Whedonesque : Comments on 8744;_obicna_laz : Alyson helps co-star to stop smoking.

Wow, Alyson sounds high maintenance.

As a former smoker maybe I'll seem hypocritical saying this but I don't blame her. I haven't been a smoker for about 17 years now and am very rarely around people who do smoke so when I am I feel physically ill and end up with a very raspy throat being in a room with smokers for a couple of hours. When someone is a smoker they are forcing that smell on everyone around them and for some of us, it does make us feel ill.

[ edited by Firefly Flanatic on 2005-11-10 18:54 ]

Firefly Flanatic | November 10, 20:54 CET

Can't say i blame Alyson, to be honest. As a non-smoker there is nothing worse than kissing a girl who does smoke, especially right after she has had a cigarette. Nope, can't say i blame her at all.

WhedonTrivia | November 10, 20:59 CET

High Maintenance? hmm...don't know about that. But I do know that if I had the chance to kiss Aly, I'd do whatever she asked...
On a serious note, if someone smells because of smoke or anything else, why shouldn't someone say something? Especially if you have to work closely together. I don't see any problem with her letting him know.

two_guns | November 10, 21:00 CET

When I was in grade 8, I was in a school production of a play that some students had written. I had to be coupled with a girl from my class, who was a heavy smoker. With long rehearsal times etc. I just started feeling physicly sick. Some of my friends smoke, and I will hang around sometimes when they do, but that's for brief periods of time... I can't stand dealing with that for long periods.

So no... I don't think that Alyson was being high-maintenance, she has to be with the guy on-screen, closely, a fair amount of time. If he was smoking between shots, than she would have to deal with it for the show's entire run. If she said to the director (I refuse to film the scene) it might be a problem, but I can understand bending the screenplay directions if it really bothers her, and it's good to know that he quit because of it.

rabid | November 10, 21:00 CET

Oh it's from Contact Music. So it must be true then *gags*.

Simon | November 10, 21:01 CET

I vaguely remember reading that SMG has the same issue with co-stars (something about JM having to smooch her in 'Something Blue' when he was still a smoker and how he brushed his teeth a lot before those scenes. I could be remembering it wrong).

I don’t smoke and I am very sensitive to the smoke and the smell so I can’t blame Alyson for not wanting to deal with it. There’s no getting around the fact that it stinks (unless you smoke a pipe) and it bothers me to see cigarette butts littering the ground. I also have (or had) too many relatives with health issues related to smoking to ever find it appealing. If someone likes to smoke, that’s fine with me as long as they aren’t imposing on my right to breathe fresh air instead of their secondhand smoke.

bloodflowers | November 10, 21:36 CET

Oh it's from Contact Music. So it must be true then *gags*.

Oh, and Simon brings the snark :) Fantastic!

zeitgeist | November 10, 21:39 CET

I think kissing after smoking is dead sexy [insert amusing PC pun here], as is smoking after, um, kissing. But obviously if someone had a problem with that, it would be best for all concerned if they said so. There are plenty of other kissage partners to choose from. Apparently.

SoddingNancyTribe | November 10, 21:49 CET

So now Segel's dead sexy, hysterical, and healthier with a better sex drive? Alyson did him a favor.

blutortu | November 10, 21:57 CET

I was in a play once, and I had to kiss a girl who was fat. I refused to kiss her until she lost weight. I used to be fat, and now when I am around fat people I feel physically ill.

Succatash | November 10, 21:58 CET

Uh...interesting, Succatash.

pat32082 | November 10, 21:59 CET

Succatash, that's either an attempt at comedy - that was completely unsuccessful, - or serious. (I assume the latter, and that you're making a political point comparing smokers to overweight people. Not *even* going to address the merits of that comparison.)

Either way, it was way way out of line. Let's try to exhibit some good judgment, yes?

SoddingNancyTribe | November 10, 22:02 CET

Hmm, I would liken it to if someone ate garlic and sardines before every kissing scene. Darn tootin' I'd say something! Put them on the garlic and sardine patch!

BTW, wasn't there some kind of pranky one-upsmanship between SMG and DB about making their breath foul before kissing scenes??

Rogue Slayer | November 10, 22:09 CET

SNT, I was joking. And I am a smoker. I'm curious why one bad habit is ok to bash on, while another bad habit is not.

