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December 20 2005

Whedon Calls Death Knell For Firefly - when articles go wrong. Slashdot have now covered the EW article doing the rounds across the fandom (and Joss himself has commented on it in this Whedonesque thread -Simon).

Now, this article has already been covered on Whedonesque, but I want to draw attention to the concept of short (unquoted) sections of interviews being taken out of context... The internet is alight with word that Joss has killed Firefly, and I'm not entirely sure that was the message Joss wants at all.

The entire storm seems to be EW taking Joss' mention of "closure" to mean it's finished -- when in reality, what Joss has been saying is that if no one ever greenlights any more movies, this one does happen to have some sense of closure to it.

On the upside, with a pointless controversy making its way around online, it just ends up being more PR for the DVD. Heh.
And then you always have to wonder about terminology. I think Firefly the series is probably dead. Serenity though...she may have some life left in her.
If anybody is wondering the scale of problems this interview has caused - go to Tivo or BackWhack or LiberyFilter or DoomsDayLaser ("Joss Whedon announced that he is a wuss and has given up on Firefly") etc etc etc.

On the day of the DVD release... not so great. Thanks, Entertainment Weekly.
All one has to do is look at other Joss interviews to see that he wants to do more with Firefly. Geez. Since when do people only use one source as 100 perecent confirmation.
I've just done a quick blog search and there's about 200 blogs who've covered the EW article in the last hour. Argh.

I was discussing this with Simon last night, and I think we both understand where Joss is coming from in a career kind of path, but I don't think it was ever a 'I've moved on forever' vibe at all. This article will cause a lot of the casual fans to disburse, I think, because of the rate it's spread (it's getting everywhere now thanks to Slashdot's coverage).

Somebody mail Joss his password.. ;)

[ edited by gossi on 2005-12-21 01:27 ]
I wonder how this affects DVD sales...if at all. On the one hand, you have the "no such as bad publicity" logic...on the other, it may be a bit of a cloud.

[ edited by bobster on 2005-12-21 01:28 ]
Unknown, bobster. A few stores are reporting selling out of the DVDs earlier as it happens (I've been watching the forums) which is a good sign.

Really, from a fan base point of view, that's where the damage will be. Lots of fans simply don't follow every interview or blog - they just stumble across things like that, and think 'Joss, bastard!'. I know this because I've been watchin' the random blogs. Hohum.

If Joss really did make exactly those statements to EW, fair enough - but I strongly suspect there's some misquoting and spin from EW here. They will have got millions of hits for this article from Slashdot, all the blogs etc -- which is a lot of money for them.
But will the 'average' viewer even get wind of this? Will it reach the folks who just see the ads on tv or in the store, or aren't Whedonheads but saw the movie and liked it and want to buy the dvd? Will they know what Firefly was, or who Joss is? Will they care if there isn't a future?

I'm really wondering if this will have any effect on sales. I hope not, and I can't really see how it would. I mean, there have been plenty of movies that didn't have sequels or tv shows (re)spun off of them. Most movies, actually.
All right, now I have to jump in and set the record straight. EW is a fine rag, but they do take things out of context. Obviously when I said I had 'closure', what I meant was "I hate Serenity, I hated Firefly, I think my fans are stupid and Nathan Fillion smells like turnips." But EW's always got to put some weird negative spin on it. But so we're clear once and for all: If you read a quote saying "I'd love to do more in this 'verse with these actors in any medium" all I'm saying is that Nathan has a turnipy odor. It's not his fault, he doesn't eat a lot of them but everyone else in the cast noticed it and tht's not really something I'm prepared to deal with any more. And Jewel said outright she wouldn't do scenes with him except stuff like the SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER funeral scene which was outside in a high SPOILER wind. So if I do manage to find another incarnation for my beloved creation, it will have been totally against my will.

I hope that clears everything up. Oh, and when I say I want to do a Spike movie, it means I have a bunion on my toe.

-joss (by which I mean Tim)

(no, actually me.)
I knew if I came back from my office party early Joss would post here.
Thanks, Joss :) I will need to update to say Joss is working on his bunion as his next project now.
Yay. Thanks, Joss. This was the thread to which I just pointed people from River Is Made Of CHOCOLATE, and that post just made this thread decidedly the right place for people to come.
Funerals and bunions and turnips, oh my!

Thanks for the....clarification?
I hope that clears everything up.

Crystal. By which I mean lead.

Thanks for the clarification. (By which I mean snarky post that really just tells us - you like us, you really really like us. (By which I mean "Serenity" and accompanying franchise elements.))

Happy Holidays to you and yours. And I really mean that.

Thanks Joss for a wonderful film. I hope 2006 isn't too much of a Joss-free twelve months on screens big or small.
I suspect Joss is trying to say he said the opposite kind of things to them (if they had read the subtext, or something). But the article kinda reads Death to Firefly! instead.

(And yes, this is the WORST GRAMMAR EVER).

