been known to be proved wrong in the past. Once or twice . . .

All I care about with straight-to-DVD (or any other continuation) is that Joss be at least a little involved so that the quality (nay, the legacy) be maintained. I'm not one to say that I'll buy a continuation of the 'verse whatever it looks like - but if the writing and production quality is there, I'll buy it irrespective of the actors taking part.
'The Grudge' (US) opened just over a year ago (1 year, 1 week). It took a HUGE amount of money, and was an absolute box office smash. It was a very, very wise career move for Sarah - I doubt she got that much money for it (in a Hollywood scale) but it really has raised her profile.

I'm pretty sure Joss will break the story for these projects with the related writers (and in some cases, directors). Tim has the Spike project, should it happen.

Until something is officially signed and the projects greenlit, there's no point getting hopes up. However, given nearly all the pinned actors have TV shows on the air at the moment, if they were looking to film it'd either be from this coming April/May time, or next April/May.
how is it that the less-than-glowing movie choices of other BtVS/AtS cast members don't factor into the equation?


Yeah, thanks for reminding me of Wicked Prayer, SNT ;)
I've not seen Wicked Prayer yet. The publicity photos are forever burned into my brain. David Boreanaz in fish net clothing. Ah. Tara Reid. Ah.
Yet?!?! Don't do it, gossi, its not worth it.
I love bad movies, zeitgeist. I actually got "Alone in the Dark" the other day because I noticed it had 0 positive critic reviews. It's brilliant.
I think SMG gets called on her choices more because she's higher up on the hollywood totem pole and seems the most unwilling to reprise Buffy.


DB seems to be equally unwilling and could be said to more so than SMG due to his "Big Screen" comment whereas SMG has only said "good script" and not where it shown.

Personally I think they are both at the same point ,wanting to cast off typecasting by staying away from their roles for the time being at least

Gossi , SMG is suppossed to have gotten $600,000 upfront for The Grudge according to IIRC Entertainment Weekly and she said in an interview she might have taken a loss (living in Japan etc) on that upfront figure but that the money wasn't her only consideration taking the role.
Exactly, garda39. It was a profile raising option, and it paid off.
"Fish Net Clothing?" DB wears an actual fish net? I must see this. As for Buffyverse DVDs, I would rather see more of the supporting characters, since there are so many, and so rich with potential, too. So, I'd buy. Or rent.

OT: Dana5140, and anyone else who is interested, Kate Bush is indeed back, and details may be found here.

[ edited by The Devil's Robot on 2005-10-28 00:20 ]

[ edited by The Devil's Robot on 2005-10-28 00:22 ]
I think Alyson would still be open to a Willow role. She agreed to appear again in Veronica Mars which is a small (ratings wise) show on a "netlet". Being part of a big franchise movie even if on DVD doesn't hurt her and she originally did not want Buffy to end. So I am guessing and also hoping of course, that she would sign on.
What about Oz? In many way's he's still the biggest question mark in the Buffyverse. He's so taciturn, and we have no idea where he went after he found out Willow was gay.
I want a movie about April, dammit! Shonda Farr nailed that role.

Or, of course, Faith, Wes, Ilyria, Dawn, Andrew, Clem or D'Hoffryn.
I was such an April fan, too. I would have been so disappointed if Britney Spears had have played that part. Look at her abysmal acting career so far. Look at how underwhelming and awkward Ashanti was. Singers are not actresses, despite almost every celebrity these days working in every part of the entertainment biz.

I think the role in itself was perfectly good, but that the actress really took it much further and managed to make a very interesting and sympathetic character out of it. I was always hoping that Willow would rewire April and make her one of the gang. What did Buffy do with her anyway?

But, just to touch upon the points earlier, I just think that all three Mutant Enemy productions have been immense, stunning examples of talent in every aspect. The quality of the writing is of course fantastic, and I really believe that the strong actors really contributed a lot to that. It wasn't that the writing was better than the performances or anything, it's simply a co-dependant relationship between the two, and the bar was constantly being lifted by everyone.

Then you have the immense talent of the directors, producers, set and prop designers, costumer designers, special effects team, editing, music, stunt people, everything. The whole final package has just become part of TV history, and deservedly so. Joss is a genius, but his vision was supported and carried out by hundreds of other people, and thus is the product of a collaboration, and something of which they should all be proud.
D'Hoffryn! Yes! He ruled!
I would have loved Willow to have re programmed April. I think as a character she could have been great, learning to be 'human', trying to fit in with the gang, trying to become an individual. The problem being it would just be too close to Anya and her story to have them both around at the same time. And even with Anya gone it might be felt that April would repeat many of the stories.