Succatash | November 10, 22:21 CET

I didn't realize being fat was a bad habit. Can you smell someone's fat on their breath and on their clothes?

two_guns | November 10, 22:24 CET

It has to be said though that Aly really wouldn't have any choice over whether or not she appeared in a romantic scene with Jason, or over whether or not her character kissed him. I somehow don't think the people paying her wages would care whether or not she likes kissing smokers, or that she has an "I won't kiss smokers" clause in her contract. I'm sure Jason's tone was more jokey than it comes across, if the quote is accurate at all.

[ edited by Impossible on 2005-11-10 20:26 ]

Impossible | November 10, 22:25 CET

Way to go Aly! Good on you. And yeah, I agree. Kissing a smoker is like kissing a chimney. It's rather disgusting really.

Djungelurban | November 10, 22:31 CET

Look, I don't want to make anyone angry, or get banned over this. I was just trying to make a point. I think it is possible to say overeating and under-exercising can be termed a "bad habit." Out of the five senses, is smell the only one people have a right to complain about?

Succatash | November 10, 22:31 CET

I stopped smoking (2 and a half to 3 packs a day) 21 years ago next month...I have absolutely no idea how the nonsmoking women I was involved with me could have ever kissed me...glad not to smoke any more...

Chris inVirginia | November 10, 22:39 CET

Succatash - you are only forgetting a few points - one not all overweight people are that way cause they over eat or under excerize, yes that could be a factor for some but not all. Also eating is not something you can stop doing because it's bad for you but smoking is. Not angery but think you can make the same generalization - your comparison is like apples to horses - not really in the same ballpark of vices.

RavenU | November 10, 22:40 CET

You made a bad comparison. As far as what's termed a "bad habit", everyone who smokes does it because they make the choice to. But not everyone who is fat made that choice. Ever hear of genetics?

[ edited by two_guns on 2005-11-10 20:43 ]

two_guns | November 10, 22:40 CET

Succatash, I see where you're coming from. I think the problem is that being overweight is not as simple as "overeating and underexercising."

The Social Security Administration has said that obesity "is a complex, chronic disease characterized by excessive accumulation of body fat. Obesity is generally the result of a combination of factors (e.g. genetic, environmental, and behavioral)." 65 Fed. Reg. 31039. In other words, being overweight is not "a bad habit." Since it is not necessarily within people's control (unlike, it could be argued, smoking), moral judgments about overweight people are completely beside the point and, as mine and other's reactions might demonstrate, can be as offensive as comments about ethnicity, gender, or sexual orientation.

And now, let's return to the subject at hand - kissing Alyson Hannigan, I think it was.

SoddingNancyTribe | November 10, 22:42 CET

Speaking of which SNT, the wife and I watched "Seeing Red" last night...pretty sexy snoggin' going on there...jeez, Joss is sadistic!

Chris inVirginia | November 10, 22:46 CET

I disagree with many of you, and would like to write more to explain myself better. But it sounds like I've been shut down. So I reluctantly leave this thread before I get banned. I don't feel like I have been treated fairly by the mods.

Succatash | November 10, 22:50 CET

Just thinking about how much Jason and Aly do kiss on the show, it's a darn good thing she did make him quit. I can hardly stand near a smoker without gagging(sorry to all you smokers, but the smell can be too much to stand), so I can't even imagine kissing one. But you're right SNT, back to the topic at hand. Kissing Aly = good.

Danica | November 10, 22:51 CET

Succatash, you are not about to be banned, and I don't think you've been treated unfairly. You expressed an opinion, others expressed a different opinion, and I asked that we go back to the link topic, which was about Aly and smoking. If you'd like to e-mail me off-board (address is in my profile), I'd be happy to discuss it further. Thanks.

SoddingNancyTribe | November 10, 22:56 CET

Hm. I guess I stink. But I sure am cute.

Allyson | November 10, 22:57 CET

Yep, I stink too. For those who don't mind, I highly recommend Cigarettes Are Sublime, a beautifully-written elegy to smoking. The author, Richard Klein, doesn't attempt to deny that cigarettes are bad for you; rather, as one reviewer notes, "of course they're hazardous, that's why they're sublime: they combine pleasure with an 'intimation of mortality.'" Anyway, for those with a philosophical bent, it's a fab read.

Impressionable kids: smoking is bad for you. Just in case you hadn't heard.

SoddingNancyTribe | November 10, 23:04 CET

Smoking can be sexy. From afar.