[ edited by gossi on 2005-12-21 02:21 ]
Ha. I was just involved in a discussion about the EW interview in an LJ community with people who are insisting that Joss is DONE with the Firefly 'verse, just because EW said so. Thanks for setting it all straight, Joss. Or sort of straight in that kind of crooked way of yours.

...Wait, bunions? Is that some kind of clue?

[ edited by ElectricSpaceGirl on 2005-12-21 04:49 ]
You didn't happen to take a lot of drugs, did you?

Sarcasm is a very tricky weapon...
Yes, only Xander Harris can do sarcasm right.
As usual, Joss, you have put it all in perspective. It only goes to show that most of the media can't read between the lines.

Oh, and by the way, I got my copy at Wal-Mart today and they had two big displays. I would hope this is indicative of other retail establishments.

[ edited by spikeangellover on 2005-12-21 02:39 ]
I can't pick up my copy of Serenity till the 28th so instead I get two messages from Joss. Thanks, guy.
There are people who believe the EW report is the gospel truth despite evidence to the contrary? I wonder if they're the same ones who swallow everything our government officials tell us? That thought sent shivers up my spine.
Thanks gossi, I've seen horror flicks less frightening.
Gossi's blogsearch link should serve as notice: Those of you with blog and journals, which likely are indexed by Google as well as sites such as Technorati should post something with a headline that debunks the EW story that's zooming around, so that the debunking info spreads too. Something straightforward, perhaps.
Yes, use the blog title "Joss has bunion on his toe ('Closure')"

This link scares dead people.

[ edited by gossi on 2005-12-21 03:00 ]
Just when we had a complete, unambiguous picture of how muddled everything was, this Joss fellow has to come in and completely clear up everything with razor-sharp exposition backed by factual support. I'm not sure we really need somebody named "joss" chiming in on Whedonesque anyway, but thanks.

(BTW gossi the best Slashdot statement to echo exactly what I was thinking was the first posting by someone going by a handle much like "Kazzahdrane." Lost in the noise like everything else, probably, but lucid.)

Thanks Joss for the clarification and Merry Event, Happy New Year, etc. Oh and did you know Serenity was number one on Amazon (the other one, the one without the lasso)?

Happy Holidays to all the other posters and lurkers and admins and the spiders that are trolling this thread for email addresses.
Frankly I thought that EW always got stuff wrong (aren't they the ones that said that the Angel campaigne worked and the show wasn't canceled after all?), but I always enjoy Joss jumping in and muddying up the waters further.
He has posted here and at Universal's board today, does that mean he has finished his Christmas shopping? Personally I was forced to run out to WalMart today because Amazon failed to deliver on the day and I just couldn't wait another minute for my 'Serenity' DVD.
For goodness sake its only 2 days since we had a link to the Toronto star article which quotes Joss as saying

"I'm never satisfied," Whedon confesses. "I do feel some closure. But closure doesn't mean closing the book, on those characters, on those actors, on that universe. I always want more. I am a rabid fan. And so, while I'm happy to lay down my arms for a while, if somebody said, `Pick 'em up, let's do more!' I wouldn't hesitate."

Anyway...good to read (in other threads) of people's positive experiences in stores!

and Joss, I hope you have a wonderful holiday.

ETA : and for those of you coming directly to this thread because of the EW stuff – check out dottikin’s reference in this thread to what she calls Joss’ “adorkable guest column” in TV Guide.

[ edited by purplehazel on 2005-12-21 03:32 ]
Well, I for one refused to buy the DVD due to Joss refuting "Firefly." In fact, the word firefly has been taken out of my vocabulary.

Ahem. (*points at the above as sarcasm*)

Frankly, unless it comes straight from the mouth of Joss (or is posted *by* Joss), I tend to take it with a pound or so of salt. As a fan of all things Joss, I will always keep a firm belief that if someone will greenlight anything of the 'verse, Joss will be there with party hat on.

And, at least Nathan doesn't smell like Beef Vegetable Soup. Things could be worse.

Happy Holidays and Happy "Serenity" watching. I, for one have been full of joy today--just waiting to get home and watch my brand-new DVD.
Raw turnips are a daily snack of mine. All chopped up into little bite sized chunks. Yum.

Now I have to start wondering if I too smell of turnip :)
Yes, before I go to bed (2am, peeps!) I just wanted to say - happy holidays to all. I think I'll be taking a break from Whedonesque for a few days as I'm aware I'm posting here a little too much.. I shall discover the outside, with the fresh air, the birds, and the fine wine and cheese!

(And discover how to type properly).

[ edited by gossi on 2005-12-21 03:40 ]
It's OK, Joss. We're well aware of the media spin at this point. "Whatever headline sells the mostest, nevermind the truth!"
I like the smell of turnips in the smells like....victory.

Or Nathan Fillion.

Either way - goodness!
Well, if this is the same internet buzz that got millions to the theaters for Serenity...uh, I don't think we have to worry.

Mmm, the smell of Nathan Fillion in the morning! I'll have one of those please! First there were the flans, now we'll have to have turnips, too. Maybe even some turnip flans.
I think my fans are stupid

Well, ya did meet a bunch of us all liquored up in a pub. Who's the stupid one now??? Huh???