Still, could be cool trying to give her Asimovs Three Rules Of Robotics, but with the addendum that it's really good to kill demons. Unless they're blonde and cockney. Or have a soul. Or Clem.
I love bad movies, zeitgeist.


I love bad flicks, too, but this one made me cringe instead of laughing.
I'm sneaking back, hoping not to put my foot in it again!

SMG is normally quite guarded with her comments. However, I think we'd all agree she has, in her own non-committal way, made it clear she has no real interest in reprising the Buffy role, whatever medium it happens to be in. I suspect most people accept that to be the case now and I don't think it's dependent on the success or otherwise of her film career to come.

Oddly enough, I don't think the box office success of 'The Grudge' has made a great deal of difference to her profile or bargaining power. However, it was definitely a canny choice on her part. Her various announced forthcoming projects seem to suggest she is taking a very specific route - quirky, small budget films. Maybe she feels she has more potential and more options available as a big fish in a little pond. As things stand at the moment, I wouldn't think she is in a position to compete with the likes of Naomi Watts (as an example).

As to David Boreanaz, he did make comments immediately after the end of 'Angel', but by all accounts being the lead in a weekly one-hour show is bloody hard graft, so maybe he was just feeling a little tired and emotional. People do change their minds. I can't bring to mind any interviews in which Alyson Hannigan has made specific reference to wanting to reprise the Willow role, but no doubt if there are any I will be put right on this. I don't pay a huge amount of attention to these things, to be honest.

While I doubt Marti Noxon is in constant contact with all these people, she does, presumably, have some access to them, affording her a degree of insider knowledge. I guess she has just put her own spin on what she thinks could happen based on what she knows, in answer to a question that gets trotted out time and time again.

In another thread current at the moment, James Marsters is quoted as suggesting (in an interview with People - apparently conducted on 24 October) that the prospect of a Spike movie is a remote one. At the moment everything still seems to be no more than vague talk about what might be possible, rather than any firm plans or commitments to a project.

Still, 'Dr Who' eventually found its way back to our screens after countless years of rumour, speculation and disappointment, and did so with spectacular success.

[ edited by dashboardprophet on 2005-10-28 07:09 ]
What drives actors is this: money. What drives most people: money. Sorry, it just is.

Fox pay much better than The WB. David was doing low budget indy movies after Angel. Fox offered him bucket loads of cash. He took it.
Giles and Andrew would be classic to say the least.
I want to see a movie about DHoffryn shopping at Abercrombie and Fitch. And a DHoffryn backstory would be good. Hell, I can think of so many ideas for the minor characters. It's a fun world to play in.
"It wasn't that the writing was better than the performances or anything, it's simply a co-dependant relationship between the two, and the bar was constantly being lifted by everyone. Joss is a genius, but his vision was supported and carried out by hundreds of other people, and thus is the product of a collaboration, and something of which they should all be proud."

Razor, this was beautiful. Thanks for taking me down memory lane. Oh, Marti, how you toy with us. OK, here we go; Illyria, Spike, and Faith with a splash of Andrew and reoccurring pop ins and outs of other characters....come on, who's with me?

ETA; Ha! DHoffyrin at A and F; you kill me, electricspacegirl!

[ edited by Harmalicious on 2005-10-28 05:24 ]
On the DVD premiere route, I'll take pretty much anything Joss & Co. dish up so long as it's made with smarts and thrills and lots of goopy love for the characters. If DB was willing, I'd dig seeing what Angel's up to, as well as checking in with Illyria, Spike, and yes, if they can figure out a plausible way to do it (pocket universe loophole?), Wesley. I won't hold my breath for Buffy, but she (and/or Willow) would also be more than welcome additions to any Slayerverse project.

NFA was brilliant and a perfectly satisfactory ending for me on one level; on another, I continue to find myself wondering what happened after the alleyway confrontation. I'm also still totally captivated by the smatterings of S6's proposed post-apocalyptic storyline I've read. What I wouldn't give to see that tale played out over a series of shiny disks! (The FF/Serenity storyline continuation is yet another line of thought, and an enticing one at that....)

And truly, if the Great Kate is putting out a new album, there's hope for miracles in all kinds of unexpected places :)
Straight to DVD would kick my ass royally.

