If you watched all those films then somewhere you should have the lines "He's a bad mother ..." - "Shut your mouth!" - "I'm just talkin about .... Spike."

:)

RavenU | December 27, 05:45 CET

Definitely interesting.

Emma Frost | December 27, 06:07 CET

I wish the book and author the best of luck, but I'll probably pass.

The Dark Shape | December 27, 06:54 CET

Yeah i think i'm gonna pass to. I havn't read any of the new books since the show ended, although i almost bought the "Queen of the Slayers" one. I read the first chapter in the bookstore and it delt a lot with what everyone was thinking after Sunnydale became Craterdale. I'd MUCH rather wait till the comic books come out, since the story will continue the way Joss wants it to, instead of a bunch of fanfic.

Capt Mel | December 27, 09:15 CET

Yeah, count me in on the pass boat. I've read a couple Buffy novels, and they tend to seem like glorified fanfic-that you have to pay for! And I love fanfic, but to pony up money, I'd rather it be something I can consider canon. And I'm really hungry for progress. And Nikki doesn't really grab my interest-not that she probably doesn't have a rich story, but this wouldn't really be it anyway.

Now if Joss ever bothers to write a novel, I'm all over it. But I suppose merchandise for the cause can't hurt, so the more the merrier.

Rogue Slayer | December 27, 09:28 CET

I can't wait for this one to come out. Ever since Buffy went off the air I've been snatching every new book I could find off the shelves. I'll pay anything to see my Buffy and Angel going on brand new adventures.

SpikeBad | December 27, 10:34 CET

I don't know. The description kind of got me interested again. After Queen of the Slayers and Spark and Burn I thought I just about had it with the novels. But this one sounds kind of good.

I don't mind evil Spike occasionally. Pretty Maids was one of my favorites along with Cursed.

Xane | December 27, 10:55 CET

Like a couple of you, I'm also much more interested in the Buffy comics Joss is working on, since a real actual continuation is something I'd love. At the same time though, I like Keith's work (and Keith, he's a nice guy), and I'm curious how this book will play out. And you know, Spike, so that helps my interest too.

(OT, Rogue Slayer, you're in LA, yeah? Always nice to meet/talk to local people. So uh, hi.)

Mike_S | December 27, 10:58 CET

This sounds interesting. I have not read any of the novels, and did not really intend to change that, but I too remember NYC in the 70's and the blackout of 1977 really well. I'm curious as to what he is going to do with Spike and the Slayerverse in that setting. ...I don't suppose Spike would have any reason to drop by The Baths, though that would probably pull in a lot of Spike slash fans. ;-)

newcj | December 27, 13:11 CET

Sounds quite cool!

Ilana | December 27, 16:01 CET

newcj: No Spike at The Baths, but we will see him in CBGBs hoping to catch the Ramones. *big grin*

And thanks everyone for the support -- at least those who provided it. *lopsided grin* (Hey, Rogue Slayer, how do you know it won't be a rich story, anyhow?)

krad | December 27, 19:24 CET

Krad, I loved what you did with the Serenity novelization. I have faith in you to get the characters' voices right (unlike some other Whedonverse authors) & I'm looking forward to this release. Write faster, Write faster! :-)

gingeriffic | December 27, 20:04 CET

Sorry Krad for my miswording. I'm not saying you won't write a rich story for her, I just meant that *to me*, this won't be her real story, it's just another fan's take on it. And again, nothing wrong with fanfic, I enjoy it and write it myself. But again, just my opinion, for my money I want it to be canon.

And hi to Mike_S, there are a few of us Southland folks around here!

Rogue Slayer | December 27, 21:02 CET

Krad, :-D
I guess the slash fans will have to look else where then. I can't really see punk Spike getting into Bette Midler anyway. ;-o

Yeah NYC in the 70"s was an interesting place. The possibilities do boggle my mind a little bit. Will her watcher enter the story?

...And the big question: We are all assuming Joss has had no input or comment, as is the norm for the books and formerly for the comics. Are we right in making that assumption?

newcj | December 27, 21:17 CET

I will definitely buy it. I think it sounds like a really interesting book.

Personally, thus far I have taken very, very few of the Buffy or Angel books as canon. Unfortunately most of them are pretty poor quality. Some of them are very good, mostly Tales of the Slayers and stuff that has been written by Joss or writers from the show.

