Thanks, that' was pretty cool. I could see Gwen Raiden as a major character. Although there's no way Gunn survived that fight.

einral | January 12, 12:35 CET

I hate the person who made this. Now I miss Angel even more.

The Dark Shape | January 12, 13:07 CET

I always thought that Gunn didn't survive the fight, too. But now that I think about it, it's kind of hard to believe
that they would get rid of three major characters when they still thought season 6 was a go.

xdamienx | January 12, 13:15 CET

Hm, I liked how by season five they had the juxtaposition of Illyria and Fred over Amy Acker's credits... Also, I do believe that after Harmony finally made credit status that she would have played a role in the sixth season even if they did seemingly write her out. Also, I find the Tom Lenk hilarious, mostly as I forgot he had hobbit hair in one of the episodes. Alexa Davalos I'd been hoping would have been a recurring role actually...

orangewaxlion | January 12, 13:20 CET

If season 6 had happened, season 5 would have ended differently. The more I see/think about that ending, the more complete it feels (and in a good way). Probably just rationalization though.

And I'm convinced if Alexa Davalos was wearing the Gwen Raiden outfit on Reunion, that show would've never been cancelled.

TheZeppo | January 12, 13:31 CET

I think they originally wanted Alexa to have a bigger role, didn't they?

Loved the credit sequence. And damn, I can just see Gwen, Faith, and Illyria playing off each other. That would have been SO COOL!!!

ETA: I wonder if Nina the wolf-girl would have had a bigger role? I heard rumors about her becoming a bigger player, and them wanting to bring Oz in to help her curb her wolfy side.

[ edited by Emma Frost on 2006-01-12 11:32 ]

Emma Frost | January 12, 13:31 CET

I freakin' love Tom Lenk... he's absolutely hilarious. :D Damage is one of my favourite Season 5 episodes, almost entirely because of him. :) (Also because of all the references back to things that happened in Buffy).

And I'll ++ The Dark Shape's comment. :(

VirtualWolf | January 12, 13:33 CET

It's good but they focussed far too long on the final moments of 'Not Fade Away'. Some suitable editing and this would have been a top-notch fan made trailer.

Simon | January 12, 13:50 CET

Great trailer, There should of been a season 6, the WB just dont know what the hell they had when they cancelled angel. Having faith in the mix of things whould have made an interesting season.

mickey | January 12, 14:04 CET

If only...Hard to watch becuase it makes me want it so much. Dam WB, they sure made a huge mistake.

BD | January 12, 14:13 CET

It's good but they focussed far too long on the final moments of 'Not Fade Away'.

Well, it clearly says on the site that this is the Opening & Credits. And it's just like Joss to play out a scene we've all watched a hundred times as the pre-credits teaser, just to keep the suspense up.

Given the opening credits are so short, though, it does take away a bit of its power.

crossoverman | January 12, 14:55 CET

Page ain't working :( I assume because bandwidth has been exceeded...?

Grounded | January 12, 15:13 CET

Hmm, can't watch this trailer here at work, but I agree with everyone else: I very much would've liked to see season 6 happen. What makes it even more painfull is that we've heard that the show might have been saved if some things would've been done differently, but wasn't. I'm not blaming anyone, but it does make it even slightly harder to accept it ended.

Having said that, I do think NFA is, quite simply, the very best series ender we could've wished for Angel. It just works on a lot of levels. I prefer it to 'Chosen', actually.


Haven't we repeatedly heard that the end of S5 was exactly the same as it would've been if we had a seaon 6?

GVH | January 12, 15:33 CET

Joss or Fury said Wes wouldn't have been killed had there been a season 6.

Simon | January 12, 15:48 CET

Ah, yes, you're right, Simon. Forgot about that one, thanks.

GVH | January 12, 16:10 CET

Oh god, now I want more Angel, more I tell you more!! How cool would faith have been in it?

I hate the stupid network cancelling Angel, um..nutcases!! Ok i'm going to stop now cuz i could rant for Ireland here!!

kateblucas | January 12, 16:44 CET

Sob.....I can not get the clip to work at all. Could someone please tell us about it? There is no spoiler warning, so I assume we can spill info on who would have been in S6. Please....

kathylovesspike | January 12, 17:01 CET

I'm not sure what you guys are doing. I'm still pretending, VERY HARD, that Season 7 is just getting underway. It's very nice where I live.