I'm thinking Spike and Faith in the basement....

Rogue Slayer | November 10, 23:14 CET

Being a nonsmoker who was raised in a nonsmoking household, and having had romantic relationships with three smokers in the course of my life, (and a very unromantic relationship with another ;-) ) I have always appreciated the smokers who are willing to understand how much their habit impacts the people around them, especially the ones they are physically close to. Kudos to Jason Segal for using AH's aversion to cigarettes as an reason/excuse to stop smoking. Any reason that works is a good reason.

As the above reference to my history with smoky men indicates, IMO someone can definately be stinky and cute. That said, it sure was a relief, on many levels, when 11 years ago the guy I loved told me he had quit. That made him cute squared + healthier and kept me from having to deal with the smell of smoke in my clothes. In other words I got to stop being stinky too!

newcj | November 10, 23:32 CET

Well I still love ya, ya stinkies. And I *do* miss my cigarettes. . .

GrrrAargh | November 10, 23:33 CET

Alyson Hannigan should team up with the American Cancer Society and put together some PSAs. Imagine how many people will quit smoking if the reward is Alyson kisses. I'd start smoking just to stop!

Hjermsted | November 10, 23:44 CET

I smoke 20 odd a day and that's about it really.

Simon | November 10, 23:47 CET

kisses Simon

runs from Simon's wife

I've tried to quit a few times. It's...hard.

Allyson | November 10, 23:50 CET

Well, tying two pieces of this thread into a weird knot, I quit smoking 4 years ago and gained about 90 pounds. What does that mean?

m'cookies actual | November 11, 00:19 CET

m'cookies - it means that this article holds the answers you seek :)

zeitgeist | November 11, 00:23 CET

Sorry but do anyone think that this story could be only publicity for the show? I just wondering, okay? Anyway if it should be so I really appreciate this kind of publicity

rua1412 | November 11, 00:25 CET

Thanks, zeitgeist!

m'cookies actual | November 11, 00:47 CET

Sitting here chomping on my nicotine gum, craving a ciggie like mad ! And I'm sorry but this whole thread is just making me think "mmmmm lovely fags". Giving up smoking sucks!

debw | November 11, 01:06 CET

They say cigarettes are more addictive than heroin, and the only thing more addictive than heroin is love, so I guess that means all you smokers need to do is fall for someone. That doesn't mind smoking...

I appreciate the visual sex appeal of cigarettes -- I've had fantasies about Angel/Angelus's nasty little habit that I *cough* won't go into here. However, in RL I'm often debilitated by migraines when I'm exposed to cigarettes for any length of time. Kind of puts a damper on the sexiness.

Smokers can choose to inhale/exhale tobacco smoke (and 599 additional additive ingredients), which is OK so long as they remember non-smokers prefer (or in some cases, need) their oxygen unadulterated.

Wiseblood | November 11, 01:22 CET

Here's a miracle product for those having trouble quitting smoking:

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117,16801771-23109,00.html

Note to Allyson Hannigan: I don't smoke!

fruit punch mouth | November 11, 01:29 CET

I quit after almost 15 years of smoking and it was easy.

Really it was....and I didn't even jones/crave/shake. I have a good friend that's a doctor and he got me on a program with Zyban and the Nicotine patch. I did both at the same time. Total Rush!!! Kind of like when Willow was at Rack's on the ceiling freaking out on some "bad" magic (flying through the stars and seeing funky stuff). About 4 weeks later when it was time to step down to the lower level of Nicotine patch, I was ready to never have another cig again.

And not to bring back the whole discussion about smoking and over weight people (I don't want to be banned either!) but....I was thinking that it would have been a more accurate analogy to say....

"I was in a play once, and I had to kiss a girl who was always drunk. I refused to kiss her until she got sober (and brushed her teeth). I used to be an alcoholic and now when I am around drunk people I feel physically ill."

alexreager | November 11, 02:22 CET

Succatash.. you would have a point except that fat people can't make other people fat or unhealthy by kissing them. Secondhand smoke in your mouth isn't particularly healthy and Aly shouldn't have to deal with that, or the stink. Also, like people have already said, sometimes being overweight isn't about bad habits.

fortunateizzi | November 11, 02:24 CET

In my experience, you quit when you want to. It is not "more addictive than heroin" by any measure. I stopped on December 15, 1984, and wanted cigarettes for a long time, but I didn't have any physical withdrawal throes that smack addicts go through.