Razor | December 27, 21:23 CET

gingeriffic: Thanks! The book's actually done, and I'm waiting for word back from my editor.

Rogue Slayer: Fair enough (see below for my take on the whole "canon" issue). For the record, though, I'm not writing fanfic. I'm writing professional fiction that's officially licensed by the 20th Century Fox Film Corporation (who own the copyright and trademark to Buffy and Angel), and that goes through the full editorial process that every professionally published book goes through. You may not see a difference, and I respect that, but there is a difference. I can say this with authority, because I've written plenty of fanfic in my time, too. *grin* Saying writing tie-in novels is the same as writing fanfic is like saying making a public access TV show is the same as making a movie -- they're both filmed items, but they're not the same.

newcj: Yes, Bernard Crowley is an integral part of the story. As for Joss, he has very little direct input in the novels and comics simply due to time -- that's a full-time job, one that Fox's licensing department is actually set up to do.

Razor: Glad you're looking forward to it! Do not get me started on the utter inanity of the entire "canon" issue. "Canon" is simply what writers are obligated to follow along with. It's a criterion that's irrelevant to the reading/viewing public, and certainly isn't an indicator of quality. I also do not get the notion of arguing over what's "real" in a fictional construct. (Hm. Looks like I did get started. *sigh*)

Again, thanks to everyone!

krad | December 27, 22:18 CET

Well, Krad, I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree on what constitutes fanfic and canon, because to me, anything that's not written by or 'blessed' by(so to speak) Joss as canon is fanfic. Compensated fanfic, to be sure. To me, the editorial(btw, I read a Buffy novel that had horrible misspellings, so it doesn't hold much water for me!) or licensing process doesn't factor in. If David Fury wrote a Buffy novelization, I'd consider that fanfic, unless, again, Joss said he considered it canon. I kind of go with the idea from Websters that says fanfic is: "a fictional account written by a fan of a show, movie, book, or video game to explore themes and ideas that will not or cannot be explored via the originating medium". I understand most people wouldn't consider a published book as fanfic, because of the compensation, but to me the money is the only real difference.

As far as canon, I'm not sure I'd agree it's irrelevant to the public, as you can see here it seems to hold some relevance for some folks. It's the very reason that some people don't buy the novels at all, because it's not coming from or sanctioned by the originator/creator. But then, a lot of folks do buy the novels, so it doesn't matter to most people if it's official or can be considered a part of the Buffy saga. As for quality, I would be more apt to read something from Joss or approved by Joss than other writers, because I would assume he has a great eye for detail and quality, and I trust his judgment. He got me watching Veronica Mars, for pete's sake!

BTW, I hope you don't take offense at my opinions on fanfic and canon; I'm not trying to make judgments on your own writing, as I've never read you. Just giving my thoughts on the ideas in general. I'm sure you're a splendid writer, it's just my own feelings and opinions that preclude me from reading any more novelizations.

BTW, I just noticed, you were pretty purpley blue, weren't you? Or maybe my colors have gone wonky again? Uh oh, you offended Simon by not having his pic on your new novel, didn't you??? j/k :~P

[ edited by Rogue Slayer on 2005-12-27 20:55 ]

Rogue Slayer | December 27, 22:46 CET

Why is it that most of the Spike novels are written when he was evil? I have often wondered why they don't get into the deep complicated nature of his character which comes later in the verse? Is it because these are geared toward the younger readers? (I'm all for some Adult BTVS/ATS novels)

spikeylover | December 27, 22:55 CET

The thing about "canon" that bothers me is the constraint it puts on the writer. The Star Trek series is notorious for this; the writer has to put everything in the universe back the way they found it, or they don't get to play. All too often, it's a straightjacket. Nikki Wood's story is a little better starting point, because there's going to be real change; things won't end the way they started. On the other hand, we know the ending already, and that's not going to change, either.

The thing that pulls me into a really good novel is the deeply personal sense of obsession that the author can bring to such a large, sprawling form. Franchise novels can lose a lot of that, simply because the author isn't dealing with their own personal creations. Blackout has a chance to step out of that a bit, because Keith is writing about a time and place that has that close personal connections for him. So I might make an exception for this one.