Ocular | January 12, 17:19 CET

I have to agree with you. I thought it was a better ending.

war_machine | January 12, 17:46 CET

I suspect Angel wouldn't have signed the [spoiler-avoider] if the series had been continuing. It felt to me like something thrown in at the last minute. Either way, I found it an unsatisfactory end to that story arc.

Loved the Season 6 credits. Great fan-wank!

tichtich | January 12, 17:48 CET

Man, what is it with the Gwen love? What does she offer that one doesn't already have with Faith, Lilah, Cordy or Fred? I don't get it. I refuse to even look at these credits if the person that made them thought Gwen would actually work as more than a one-note, token bad girl. Alexa is not Eliza- she doesn't have the skills required to make the character anything more than another hot chick in leather pants.

inzombia | January 12, 18:02 CET

She shoots electricity. I'm amazingly shallow when it comes to things like that.

Simon | January 12, 18:10 CET

Heh. I would almost agree with on the "electro-powers = cool" thing if it weren't for the fact that when Gwen shocked Angel, they ended up making out, whereas when Angel was tasered on numerous occasions, he just kinda collapsed like any weak human would. Confusing. Besides, LISA took away her powers, didn't it?

inzombia | January 12, 18:19 CET

Really like this, looks very cool and features a cast that i would actually loved to have sat and watched in the sixth season.

Nice to see Andrew in the mix, given the lack of a Watcher on the show. Maybe even there acting as a liason between Angel and Buffy, to rebuild some bridges. Gunn was a surprise but given the fact that none of them were all that likely to make it out of the alley it shouldn't come as a big shock to anyone that Gunn survived too. Gwen would have made an excellent addition to the cast and Faith ... well, always happy to see more of the lovely Eliza.

Hearing that theme music start up really made me realise how much i resent the fact i'm not currently watching the early episodes of season seven, as we UK fans should be, right now. It's an absolute crime that we lost those last two seasons.

WhedonTrivia | January 12, 18:46 CET

Wish I could see it. The front page just sits there, it won't do anything no matter what I click.

Willowy | January 12, 19:04 CET

I can't see it either, it keeps closing my browser.

Dan Corson | January 12, 19:26 CET

More Angel now!!!

ChosenOne5376 | January 12, 19:26 CET

Sorry guys, I didn't want to bring back this wave of nostalgia by posting this link. Oh wait, actually I did! Sometimes it's good to remember how we miss some things.

Yorick | January 12, 19:28 CET

Am still grieving the loss :(
Curses to all who had a hand in the losing. It still amazes me that TPTB could cancel one of the best things on TV. At least we got the satisfaction of knowing they cut off their nose to spite their face. *is bitter - still*
Thanks, Yorick, sometimes a little pain can be a good thing. ;)

anindoorkitty | January 12, 19:53 CET

Waaahhhhh!!!! I want to watch this, but all I'm getting is a broken Quicktime link.

Eden | January 12, 20:26 CET

Sorry, not even the hawtness of Eliza Dushku could get me to watch one more minute of anything with Tom Lenk.

tinktanker | January 12, 20:27 CET

Wow...that was great...and horribly, horribly cruel. In a good way, I suppose.

C'mon, man...Joss' Buffy S8 comics had better damn well arrive soon...

UnpluggedCrazy | January 12, 21:12 CET

I love fan-made attempts at credits. This one was done very well (the contrast was a little low but it still looked great). It makes me miss the real deal. I kinda' wish that fans looking for continuations of the Buffyverse would take the route that Star Wars fans took: original fan videos. I know I would tune in and/or pitch in for a fan-crafted series based in the Buffyverse. We all know that neither Buffy nor Angel are going to grace our television screens with new episodes ever again, and even though I love would/could-have-been opening credits, sometimes it feels like dwelling. I would love to see fan-created episodes of a fan-created show based in the Buffyverse.

Eason | January 12, 21:27 CET

I'm heartbroken all over again about Angel's cancellation. Oh, the denied possibilities!

phlebotinin | January 12, 21:35 CET

That is so cool. And it hurts to imagine what could have been. But I think it looks really professional.

[ edited by Razor on 2006-01-12 20:50 ]

Razor | January 12, 22:49 CET

Can't see it either... When I click on the "click here to play" area, it looks like a Quicktime video is downloading and after a while it goes into a broken link...