(OK, that would be me...or gossi.)
I love Entertainment Weekly--they mention something Whedon-y in almost ever issue--but the article 'Adios, 'Firefly' made me really depressed for a few minutes until I realized:

"Hey, isn't this going against everything that Joss has been saying to us?"

I can't believe EW's news spread around like wildfire across the Internet...maybe they'll make mention of their incorrectness in their next issue?

(And, hi Joss!)
Now I'm in a scary visual place where Nathan is playing Baldrick on Black Adder.
Jeez, I go away to watch this great new DVD I bought today, and to talk with an excited relative who received his copy from me via Amazon this evening, and there is a post from Joss. Well, my day is now complete, in any case, and I'm glad the EW article has been refuted (sort of).

My relative had not seen the movie at all, because it never came to his town, and he remained spoiler-free all this time. So he is going through what I went through in June. It's so much fun to talk with someone who loves the characters and is now having a fresh and enthusiastic response to the film. I cannot wait to hear from other friends and relatives who are actually waiting until Christmas to open their gifts, to see how they respond to the 'verse.

Thanks, Joss, for your "beloved creation"!!!
Hey Joss or Tim or evil surrogate twin Toss... whoever you are, thanks for stopping by and clarifying.

Lets hope the internet does its work and spreads this as fast as the EW thingy!
I wouldn't be surprised if this was simply some kind of editor or writer being stupid and mean, as EW always has praise for Joss. I think I saw Joss covered in every other issue of EW this year and maybe someone decided they had a personal issue over Joss and decided to make a little statement.

Look, don't take the "failure" of a movie to indicate anything these days. People with brains don't like to go to movie theaters to spend alot of money to listen to cellphones, way to many previews/ads and being made generally uncomfortable. The DVD sales will go on for years and Universal will make a fortune on their investment.

Come back to TV Joss, we miss you!
What the hell is a "bunion", anyway?

Merry Merry, Joss. And thanks for making my xmas list so dang easy this year.
What the hell is a "bunion", anyway?

A 50-foot tall lumberjack with a blue llama named Babe.
I've heard that some bunions smell like turnips. ;)

Picking up my dvd tomorrow...
Yep, I read this when I got my EW in the mail on Monday. Wanted to first of all...cry like a little baby. But then saw that there were no quotation marks around "it appears the Firefly saga has reached its conclusion." I of course added them just now so you know as to what I'm talking about, but quotation marks in my "rag". And, come on, it's Joss. Serenity is his baby. We all know he would jump at the chance to make said baby #2.

By the way, loved the Six Degrees of Buffy on page 68 in EW. At least that was good.

Oh and like Joss's bunions, I have a cold which obviously means there will be an Illyria movie.

gossi, you will be missed. have a good couple of days off.
Boy, I'm gone for a few hours and chaos ensues.

This sounded so much like someone was writing their Christmas cards, watching a Charlie Brown Christmas, drinking egg nog while reading the quote from Joss in the Toronto paper and just got his meaning wrong. In other words it could have happened to anybody.

Thanks for posting Joss, and straightening everything out. I hope you have some great family holiday time in the next few weeks, only interrupted by good news about Serenity sales and periods of easy inspiration.
Dang! I was busy watching my Serenity DVD, I missed Joss!

Also, remind me never to do anything like submit my students' grades - or do any other work - on nights Joss is going to post...

[ edited by Nebula1400 on 2005-12-21 07:21 ]
As of this moment, we have two of the top five slots on Amazon's DVD list, with Serenity at #1 and Firefly at #5.

Some death knell, EW.
bix, that is so fucking funny!!

From now on, if I ever get a bunion (once I find out what they are), I'm going to name them all Paul.

You are my comedy hero for the evening.
And huzzah to the post above! Two of Five? That's excellent!

Ff/Serenity has a Borg designation! I ask you, in fandom? Does it get any better? ;)
bun·ion - noun.
A painful, inflamed swelling of the bursa at the first joint of the big toe, characterized by enlargement of the joint and lateral displacement of the toe.
It's on the Internet, so it must be true. Come on Joss, your word is nothing compared to the mighty authority of the World Wide Web. ;)
Apart from being a great creator of shows and films I like, your a very funny man Joss, thanks for dropping in when you do on this site.
"Oh, and when I say I want to do a Spike movie, it means I have a bunion on my toe."

Why is it I'm doubting this part is sarcasm.
Because a) Joss does have a bunion on his toe and b) you believe everything you read on the intarweb ;)
Sheesh. Sometimes cruising the web is like passing through Reaver space without the blood-n-guts make-up. Thank god there's always the warm and fuzzy Whedonesque to come home to.
Poor Special Agent Dale Cooper. You're safe here with us, now.
caplow swooosh doink !
I thik Joss was pretty clear, here ... we can expect to see more Serentiy/Firefly if, and when it is made. Unless we don't see it.

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