Wish it were coming out earlier, though. I'm going to need some good procrastinating material around April and May. (The Slayage Whedonverse conference is coming up on Memorial Day weekend, and I have a paper to write! Anyone else here planning to attend that conference?)

MissKittysMom | December 27, 23:18 CET

I like all types of Spikes. Soulless and soul...er... full. I love his sarcasm when he's evil so evil Spike is good by me. Not that I don't also love the sensitive-makes-you-melt Spike. I get what people are saying about it being like fanfiction... but it's not like it's that expensive. Plus, Spike's worth it.

savvy_guitar_chic | December 27, 23:28 CET

Since when are spin-off novel writers automatically fans, Rogue Slayer? From the spin-off novels I read as a kid, it did not seem like most of them had ever watched the show from which the novel was derived. ;-)

This is going to sound extremely snobbish, and it probably is, but I do not mean it to be insulting to anyone. I have not read any of the Buffyverse novels or fanfic because I remember what spinoff novels for TV series were like when I was a kid, and much of the fanfic I saw years ago for other programs reeked of adolescent self indulgence. That said I have heard very good things about Buffyverse fanfic and terrible things about the novels. I have avoided both just because I prefer to have Joss's vision in my head without distractions. That said, I liked the excerpt I read of the Serenity novelization (I have not read it yet) and I like premise of this book. I am being sorely tempted to try this one out because it seems like it will most likely be a quality product by a good writer who seems to pay attention to the details.

Canon does count however... (Insert threads of argument concerning the definition of "canon.") I for one know they take good pictures because I've been using one for years.

And I noticed the lack of purple too. What is the deal?

newcj | December 27, 23:46 CET

I'll be looking forward to it Krad. I'm a big Spike fan and while i'm saddend by the shortage of post-soul Spike material.
I'm hoping that the reason for it is that a Spike post-nfa movie is still the most likely to happen. But i also believe that the Spike in that era is gonna be awesome, i love the movie "The Warriors" wich also takes place in the 70's New york.

sethsky | December 27, 23:51 CET

RogueS, newcj, and others: as the front-page says under "The Sitch," new policy is that VIP status is only for Joss, his staff, and actors. As always, if you have policy questions, you can e-mail us.

Back OT, I like MissKittysMom's take: krad's decision to center the story in a personally familiar locale should make this quite the attractive proposition. And I happen to think he's a pretty decent writer too.

SoddingNancyTribe | December 27, 23:55 CET

Since when are spin-off novel writers automatically fans, Rogue Slayer? From the spin-off novels I read as a kid, it did not seem like most of them had ever watched the show from which the novel was derived.

Good point, I've read some 'amateur' fanfic by very ardent fans that also seems like we might be watching different shows! I mean, in what universe would Buffy ever call Spike "My dearest heart's desire"?? :~P

(I'm all for some Adult BTVS/ATS novels)

Amen to that! Buffy's not a show for kids, so why do they insist on making the books so adolescent?

RogueS, newcj, and others: as the front-page says under "The Sitch," new policy is that VIP status is only for Joss, his staff, and actors.

Gotcha! Thanks for the clarification!

Rogue Slayer | December 27, 23:57 CET

Rogue Slayer: No offense taken in the least. I hope I, in turn, haven't given any. We could probably go 'round and 'round for days on this subject, as I have very strong feelings on it. (Yeah, DeCandido, we could tell.... *laughs*)

I will say this: what many many fans refer to as "canon" is really "personal continuity." Canon is a factual designation -- it's what the people who write for the universe must be beholden to. That's all it is. To be blunt, no Buffy novel or comic book is ever likely to be canonical. This is why "what I consider canon" is an oxymoron. What's being referred to there is continuity, not canon. A subtle but, to my mind, important difference.

And there's a lot more to editorial oversight than spelling, says the man with over 15 years' professional editing experience. Spelling is, in fact, the absolute least of it. But when editing is done right, it's invisible, which is as it should be. But just because you don't see it doesn't mean it isn't there. *grin*

Thank you, BTW, for worrying about giving offense -- I feared getting the Internet Flame Of Righteousness, and was grateful to instead get intelligent, rational discourse.