So, +1 here for the "how can I watch it?" question :-)

grimma | January 12, 22:51 CET

For all of you having problems accessing the vid, make sure you have the lastest updates for Quicktime. Just a suggestion, mind you.

anindoorkitty | January 12, 23:10 CET

Here's a direct download.

Download Here.

SpikeBad | January 12, 23:40 CET

I'm @ work, so haven't watched it yet, but I'm way excited! Angel is my favorite show ever, and it drives me crazy that they canceled it. I've been toying with the idea of writing an Angel story and sending to Joss, has anybody else had any ideas like that? Maybe inspire him to think about a movie or something. Something that brings the whole gang back, I'm talking Buffy and the scoobies and team Angel.

Ama-40000 | January 13, 00:01 CET

Ok, want more Angel. NOW. I must rewatch NFA. Beautiful work for fan work. Sometimes having all 5 seasons isn't enough. Damn I'm greedy, but hell, I admit I want more. One more season would have been wonderful.

Danica | January 13, 00:18 CET

Help! I'm all non-computey. I need to see this but my mans' puter doesn't have Quicktime and he doesn't want to download it (it's broken down too many times!). Can anyone post a download that I can watch in Media player? Please and thank you!

Faith in the Angel credits? I GOTTA see this!

lone fashionable wolf | January 13, 00:31 CET

That was great. I don't get the whole Gwen thing myself, but the rest was super. Yeah Tom Lenk!!!

Miss Edith | January 13, 01:55 CET

I reaally want a new season of Angel. *sad face*

Lunakitty | January 13, 02:40 CET

I think all this renewed sadness and heartbreak is because we are seeing the opening credits straight after that dramatic final scene. It's like reopening a favourite old book you have read many times before, turning to the final page and for the first time seeing To Be Continued ....

It's torture, but in a good way!

WhedonTrivia | January 13, 02:49 CET

tinktanker: agreed. There was that tiny stretch of episodes in Season 7, from "Never Leave Me" to around "Dirty Girls," where Andrew worked for me as a character (and as a henchman, but we'll get into that another time). And to be perfectly fair to Tom Lenk, because I'm about to say why I never want to see Andrew again, "Storyteller" is a fun watch specifically because it centers so much around Andrew and his deluded fantasy life where he's the hero of the tale--and Lenk's bravura performance is what makes it so neat.

But Andrew's last episode should have been "Chosen." His "Why didn't I die?" opened up what I thought could have been a fascinating avenue for the character in terms of metaphysical exploration, and grappling with a series of difficult questions like that could have provided him with a transition into a more adult frame of mind. I knew he'd come back, and I was hoping he'd come back matured, and a little darker.

It was sad to see Andrew coming back for two episodes on Angel...well...pretty much the same as he had been on Buffy, with none of those possibilities realized. Maybe he had a little more spine, maybe he was better with the ladies (maybe attracted to the ladies for the first time, that is), but he was basically the same annoying yutz he'd always been. I cringed during most of his time on "Damage," which was otherwise an excellent episode, and thought that his "The Girl In Question" appearance was scarcely better. Better to leave him at the beginning of an unrealized, unportrayed journey than bring him back for another round of "Laugh at the Geek."

As for Andrew as a full-time cast member on Angel? Stevie Sunshine in the Subterranean Shadow Realm? DOES THE PERSON WHO MADE THIS HAVE ANY IDEA HOW OUT OF PLACE HE WOULD BE? It would be like taking a Teletubby and sticking it in The Exorcist!

BAFfler | January 13, 03:26 CET

BAFfler - that's a great post. Particularly agree with your insight that Andrew should have made more of a journey between "Chosen" and "Damage."

SoddingNancyTribe | January 13, 03:33 CET

I'd have to agree that, at first appearance, Andrew would have seemed totally out of place on the show. Y'know what though? So did Wesley when he first joined the team. It took a season or two for him to really find his feet alongside Angel but he turned out okay.

Agreed on the issue of missed opportunity for character change in Andrew after "Chosen" however. There should have been more done with that.

WhedonTrivia | January 13, 04:05 CET

Agree with BAFfler, and that teletubby comment was too funny. My Andrew dislike is well documented, but it wasn't only that that bothered me about him being on Angel. It was the whole, "Well, that was who we could get" thing.