I loved the damn things, all 50 or 60 I'd smoke each day, and it just got to the point where it really irritated me that I had to make sure they were always there.

Chris inVirginia | November 11, 03:28 CET

As Simon said: "Oh it's from Contact Music. So it must be true then *gags*." I think it is likely that Alyson didn't demand that he quit smoking, it is more likely that she asked him to brush his teeth and gargle before they have to kiss in a scene, and he took the hint that it would be better to quit. I assumed he meant that it was a good thing, and he is happy he had been inspired to quit.
I agree with Chris in Virginia, people quit when they want to or when they are ready. I used to smoke but eventually I got it down to so few cigarettes that I quit without even noticing (it helped that I had switched to a really weak cigarette and that I couldn't afford the cost of buying a lot of them).

embers | November 11, 03:52 CET

Ahhhh. It's nice to live in the state of Washington; we just passed a law Tuesday that bans smoking from all public places -- restaurants, bars, bowling alleys, dance clubs, etc.

In a month, you won't smoke a ciggie within 25 feet of an entrance to any public place.

Draconian? Perhaps; but for once, I get to be the jack-booted thug.

Let's try that evil laugh on for size: Hee hee HEE MWAH-AH-AH HA HA HA! (Say, do these black leather jodhpurs make me look fat?)

bookrats | November 11, 04:16 CET

Yeah, because draconian laws are OK if they're in your favor. Sorry, bookrats, I know you're (half-)joking, but the principle sucks.

*idly wonders whether to join up with the Libertarians*

SoddingNancyTribe | November 11, 04:33 CET

It is not "more addictive than heroin" by any measure.

I know several people who have smoked for years, "quitting" countless times (unsuccessfully), who wouldn't necessarily agree, although they might qualify my statement by saying their addiction was more psychologically-based. If you feel you can't function without something or need it to be "normal", it ceases to be recreational and becomes a dependency. Certainly for physical addiction, it would be hard to argue that nicotine withdrawal is anywhere near as rough as heroin withdrawal. Requiem for a Dream or Trainspotting, anyone?

Still, having once had a friend who was a heavy smoker (2 packs a day), I have to say the psychological addiction and emotional upheaval I witnessed was like nothing I'd ever seen before. When you set your bed on fire and burn down your apartment, and still can't kick the habit, that qualifies as pretty addicted in my book. (By way of comparison, my secretly heroin-addicted boss of some years ago died while I was in his employ -- but not of the drug; he fell down a flight of stairs after a night of perfectly legal drinking and broke his neck.) How's that for irony?

Congratulations to all you quitters! I can't imagine what you went through, but knowing that AH would consider kissing you now has to be some kind of consolation for the pain ;)

Wiseblood | November 11, 07:41 CET

I love our new WA state smoking ban. I've been waiting for it for years (ever since Vancouver, BC and California past theirs).

It all boils down to public health. The freedom of choice argument for smoking doesn't fly with me. I am a music FIEND but I stopped going out to see live music because the clubs (some more than others) would turn into gas chambers by 10:30 Friday and Sat nights. I'd leave with a migraine that lasted the rest of the weekend. Some freedom. Having breathable air in Seattle clubs is going to be amazing. I can't wait to start seeing shows again. Up and coming bands are going to appreciate the larger crowds.

That said, I have NO problem with smokers starting private clubs if they want to. Just not right away. Let the former smoking clubs reap the financial rewards of a smokeless environment for a few years first so there's no temptation for them to "go private".

Hjermsted | November 11, 09:25 CET

I really like the idea of private smoking clubs. I don't think non smokers should be exposed to my stinky habit, but Id like to continue doing it anyway thank you, and preferably somewhere where I won't feel guilty and ashamed for exposing nonsmokers:)
And ditto for planes please! would it kill the airlines to have one smoking flight a week? especially over long distances like Australia to the Uk. Patches are no good cos they can give you some trippy nightmares

ladysorcha | November 11, 11:08 CET

I really like the idea of private smoking clubs. I don't think non smokers should be exposed to my stinky habit, but Id like to continue doing it anyway thank you, and preferably somewhere where I won't feel guilty and ashamed for exposing nonsmokers:)

You took the words right out of my stinky mouth :)

supersymetry | November 11, 17:01 CET

If less people smoked as a result of public banning laws, wouldn't that mean less government revenue from the taxation on cigarettes? Surely the government/regional authority would have to raise income tax as a result of having to compensate for the lose of this source of revenue.