As for the color change, talk to the folks here. I got an e-mail the other day demoting me to "normal" status, due to a general redefinition of Who Gets To Be Purple. *shrug* I felt a little bit like my cufflinks were being snipped, but I don't see that it has any qualitative effect on me, so, y'know, whatever. It's their board, if they want to demote me, I'm okay with it.

spikeylover: Well, I kinda had to tell Spike as evil because in 1977, he was evil. The story I'm telling here is Nikki's -- Spike's job, as was made clear back in "Fool for Love," is to be the antagonist. FWIW, though, there's a prologue and epilogue that take place in the middle sixth season (shortly before "Doublemeat Palace"), so in addition to Evil Spike, we also get On The Road To Redemption Spike.

MissKittysMom: Sorry about the timing. *grin* For what it's worth, though, the Star Trek novels have been going fairly far afield, doing original novel series not directly based on existing shows (Peter David's New Frontier, Michael Jan Friedman's Stargazer, my own I.K.S. Gorkon, the multiauthor Titan and Vanguard) and they've also been continuing the stories of DS9 and Voyager past their finales, and will be doing post-Nemesis TNG novels starting in 2007. In all of those cases, the "reset button" has been dismantled.

And yeah, you could describe my interest in my hometown as a "deeply personal sense of obsession." In fact, I may have to steal that line..... *grin*

savvy_guitar_chic: I love Spike in pretty much every incarnation as well, and he is a blast to write. I think Spike fans will be quite happy with this book....

krad | December 27, 23:59 CET

Hey krad, we do appreciate your involvement here - and this thread is a great example of what you bring to the table. Still, I wanted to remind us all, again, to confine the metadiscussions of Whedonesque policy to e-mails, please. I will say that the VIP policy change does not affect krad alone, so it should certainly not be viewed as some kind of comment on, or message to, him. Thanks.

SoddingNancyTribe | December 28, 00:06 CET

newcj: You've been reading the wrong tie-ins. *grin* I know dozens of tie-in writers, and we're all fans of the work we do. Trust me, given what we have to go through for some of these -- tight deadlines, additional levels of approvals, trying to keep up with ongoing series, having people calling us names on the Internet -- we'd have to be fans to do this. Trust me, the money isn't that good. *laughs*

Speaking for myself, I've been a fan of every universe I've written in, and I'm a huge fan of Buffy.

sethsky: Thanks! Hope you enjoy it!

SoddingNancyTribe: *blush* Thanks so much!

Rogue Slayer: When the rights to do Buffy novels were sold to Pocket way back in 1997, it was before the show had been on for very long, and everyone was assuming that it would be a show that appealed to teens, like most shows that have teen characters, so the books were done as young-adult novels by Pocket's YA department -- this was a strategy that had worked for decades. Everyone was kind of thrown for a loop when the show wound up having a much more mature appeal, so they later on started up a proper adult line, and the books are still split between the two.

krad | December 28, 00:07 CET

SoddingNancyTribe: Sorry -- my post took a while to compose, and your first note on the subject went up while I was in the midst of said composition, so we cross-posted.

krad | December 28, 00:09 CET

Spelling is, in fact, the absolute least of it.

That's probably the saddest thing I've read in a long time, because to me when I see grammatical and spelling errors all over a book, I tend to give less value to the book(and in turn, the writer I will associate with it), because it's obvious the people putting out the book didn't find it that important to even take a cursory look through! I don't remember which Buffy book it was, but the Master was referred to as The Mooter! I mean, are we just relying on spellcheck nowadays??

Ok, I can see what you mean about canon and continuity being confused, but going to my trusty wikipedia(JFK stories aside...) it contends that "the canon of a fictional universe comprises those novels, stories, films, etc. that are considered to be genuine (or "official"), and those events, characters, settings, etc. that are considered to have inarguable existence within the fictional universe."

Now, the question is, 'considered by who?'(or, uh, whom?). Considered by a majority of people? Individually? So, to me, the novels and comics not written or approved by Joss, would not exist within his fictional universe. Therefore, not canon.

But I think your contention is that canon is only a 'rule' set by existing works, and cannot be considered to include future works? Who decides which existing works fall under the 'rule setting'? I suppose whoever is doing the licensing?