Personally, I would love for the writers to explore Faith, Willow, Illyria and Giles in a little more detail.

And "Serious Talks". Sounds bloody good to me. And Drew is just an added shiny bonus!
Some people want characters, other characters, but I doubt the backers who put money in this dvd film would back characters who are not exceptionally popular. Eliza-Faith has graced the covers of dvds and films already, she'll sell, David is Angel-he'll sell, Spike in Buffy and Angel, he'll sell. They'll need one or more these actors, then you got a dvd film, then you can add the other characters alongside them.
Gossi, I try not to talk in absolutes or dismiss other people's opinions, but in this case I have to make an exception. With all respect that you are an intelligent person whose opinions I very often enjoy reading, your absolute and generalized statement that it is money that drives actors is just plain wrong.

There are many driving forces with actors, it is not only an insanely difficult field, it is an insanely complex field. Unless an actor starts out independently wealthy, money always comes into it, of course. Some actors even become so disillusioned that they do concentrate on money to the exclusion of everything else. But if all actors' driving force was money, they would be plumbers or business people and have never gone into or certainly stayed in acting. Almost every person who sets out to be an actor will not be able to support themselves through acting.

The driving force for actors is usually the ability to continue acting, preferably with good material that fulfills their creative need. In order to do that, they need to make enough money to support themselves and support an acting career, which takes considerable outlay in its own right. To do that actors need to get acting jobs that will show off the actors' talents and get them seen the way they want to be seen (and hopefully, fulfill their creative needs.) If they do that then they may be seen by people who are doing work that may show off their talents, hopefully fulfill their creative needs and get them seen by people who...

It is a profession where the actor is a commodity and treated as such. If they can get on the lovely merry-go-round mentioned above and it leads to roles that make the public recognize them and better yet, recognize their name, then they become just that "a name." That is a higher valued commodity and opens doors to be able to get them noticed by people who are doing work that may show off their talents, hopefully fulfill their creative needs and get them noticed by people who...

And all of this is not to get rich; it is to keep acting and to be able to have the chance of acting in good and interesting roles in good and interesting projects. The fact that it is both an expensive profession and a profession, like most others, in which how expensive you are is equated with how valuable and desirable you are does not mean actors are driven by the money. If actors choose money over quality too many times, people stop watching them and people stop hiring them and everything dries up. Every smart actor, and I think the Whedonverse actors can be put in this category, knows how tricky the balance is between doing good work to get more good work and doing any work in order to support themselves while trying to get and sometimes do good work.

I apologise for the long post and what may seem like a rant, but to say that money is the driving force for any group of artists is unfair and implies a total lack of understanding of the overwhelming need that many people have to create and to communicate through their creativity. I am not trying to rant but to provide a different perspective.

...and I get overly protective of those who are vulnerable...like artists.
I would agree with newcj. Money is undoubtedly a great motivator. It motivates me, although enough of it never seems to come my way. However, while I think gossi makes a valid point, it's too blunt and unyielding. Don't get me wrong. I'm sure money is all-powerful in Hollywood, but I don't believe it is the only thing that drives individual decision making.

The truly huge stars like Julia Roberts and Tom Cruise can demand quite extraordinary terms for their involvement in a film. However, clearly this is not their one and only criteria. To use Roberts as an example, why did she decide to appear in ‘Full Frontal’? It can't have been for the money. It’s a facile example but I think it makes a point.

Actors further down the greasy pole have less opportunity to use their wealth to allow them the freedom to do what they like. Most actors largely have to go where the work is. Their choices and decisions are governed by very different factors to those at the other end of the scale. Even then, I still think different factors come into play.

Clearly, the film business is a precarious one and for female actors it seems doubly so. I would agree with gossi that money is a big factor. An actor achieving a certain level of success will use that as a bargaining tool while the going is good and that will greatly affect financial negotiations. However, to make a statement that this is the one and only deciding factor does seem unduly harsh to me.

If money is the over-riding factor, why didn’t Gellar sign to do the third ‘Scooby Doo’ film, which, had it been made, would clearly have paid considerably more than any of the films she has subsequently signed up to? Again, it's a facile example, but money isn't alaways quite the be all and end all...
I would love to see some new Sunnydaleish derivative.
Anything would be nice. Although Potentials need not apply.
Now, is it possible that ther might be some connection between
Glory and Ben?

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