Simon | November 11, 17:21 CET

Simon, you may be right, although the situation is actually quite complicated when you consider that if fewer people smoked:-

- companies would make more money due to fewer cigarette breaks.
- the NHS (or any state-funded healthcare) would have fewer lung cancer/ emphesyma/ etc patients to treat.
- life expectancy would increase so the government would have to pay out more in pensions.

I could list a load more factors suggesting that smoking bans would save money or cost money.

However the key point is that any ban really is horribly illiberal. The only people who should decide whether smoking should be allowed in pubs and clubs are the owners of those facilities. I don't smoke and prefer smoke-free environments, but it isn't a good idea for governments to ban things simply because the majority don't like them.

Jon | November 11, 18:33 CET

Believe it or not, a Maryland town just outside Washington, DC, tried to ban smoking, period. On the streets, and in your house and car.

It didn't carry, but that it was even considered is borderline madness.

Chris inVirginia | November 11, 19:49 CET

I can't wait for the UK ban - I've mosty stopped smoking, but when I'm at the pub...it's too hard!

lone fashionable wolf | November 11, 22:26 CET

Massachusetts has a law where you can't smoke in workplaces or bars/restaurants. There is a town in Massachusetts that has outlawed it on the streets of the town as well but I don't think they've taken it as far as your own home or car. Not 100% sure about the car thing.

Anyway, I was okay about people smoking in restaurants if there was a smoking section and a non-smoking section but the problem usually was that there really wasn't any way to actually keep the smoke out of the smoke free section if they were practically in the same room so it has been nicer to go out to eat and not have to deal with smoke at all. And businesses have been actually doing better business since the ban started. But, I don't see why there can't specifically be bars and restaurants that allow it and if one chooses to enter, smoker or not, it is their own choice. And, I also don't understand, if a pub or bar has the outdoor space, why they couldn't set up seating outside to allow for people who want to smoke to have a place to go.

Firefly Flanatic | November 11, 23:06 CET

The ban in Scotland starts this year I think. I can't wait for it to be smoke free. My Grandad died from lung cancer having been a heavy smoker and I saw him right before he died, and it wasn't pretty at all. So seeing people smoke makes me feel iller than it did back when the only problem was that it gave me a headache.

I don't think there's anything wrong with the ban- public places are for everyone, why should one group be allowed to create a bad experience for everyone else? It's unpleasant, and passive smoking makes other people ill. It's alright to say it's illiberal, but what about all the other things people can't do in a private place, in order to protect the wellbeing of others? This is just another thing people shouldn't be allowed to hurt others by doing in a public place.

Silv | November 12, 06:33 CET

Well that depends on your definition of 'public place'. Pubs and clubs are owned by individuals and no one is forced to work or socialise in them.

If the government wants to ban smoking in all of the buildings that it owns then that's not necessarily an unreasonable choice for it to make. However it should not be the role of governments to force people not to smoke.

Everyone will be in a minority in some aspect of their behaviour. It may be the healthy choice not to smoke but it is not healthy for the government to remove choices from its citizens.

Jon | November 12, 15:03 CET

I don't think there's anything wrong with the ban- public places are for everyone, why should one group be allowed to create a bad experience for everyone else? It's unpleasant, and passive smoking makes other people ill. It's alright to say it's illiberal, but what about all the other things people can't do in a private place, in order to protect the wellbeing of others? This is just another thing people shouldn't be allowed to hurt others by doing in a public place.

That's actually my argument for imposing massive restrictions on the sale of alcohol. It's a far bigger threat to society than smoking ever will be.

Simon | November 12, 15:06 CET

"Hey kids Smoking is fun and it makes you look cool!" - Joss

Oh yea...I do have Joss saying that into my video camera! After he told my youngest she should take up smoking to keep her voice raspy (she had a cold). Of course he was joking! I'd threatened him that I'd broadcast it online at the time (as a joke). It's very funny actually. Zeit, it's on the DVD I'll be sending you and Barest!

nixygirl | November 14, 04:54 CET

Well that's an interesting story, we have to give him credit for that, other people struggle to quit smoking for far more serious reasons and still they don't succeed. I only managed to kick the habit in drug detox.

hallie12 | September 02, 11:44 CET

November 10 2005