I always come back to the simplistic: If Joss didn't say or agree it happened, it didn't happen. And trust me, I'd love to non-canon the Spike/Harmony sex in Destiny, but I just can't. So for better or worse, it happened. And I'm not really crazy about Xander being Drac's buttmonkey for a year after Chosen, but since it seems sanctioned by Joss...it too happened. Everything else is just a lot of fun wanking. To me.

[ edited by Rogue Slayer on 2005-12-27 22:27 ]

Rogue Slayer | December 28, 00:26 CET

Spelling is, in fact, the absolute least of it.

I don't think Krad meant to say that spelling is unimportant, just that spelling is only a fraction of the editorial oversight.

As for canon vs. non-canon, I personally have no problem with becoming involved in non-canon stories (assuming they're well-written), because they provide often provide interesting explanations for what Joss left unexplained in the Buffyverse, which is enjoyable to read regardless of whether it's been approved or not by Joss. The only problem is when Joss later writes something that contradicts a non-canon story- then I felt like I wasted my time on the story.

vampire dan | December 28, 00:48 CET

Steal away. It's not like I was doing anything with it.

I used to write, but too much therapy fixed the underlying obsessions. I kind of miss writing, and may get back to it one of these days. Not until I can feel it burning, though.

MissKittysMom | December 28, 01:24 CET

Rogue Slayer: As vampire dan said, I didn't mean that spelling was unimportant, I meant that it's a very very very small and comparatively insignificant part of what an editor does. And there are times when you read a thing several dozen times, and a copy editor reads it, and a proofreader reads it, and both the author and the editor go over it lots of times -- and the mistakes still show up. It's maddening. But it's reality. It sucks, yes, but it happens all too often, and it's not because people don't care. Usually what it actually means is that the editor did catch half a dozen other spelling errors and that one fell through the cracks.

vampire dan: You know what one of the most popular and well-regarded Star Trek novels is to this day? Federation by Judith & Garfield Reeves-Stevens. That novel was completely blown out of the water by the movie First Contact -- which, BTW, remains one of the most popular Trek films.

Nobody felt like they "wasted their time" with Federation after First Contact was released. It's still, a decade later, regarded as one of the classics of TrekLit. And it doesn't diminish either it or the film that the two contradict each other.

Like I said, why sweat about what's "real" in a fictional construct? *grin*

MissKittysMom: Thanks!

krad | December 28, 02:17 CET

"I love Spike in pretty much every incarnation as well, and he is a blast to write. I think Spike fans will be quite happy with this book...."

Hey hey... we agree with each other! That's so great! Hey, you know what? I PROMISE you I'll be one of the first to read and review. Can we have a spoiler? Very small tiny one... like a line Spike says or something.

savvy_guitar_chic | December 28, 02:40 CET

Hey Krad, I was tryin' ta help ya out. ;-)

I have no doubt I was reading the wrong tie-in novels. You have to remember that I was the one who said she remembered NYC in the 70's. So when I say I read them as a kid, we are talking about lonnnng before you folks had to take criticism from the internet, and of course before the internet itself.

I am a marginal fan at best. When I like someone's work, whether an author or an actor, I like the work itself. I am not all that interested in action figures, actor's photos or autographs. Tie in books are not on the top of my list either. That said, if I like an author's work, I don't care whether he/she writes a tie-in book or something from their own universe. I liked the Serenity novelization excerpt, I also find Spike interesting and I too am fascinated and in love with NYC, so I might give this a try not because it is a tie-in book, but because the combination of elements sounds intriguing.

newcj | December 28, 04:04 CET

Like I said, why sweat about what's "real" in a fictional construct?

So if it doesn't matter whether your story takes place in the exact same world as Joss' stories, then I think you're saying the world that a story takes place in doesn't really matter; it's the story itself that matters. I kind of agree with that, but then why bother to make the story fit with Joss' world at all- why not just make a complete alternate reality to Joss' world to fit the story you want to tell? In fact, why don't you just make your own world with your own characters to fit the story you want to tell? I'm just wondering.

vampire dan | December 28, 04:49 CET

I'm a Spike fan and have loved every incarnation there has been. I enjoyed Pretty Maids quite a lot. But I seem to recall that that came out around S4 or S5. I had no problem with reading evil Spike as it was set in an earlier time as this new book will be.