His insertion into Angel was even harder to take after hearing that.

Er... that entire last sentence went to a place that is all kinds of bad...ew.

Willowy | January 13, 05:08 CET

No, no, Willowy! Don't retract it! We're already in too deep!

=D

BAFfler | January 13, 05:15 CET

SpikeBad --

Thanks!

But dang! now I've got something in my eye.

And my other eye....

filops | January 13, 06:22 CET

Vampire With a Gun...while it's a good point about Wesley, I would like to add that his evolution started a great deal faster than Andrew's likely would have. By his fourth episode as a member of the Angel cast ("I've Got You Under My Skin"), he was moving away from comic relief to having serious dramatic moments. Remember his taking the lead in an exorcism...his oblique reference to his father that he quickly washes over...his admitted distrust of Angel, and the moment they have once Angel tells him that's as it should be...

Now I grant you that Wesley didn't seriously start getting heavy amounts of dramatic moments until Angel fired him in Season 2, at which point he was far more free to show his expertise in the field, and develop a buddy relationship with Gunn--and add the slightest hint of a rugged edge to his polished drawing-room exterior. Even so, the Wesley by mid-Season 1 of Angel is already starting to develop into a character with dramatic potential, and it's only been a matter of episodes (for him) since he was lying on a stretcher moaning about needing a little something for the pain (it's quite a lot of pain, actually), or maybe he could just be knocked unconscious...

Andrew? Develop like that? Geek just didn't have it in him.

BAFfler | January 13, 07:50 CET

I like having Gwen back as a regular. After Cordy went into her coma, the show really needed another female character. Not Faith though. In MY fantasy she's in that spinoff of her own - with Robin Wood, along.

I wish we could have seen Kate after her epiphany. I want to know where she went with her life after she realized that the PTB had interceded for her, and stopped with the Angel-hate.

barboo | January 13, 10:11 CET

I loved Andrew's appearances on Angel, and like seeing him in the Season 6 credits. I definitely loved his "people change" moment in "The Girl in Question". He showed that he does have the potential to grow and was on his way. But ultimately, I didn't have a problem with him continuing to be comic relief. Not everyone on Angel needs to become dark and brooding.

[ edited by jam2 on 2006-01-13 08:46 ]

jam2 | January 13, 10:46 CET

The video choked me up big time, but Tom Lenk was completely out of place. They should have put Oz in there instead. And maybe Nina.

Really, Lenk would just be a pale substitute for Lorne.

I miss Angel :(

cowmuf | January 13, 14:57 CET

BAFfler, i don't know. I think it's very hard to say where they might have taken Andrew if they had used him as a regular on the show. Truthfully, how many of us could have predicted that the Wes we saw in Graduation Day could become the guy we were watching by the halfway point of season 3 of Angel.

And, as you said, Wesley's change began fairly rapidly, through the last half of the first season. Given the fact that so many of the fans had written the character off after his appearance on Buffy i don't think it's beyond the realm of possibility that things could have turned around for Andrew too.

I think my main reason for believing this is that the change of opinion had already started for me. I really didn't like the fact that Andrew took up so much of the time in the final season of Buffy. It seemed wrong to dedicate so much energy to this new guy when the originals were getting so little attention. I thought "Storyteller" was a great episode, in itself anyway, but i'd much rather they had taken the time to make a really good character based episode for Xander. The closest we got was "First Date" and ... well, need i say anymore?

So, as you can tell, i really wasn't an Andrew fan in season seven of Buffy. Nothing against the actor or even the character, i suppose, just against the fact he was taking episode time from the core Scoobies at a point where they deserved the spotlight.

But his appearances in Angel, particularly in "Damage", changed my opinion a great deal. They were already attempting to add to his character by making him a member of the Watchers Council. His attitude was (slightly) more mature and he was developing a backbone, even if that backbone was supported by a small army of slayers.

So there was the possibility that, given good writing and enough time to grow, Andrew could have become a valued member of Angel's team. I certainly think the ME writers have the ability to make any character interesting.

With the possible exception of Miss Kittyfantastico. Nobody ever wrote her well!

WhedonTrivia | January 13, 16:26 CET

F'rintance, the nonidentical letters in Alexa's name all come earlier in the alphabet than the corresponding ones in Eliza's.

barboo | January 13, 23:30 CET