My disappointment however is the utter lack of up to date Spike books. I don't mean post NFA, but definitely post soul. I've moved with the character through his many changes and I feel that the books are lagging behind greatly.

I fully understand that this book is set in 1977 and that obviously Spike will be evil. And I also totally understand that the reason that it is Spike's picture on the front of the book instead of Slayer Nikki's, who is the main character of this book, is because Spike sells.

My frustration, not with the authors of these books but with the publishers, is that Spike sells, they know Spike sells and yet they keep any books involving him either pre-soul or totally evil and he's usually there as a token. Sort of a yeah put him in the story, however out of character he may be written for the timeframe of the book, just so we can put his face on the front and sell more books. It's getting ridiculous and people are onto them now. Yes Spike sells, but Spike fans will no longer buy just anything to do with him, we want quality products.

On the point of spelling. It may well be one of the lesser concerns of authors and editors etc, and I get there are many constraints and issues associated with getting a book published.

If I'm reading a piece of fanfic and the spelling is off a bit I'll let it slide, up to a point. If it gets too much I stop reading. If the writer cannot be bothered to use spellcheck I cannot be bothered reading there offering. Now if the same happens in a book that I have parted with my hard earned for I expect correct spelling. I've paid for a professionally written book and expect the standard to be far beyond fanfic writers. If it's not then frankly I consider that taking a liberty. It does not matter to me how many mistakes were caught, but how many weren't.

exoticmushroom | December 28, 05:20 CET

Well I haven't read any of Krad's work so I can't comment, but most Buffy novels are atrocious in spelling and grammar. So if that is the least important of the writer/editor tasks, what does that say about how well they performed in the rest of their duties in a book like that? And rather than "that's the least of what they have to do", I'd rephrase that to "that's the minimum of what they're supposed to get right if they want to put that product out in the market with a straight face".


Well, I never blame writers of the novels for getting future continuity wrong. Spike said once that Angel was his Sire and it wasn't until later that we learn he was actually his Grand Sire and that Drusilla turned Spike. But who could've known that? I don't blame novels and comics for showing 'flashbacks' of how Angel brought Spike to Dru. They were trying to stick to continuity. But then it means that, unless Joss actively advises (like he's now advising comic writers at least on where NOT to go, so it won't counter his own plans) it makes the whole novel department 'Alternate Universe' almost by definition.

That doesn't mean they're not enjoyable reads of course. Most of us have enjoyed AU fanfic and if well-written, it can be nice. I stopped reading novels not because they were AU, but because they were atrocious. (Again, nothing on Krad since I never read him) Even known continuity is barely followed (under the "who cares" banner), characterization is usually bad, dialogue filled with cliches and plots are completely forgettable if they're even coherent. Of the ones I read, 'Pretty Maids All in a Row' was the only one that I not only finished but also didn't angrily toss across the room after I did. And I still had some problems with it. I'm sure there must be some good ones out there and for all I know I'd worship at krad's feet if I tried his books, but frankly I've been burned too often by both novels and comics.

(And yeah, why do the novel people think that the Buffy audience consists almost solely of 13 year old girls? It fortifies the idea they have no clue whatsoever about this show or its following)

As for canon being personal, yes it is. And the person in question is Joss. And that's not snobbery, it's simply learning from experience. The only comics I considered good and fitting and canonical are Fray, TotS, TotV and the odd Jane/Doug issue here and there. I'm perfectly willing to try other comic writers' attempts but so far they've pretty much all been crap. (Peter David being an exception but I still wasn't really crazy about it) Joss is the creator and major creative force behind it all and that's what made it what it is in the first place.


Yeah I'm afraid I never find that much of an argument. 'It's all make-believe anyway.' That comes a little too close to the type of answer that Hollywood exec gave to questions on why the ending of Tim Burton's 'Planet of the Apes' didn't seem to make much sense: "Hey it's a movie about monkeys in space. Who cares about sense?" (Paraphrasing, but that was the gist)


I agree. 'Why does it matter'? Well, why does any of it matter then? To me the Buffyverse is basically one big story and like any story, it should have a clear consistent coninuity. If someone wants to do a 'What If' story set in an Alternate Universe, then that's fine. But that's still what I'm going to see it as. And I'm afraid most non-Joss continuity I've come across has been severely sub-par. And if a novel writer is loose with continuity and essentially makes an AU story then I do hope he or she sticks to their own ideas with their next novel set in the same world.

I think things will just turn messy if we toss all notion of continuity out the window. Just my two cents...

EdDantes | December 28, 05:30 CET

Okay, I think folks were misinterpreting what I meant. I used the example of First Contact and Federation deliberately. Federation is a great book, and it worked with what was known at the time of the Trek universe. The example EdDantes gave about the issue of Spike's sire is a good one as well.

Believe me, I'm very much concerned with continuity and making sure that it all fits within the universe. The reason why I wrote this book is because I'm a Buffy fan, and because I was fascinated by the character of Nikki Wood from what we saw of her, and because I wanted to see what a Slayer in 1970s NYC would've been like. It could only have worked as a Buffy book.

Trust me, there's plenty of continuity in Blackout, and I made every effort to be consistent with everything (what little there was) we learned about Nikki and Robin (and her Watcher and Spike). I'll be putting up a page of annotations for the book on my web site when the book comes out. If you check my web site, you'll see annotations for two of my Trek books, Articles of the Federation and A Time for War, a Time for Peace. You can trust that I'm as obsessive about continuity with Buffy as I am with Trek.

So I have no interest in tossing continuity out the window. But I'm not going to sweat it if something comes along later that contradicts my novel, either.

krad | December 28, 07:27 CET

exoticmushroom: Honestly, I think one of the main reasons why there are so few post-soul Spike stories is a simple one: Where do you put it? There's very little storytelling space in the seventh season of Buffy, certainly difficult to fit an entire novel there. Diana Gallagher did it in Spark and Burn, but most of that novel was flashbacks.

krad | December 28, 07:33 CET

Oh, you could definitely write an adult novel about "that one time" between Angel/Spike or St. Petersburg. I have to say, I'm more into something for the over eighteen crowd, then just soul-FULL Spike.

As for soulful Spike, one idea could be a story from the time that Lurky gave him his soul and the time Buffy found him in the hellmouth..

spikeylover | December 28, 08:07 CET

I'll give it a read when it comes out.

TwisTz | December 28, 14:46 CET

I'd love to see some S5 Angel books. To be honest that is where my interest for stories lie now, with the Ats folk. There are plenty of stories and adventures that could be written about all of the characters and their time at W&H.

And if that includes mucho Spangel then I'll grin and bare it. ;0)

exoticmushroom | December 28, 17:42 CET

Unfortunately, I don't think anyone has the license to do Angel books anymore. Pocket let the license lapse after the show was cancelled. Apparently, the book line never did all that well -- as opposed to the Buffy books, which are still going strong.

However, IDW is doing Angel comics....

krad | December 28, 20:15 CET

I've read the latest Angel comics and have to say I was very disappointed. I did, however, love the Spike Old Times comic. Very very funny.

lyrabelacqua | December 28, 20:27 CET

The first issue of the second Angel comic series is better than the entire 5 issue run of the first series. I definitely recommend it.

krad I spy an opening in the market. :0)

exoticmushroom | December 29, 01:41 CET

I second that one. I forget to do a discussion thread for issue one but whenever issue two comes out, I'll post one and see what people think of the mini-series so far.

Simon | December 29, 03:25 CET

Are y'all talking about the ones that just came out? I'm just getting into the comics so I have no idea what's what.

lyrabelacqua | December 29, 03:38 CET

Ok, I haven't been by the comic store lately (they hold a copy of all things Joss for me) so I think I know what you mean. There were 5 issues of the first run and maybe a new issue of the second run has just come out? It's probably sitting in my reserve box, waiting for me to pick it up.

lyrabelacqua | December 29, 03:42 CET

For the canon thing, I consider canon only Joss work, or works blessed by Joss. Why?
First of all, I read a Buffy novel (Inmortal), and I found it totally out of character. But ey, It was just one, there could be a lot of good ones (this one, for example).
But second. Novel writers can write whatever they want, even a fictional Season 8. I can't count that as canon, because then Joss can write his own 8 season or another story, and it will be completelly different from the previous one.
Buffy is Joss vision, so I want Joss vision or approval to call it canon. Just in case of a "what if one day..."

Angel TheVampire | December 29, 22:35 CET